The Squad

Livvie

Executive Manager being kept sane only by her madn
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Jun 5, 2000
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We're weaker than we have been in years, and the injuries are piling up.

Do players go out and perform to their best ability - mentally as well as physically - whilst aware that the onus is on them to do the job and if they don't, they are failing the team because there is no-one else to come in.

Players are used to the pressure of fighting for their place, knowing that there is someone else waiting to take it - but this is almost a different kind of pressure. Now they have to perform knowing that there isn't anyone sitting on he bench who can really do the job.

This must surely be worse than the pressure of competition?

Also, the fear of injury, which would add to the weakness of the squad might also play a part. Do they pull out of a tackle, or not go in as hard as they might, aware either consciously or subconsciously, that another injury would create more problems for the team.
 
I agree with you Livvie.

The squad as a whole is weaker than it could be because we have signed three players for huge monetary sums instead of maybe 8 or nine players for the same financial outlay.

But then again, it only looks weak because of the injuries we have. I think we have seven players that have needed to go under the knife this season, as well as other players out with not so serious injuries, so instead of having players like Ferdinand, Butt, Scholes, Keane, Brown, RVN, Solskjaer (at times) available (even on the bench) we have had to play makeshift teams such as yesterday with Phil Neville playing in midfield and Ole and Forlan playing up front.

If we had played yesterday with:

-------------------- Barthez ---------------------

--- GNev ----- Rio ----------- Blanc ---- Silv ---

--- Bex ---- Keane -------- Scholes ---- Giggs ---

------------- RVN ---------- Solskjaer -----------

and could choose between the following players on the bench:

Butt
Verón
O'Shea
Brown
PNev
Forlan

then we wouldn't look so weak.

With all of these injuries, it's obvious that the players cannot gell properly together, as they need to consistently play with each other time after time to gain understanding and consistency.

It's a bit like the defence last season, how many different combinations of players were tried?

It's frustrating, but nothing to worry about, as with a fully fit squad we are far from weak.
 
Originally posted by WeasteDevil:
<strong>I agree with you Livvie.

The squad as a whole is weaker than it could be because we have signed three players for huge monetary sums instead of maybe 8 or nine players for the same financial outlay.

But then again, it only looks weak because of the injuries we have. I think we have seven players that have needed to go under the knife this season, as well as other players out with not so serious injuries, so instead of having players like Ferdinand, Butt, Scholes, Keane, Brown, RVN, Solskjaer (at times) available (even on the bench) we have had to play makeshift teams such as yesterday with Phil Neville playing in midfield and Ole and Forlan playing up front.

If we had played yesterday with:

</strong><hr></blockquote>

Good point, with the injured players back, which shudn't be that long, the squad looks good.
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But do you think fear of failure or injury is affecting the players?

No-one wants to be subbed, or dropped, but at least they know they can fight for their place - at the moment they must feel that it starts and ends with them.
 
Originally posted by Livvie20:
<strong>But do you think fear of failure or injury is affecting the players?</strong><hr></blockquote>

Yes, and the lack of competition isn't good either. It's a lot of responsibility the fit players have to carry. It's sure to take its toll.

And that git Adrian Durham was spouting off yesterday on TalkSport that SAF was talking bollocks when he said the European trip and injuries were part of the blame for the draw. Of course it is, it's not easy to land in Manchester at 5:30 in the morning Thursday and then get ready for a match Saturday afternoon when you have so many injuries. We cannot rest the players in the EPL to play them in the CL and vice-versa. Thank god we don't really have to play full out in the last two CL games.
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Originally posted by WeasteDevil:
<strong>

Yes, and the lack of competition isn't good either. It's a lot of responsibility the fit players have to carry. It's sure to take its toll.

And that git Adrian Durham was spouting off yesterday on TalkSport that SAF was talking bollocks when he said the European trip and injuries were part of the blame for the draw. Of course it is, it's not easy to land in Manchester at 5:30 in the morning Thursday and then get ready for a match Saturday afternoon when you have so many injuries. We cannot rest the players in the EPL to play them in the CL and vice-versa. Thank god we don't really have to play full out in the last two CL games.</strong><hr></blockquote>

nah.. i think we were very unlucky to not have won against Villa. Although they were tired we saw a lot of movement and a lot of opportunities gone... we need that finishing touch back...

it was a 4-4-2 last night and we looked capable even with so many players out - i was please to see that Becks still has it at crossing from the side!
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Originally posted by WeasteDevil:
<strong>

Yes, and the lack of competition isn't good either. It's a lot of responsibility the fit players have to carry. It's sure to take its toll.

