Snide tackles and surrounding the ref.

Adisa

likes to take afvanadva wothowi doubt
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We are starting to see a lot of our players foul as soon as the other team gets an opportunity to counter. We are also seeing our players sorround the ref a lot more.
I have to say, I am enjoying it. For too long our players have been soft.
 
I hate it. I hate that's its become part of the game and is so widely praised. You actually hear commentators saying "that was a good foul".

I also hate that I am often happy when my team does it.
 
duffer said:
I hate it. I hate that's its become part of the game and is so widely praised. You actually hear commentators saying "that was a good foul".

I also hate that I am often happy when my team does it.
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:lol:

It's an art perfected by Mourinho's Chelsea.
 
We've been woeful at the cynical fouls for far too long - allowing teams to break and score against us on the counter. Glad to see us incorporating that into our game now.
 
I have never heard of any foul decried as much as the one preventing a counter. I don't recall this ire for Stoke and co kicking teams (who had the arrogance to try and play football) blue and black
 
Adisa said:
We are starting to see a lot of our players foul as soon as the other team gets an opportunity to counter. We are also seeing our players sorround the ref a lot more.
I have to say, I am enjoying it. For too long our players have been soft.
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I'm sorry, but I have to totally disagree with this.

I referee ten year olds and sometimes you get one who has been watching PL and they try to argue with me. IT IS WRONG and it is wrong that their role models and heroes behave in this way so they think it is Ok to copy them.

Football can't learn much from Rugby, commercially, financially etc. but the way referees are treated in Rugby, compared to Football is different league.

P.S. and this all started to get really bad under Sir Alex Ferguson at Man United. I was opposed to his knighthood on several grounds, but that was the main one - his constant hounding of the referees and getting his players to do likewise is fundamentally wrong and against good sportsmanship.
 
Yes, we have got tougher and more aggressive in our play. If we could just turn this play into goals, I would think we could win trophies and get into top 4. A top CF in January would also help.
 
duffer said:
I hate it. I hate that's its become part of the game and is so widely praised. You actually hear commentators saying "that was a good foul".

I also hate that I am often happy when my team does it.
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I bet you fist pumped at that Jorginho foul on Elanga!
 
Annihilate Now! said:
I bet you fist pumped at that Jorginho foul on Elanga!
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And vice versa for Shaw tripping up Azpi on a break!

I don't really blame the players, they know the rules and are happy to take a yellow.

That's why I think those fouls should be straight reds. If there's clearly and absolutely no intention to play the ball, send 'em off.
 
When a team like City do it they're a bunch of cheating cnuts , now we're starting to do it and, "it's about time." One thing I love about the caf is the double standards. I am in favour of the cynical fouls in the right moments or standing over the ball to stop quick free kicks being taken. Can't stand it when other teams do it though. :)
 
Forevergiggs1 said:
When a team like City do it they're a bunch of cheating cnuts , now we're starting to do it and, "it's about time." One thing I love about the caf is the double standards. I am in favour of the cynical fouls in the right moments or standing over the ball to stop quick free kicks being taken. Can't stand it when other teams do it though. :)
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Well if they get away with it we may as well try our hand at it!
 
It’s crap and anti-football but on the other hand it’s nice to us finally catching up with the modern game
 
duffer said:
And vice versa for Shaw tripping up Azpi on a break!

I don't really blame the players, they know the rules and are happy to take a yellow.

That's why I think those fouls should be straight reds. If there's clearly and absolutely no intention to play the ball, send 'em off.
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Any time Luke Shaw is a massive knobber on the pitch I find it a cause for celebration.

I think clear red becomes a bit harsh for what is something cynical but not dangerous (especially when you're asking our refs to just what is and isn't deliberate) ... A sin bin of some sort would probably work better
 
duffer said:
I hate it. I hate that's its become part of the game and is so widely praised. You actually hear commentators saying "that was a good foul".

I also hate that I am often happy when my team does it.
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This! :lol:
 
duffer said:
And vice versa for Shaw tripping up Azpi on a break!

I don't really blame the players, they know the rules and are happy to take a yellow.

That's why I think those fouls should be straight reds. If there's clearly and absolutely no intention to play the ball, send 'em off.
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I agree but I'd imagine that the meta would become far more defensive because of this change.
 
Tigersam said:
I'm sorry, but I have to totally disagree with this.

I referee ten year olds and sometimes you get one who has been watching PL and they try to argue with me. IT IS WRONG and it is wrong that their role models and heroes behave in this way so they think it is Ok to copy them.

Tigersam said:
I'm sorry, but I have to totally disagree with this.

I referee ten year olds and sometimes you get one who has been watching PL and they try to argue with me. IT IS WRONG and it is wrong that their role models and heroes behave in this way so they think it is Ok to copy them.

Football can't learn much from Rugby, commercially, financially etc. but the way referees are treated in Rugby, compared to Football is different league.

P.S. and this all started to get really bad under Sir Alex
Tigersam said:
I'm sorry, but I have to totally disagree with this.

I referee ten year olds and sometimes you get one who has been watching PL and they try to argue with me. IT IS WRONG and it is wrong that their role models and heroes behave in this way so they think it is Ok to copy them.

Football can't learn much from Rugby, commercially, financially etc. but the way referees are treated in Rugby, compared to Football is different league.

P.S. and this all started to get really bad under Sir Alex Ferguson at Man United. I was opposed to his knighthood on several grounds, but that was the main one - his constant hounding of the referees and getting his players to do likewise is fundamentally wrong and against good sportsmanship.
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Ferguson at Man United. I was opposed to his knighthood on several grounds, but that was the main one - his constant hounding of the referees and getting his players to do likewise is fundamentally wrong and against good sportsmanship.
Click to expand...
can't learn much from Rugby, commercially, financially etc. but the way referees are treated in Rugby, compared to Football is different league.