And that git Adrian Durham was spouting off yesterday on TalkSport that SAF was talking bollocks when he said the European trip and injuries were part of the blame for the draw. Of course it is, it's not easy to land in Manchester at 5:30 in the morning Thursday and then get ready for a match Saturday afternoon when you have so many injuries. We cannot rest the players in the EPL to play them in the CL and vice-versa. Thank god we don't really have to play full out in the last two CL games.</strong><hr></blockquote>


Then wy didn't they spend the night in greece and fly back thurs morning, that would be the logical thing to do. It's not often I agree with Adrian Durham but in this case I totally agree, they are professional athletes they should be up for it.

Same with henry crying about being tired last week, still played saturday. These are not excuses for poor performances.

Scousers were in Moscow of all places and manged to come back and win.
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we didn't play well yesterday..but that's mainly due to the fact that we're suffering from injuries... Keane and Ruud are our best two players, Nicky Butt's another solid player, who's tailor made for the PL, Ri's just cameback from injury.. thats the the spine of the team!! any side would suffer if they lost their spine...in addition giggs was missing.. so its plain to see, injuries didn't help.. other problems such as playing after a CL game..i think Weastey touched up on the point that we play badly after a European game... which is true, but its not just us..other teams:- Arsenal lost, Liverpool weren't brilliant, Real madrid drew at home to Villareal, Milan lost to Chievo and Bayern drew at home to Hannover(?) which proves that all the big teams suffered from a European hangover... taking all this in, i can understand why we performed badly..and can give the team the benefit of the doubt..........


......Howvever, even with our best team out, we've struggled at home!
 
Originally posted by giggzy:
<strong>we didn't play well yesterday..but that's mainly due to the fact that we're suffering from injuries... Keane and Ruud are our best two players, Nicky Butt's another solid player, who's tailor made for the PL, Ri's just cameback from injury.. thats the the spine of the team!! any side would suffer if they lost their spine...in addition giggs was missing.. so its plain to see, injuries didn't help.. other problems such as playing after a CL game..i think Weastey touched up on the point that we play badly after a European game... which is true, but its not just us..other teams:- Arsenal lost, Liverpool weren't brilliant, Real madrid drew at home to Villareal, Milan lost to Chievo and Bayern drew at home to Hannover(?) which proves that all the big teams suffered from a European hangover... taking all this in, i can understand why we performed badly..and can give the team the benefit of the doubt..........


......Howvever, even with our best team out, we've struggled at home!</strong><hr></blockquote>

MILAN LOST TO CHIEVO?!!!!

Damn... I had 2 bob on them beating Bayern and Chievo, 10-1.
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Originally posted by Livvie20:
<strong>But do you think fear of failure or injury is affecting the players?

No-one wants to be subbed, or dropped, but at least they know they can fight for their place - at the moment they must feel that it starts and ends with them.</strong><hr></blockquote>

No I don't think the competition for place is the main reason for that. But squad depth is definitely a weakness for us at this moment. In the past three years the number of players left was more than the number we got, and there was also very, very few young players coming thru from the reserve. That's why I always think we should get a few bargain buys rather than spending all our money on one big signing striker in the coming January.
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I'd agree with that as well. Either we give the young players a decent run out and let them show if they are good enough or buy a couple of decent players with something to prove (£1-5million price range) We could have bough a whole defence for the money paid for Rio and then when he's injured we only have JOS (who I'd rather see playing than Larry). We dont seem to have the hunger or the drive when Keano's not there and even though we have the English/Argentinian/ex French and Welsh captains there doesn't seem to be a leader on the pitch. <img src="graemlins/smirk.gif" border="0" alt="[Smirk]" />
 
Originally posted by jraby:
<strong>


Then wy didn't they spend the night in greece and fly back thurs morning, that would be the logical thing to do. It's not often I agree with Adrian Durham but in this case I totally agree, they are professional athletes they should be up for it.

Same with henry crying about being tired last week, still played saturday. These are not excuses for poor performances.

Scousers were in Moscow of all places and manged to come back and win.</strong><hr></blockquote>

Not that the trip is an excuse, but I'm sure travel has some effect on the players.
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Originally posted by thumper:
<strong>I'd agree with that as well. Either we give the young players a decent run out and let them show if they are good enough or buy a couple of decent players with something to prove (£1-5million price range) We could have bough a whole defence for the money paid for Rio and then when he's injured we only have JOS (who I'd rather see playing than Larry). We dont seem to have the hunger or the drive when Keano's not there and even though we have the English/Argentinian/ex French and Welsh captains there doesn't seem to be a leader on the pitch. <img src="graemlins/smirk.gif" border="0" alt="[Smirk]" /> </strong><hr></blockquote>

Like we had against Sunderland. I think basically the problem comes down to the lack of strikers. The defence is as good as the Bruce - Pallister days. The midfield should be stronger than ever. But, we don't have strikers we used to have. Say what you like about Andy Cole, but he was one the greatest strikers to play for United. Sheringham was also a big loss. Unfortunately, Yorke eventually left with no replacement coming into the squad. We are basically counting two guys to handle the job these days.
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Even one of the newspapers said yesterday that travelling is affecting United at the moment because it's the same pool of players being called upon all the time.
 
Originally posted by Livvie20:
<strong>Even one of the newspapers said yesterday that travelling is affecting United at the moment because it's the same pool of players being called upon all the time.</strong><hr></blockquote>

Exactly!
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Injuries are part and parcel in football. Yes i agree we were very unfortunate but that is why you need to have a good strenght of depth, something that we dont.

Let me explain

LB currently we dont have a decent cover to Silvestre. P Nev is not up to it and we all know it.

CB I confess that I am not Blanc's no 1 fan, but during the last games he had showed incredible weaknesses in his play showing that time had finally cought him up. He is not half as good as Stam and his covers( O Shea and W Brown ) still need more experience before they can claim a regular place near Rio.

RW Can any one tell me who can cover Beckham?? Veron and scholes are no wingers while Luke Chadwick is not at Manutd's ( or EPL) level.

STK Fergies major headache. There is NO Cover to RVN, solyskear is more lethal as a 45min player and Forlan is very very far from becoming a first teamer. We lack of creativity and the facts show that the 4-4-1-1 formation is not working at all.
Scholes and Giggs are Midfielders and not Forwards and this will surely lead us into buying at least a player up front.
 
Originally posted by devilish:
<strong>
.

STK Fergies major headache. There is NO Cover to RVN, solyskear is more lethal as a 45min player .</strong><hr></blockquote>

<img src="graemlins/yawn.gif" border="0" alt="[Yawn]" />

Did you say this a couple of season's ago, when we had no other strikers available and he kept us in the title race by himself?

Did you say it against Bolton last year when he scored a hat-trick? Or against Ipswich, Charlton Athletic, Derby, or Leeds, games in which he scored twice. Or against Chelsea, Lille, Southampton, Leicester, Boavisata.....or in teams where he didn't score but created, thus getting into the Opta team of the season.

Say he's under-achieving this year by all means, which he is. But any United supporter who follows the team will know the facts, and not just the stupid myths they latch on to.

Any genuine United supporter.
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Originally posted by Livvie20:
<strong>


Say he's under-achieving this year by all means, which he is. .</strong><hr></blockquote>

many players are!

altho we should reserve our judgment until we get all our players back..
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I love Solsykear. Hes more lethal than RVN and more committed than anyone in the team( Keano included)

You took me wrong my friend. I havent said that I dont think that OGS is not good enough as a first teamer, just that he is more lethal when coming out in the second half.

Solyskear ability to read the game on the bench and then expoilt our rival's weaknesses once he is playing had been our little secret to the treble. We should use it this trick because that wat makes OGS unique
 
Giggsy Football is not criket or golf. You will always have injuries and you will never have a full squad

Yes I agree Manutd had been unfortunate, But remember that Arsenal had Pires, Henry and Lyunberg out and yet they still won the league.
Strenght of depth is the secret for winning and that is what we are lacking
 
Originally posted by devilish:
<strong>Giggsy Football is not criket or golf. You will always have injuries and you will never have a full squad

Yes I agree Manutd had been unfortunate, But remember that Arsenal had Pires, Henry and Lyunberg out and yet they still won the league.
Strenght of depth is the secret for winning and that is what we are lacking</strong><hr></blockquote>


er.. we've lost the spine of our team.... keane, RVN, giggs, butt and Rio(even tho he's back) can't be replaced.
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Adams, Lyunberg, Pires and Henry Are Arsenal' spine.

Mind you i agree that we were unfortunate.

But stess that we do not have the strenght in depth needed
 
Originally posted by devilish:
<strong>Adams, Lyunberg, Pires and Henry Are Arsenal' spine.

Mind you i agree that we were unfortunate.

But stess that we do not have the strenght in depth needed</strong><hr></blockquote>

you a gunner?
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Ohh god I thought i was talking about serious football

OF COARSE I AM NOT GUNNAR!!!!!


I just used Arsenal as a perfect example of strenght in depth.

Let me take Real Madrid then ( if you prefar)

you never hear them complain about injuries because they have good cover for any player.

As stated this is the secret for success
 
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