P.S. and this all started to get really bad under Sir Alex Ferguson at Man United. I was opposed to his knighthood on several grounds, but that was the main one - his constant hounding of the referees and getting his players to do likewise is fundamentally wrong and against good sportsmanship.
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I hate this comparison to rugby and the way referees are treated whilst continuously ignoring the fact that the players are more than happy to smash 7 bells of shite out of each other through what would only ever be described as an assault anywhere else in the world. Oh, look, he just smashed him in the face with a forearm but it’s ok because he ‘yes, sir’ to the referee!!

It’s not comparable to football but the treatment of the referees in football would be easily sorted if the referees sorted in and dished out the punishments at the time. Immediately. It would take one week of an entire getting booked for ‘dissent’ and then it wouldn’t happen anywhere near as much but the referees don’t do it

The problem in football is the complete lack of accountability for any referee when it could be much better if they just have a system that allows for the correct calls to be made more often than not. Yes, the game might become slower initially with an abundance of teething problems but not ones that couldn’t eradicated fairly quickly.

Football is still in the dark ages when it comes to decision making and it makes the game worse.
 
I hate it, but then seeing City get away with it for a better part of a decade and the Spanish teams doing it for twice a long as that then you kind of adopt the attitude "if you can't beat them, join them" - it would have been much better of refs stopped cynical fouling in its infancy of course, as it is im glad we're finally getting better at the dark arts.
 
Adisa said:
We are starting to see a lot of our players foul as soon as the other team gets an opportunity to counter. We are also seeing our players sorround the ref a lot more.
I have to say, I am enjoying it. For too long our players have been soft.
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100% agree, I absolutely LOVE it!

Tigersam said:
P.S. and this all started to get really bad under Sir Alex Ferguson at Man United. I was opposed to his knighthood on several grounds, but that was the main one - his constant hounding of the referees and getting his players to do likewise is fundamentally wrong and against good sportsmanship.
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:lol: :lol:
 
It's a really important part of a game we've been missing for a long period. When you are engaged so high at the pitch and the opponent bypasses your press, it gives you a crucial time to retain shape and positions.

You can hate it as long as you want but it is essential to do that kind of work to win a game. Regardless of how much football developed as a game, you still need a "street smart" players to win you a game, so having players like Martinez, Antony, Casemiro and Bruno is very good for this team.
 
I think I hate the play acting far more. Azpilicueta rolling around the floor like his foot had been hacked off several times last night. Bruno does it as well from time to time.
 
duffer said:
I hate it. I hate that's its become part of the game and is so widely praised. You actually hear commentators saying "that was a good foul".

I also hate that I am often happy when my team does it.
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While I agree, if it's not stamped out by referees then you're stupid not to join them.

Under Ole we tried to play like good little angels and got caught on the counter far too often.

Look at the Jorginho tackle at the end of the game, he was never going to get Elanga so he hacked him down with an ankle tap.

Would you trade a goal for a yellow card? every time.

For me the only evolution in football is an orange card with a sin bin applied. That would have been the perfect example for it's use. It was worse than a yellow but not enough to change the game with a red.
 
duffer said:
I hate it. I hate that's its become part of the game and is so widely praised. You actually hear commentators saying "that was a good foul".

I also hate that I am often happy when my team does it.
Click to expand...
 
I remember Rooney trying it once and totally fecked it up and got a red card :lol:

I dont like it overall, but given its happening (and kinda allowed), you would be naive not to do the same.
 
Sylar said:
I remember Rooney trying it once and totally fecked it up and got a red card :lol:

I dont like it overall, but given its happening (and kinda allowed), you would be naive not to do the same.
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I'm not so sure about that, imagine if a team respected the referee - they might get a dubious last minute penalty as a thank you! But VAR would overrule it these days anyway, Ha.
 
Tigersam said:
I'm not so sure about that, imagine if a team respected the referee - they might get a dubious last minute penalty as a thank you! But VAR would overrule it these days anyway, Ha.
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Probably get a lot of 50/50s or corners instead of goal kicks etc

I don't think the refs are sinister btw. Just inept which is worse
 
If the soul purpose of the tackle is to take out the player and not the ball then a next game ban should be the penalty for it, not just a yellow card which doesn't really bother the players. But next game ban will make them think twice before they commit the foul.
 
Sylar said:
I remember Rooney trying it once and totally fecked it up and got a red card :lol:

I dont like it overall, but given its happening (and kinda allowed), you would be naive not to do the same.
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Shades of Ollie v Newcastle! Cheered to the rafters taking the long walk to the tunnel! Not many dissenters in the crowd that day!
 
I love seeing a smart foul. That's a huge part of the game.

What they need to do is distribute yellows for anyone who dives. Put some danger into the equation for acting like a cnut.
 
bazza3727 said:
Shades of Ollie v Newcastle! Cheered to the rafters taking the long walk to the tunnel! Not many dissenters in the crowd that day!
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I didn't dissent despite how horrible it was :lol: we were pushing for that win but I guess the draw was better than the loss, though funnily enough I think a few more steps he catches him
 
Boondog said:
I love seeing a smart foul. That's a huge part of the game.

What they need to do is distribute yellows for anyone who dives. Put some danger into the equation for acting like a cnut.
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A smart dive is a huge part of the game as well.
 
I was thinking of starting a thread about it. Our team is super c*nt-ish, the boys from South America have bought this edge I believe. I remember Casemiro not giving the ball back against Omonia away. You got Antony celebrating our equaliser against Chelsea.

 
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Adisa said:
We are starting to see a lot of our players foul as soon as the other team gets an opportunity to counter. We are also seeing our players sorround the ref a lot more.
I have to say, I am enjoying it. For too long our players have been soft.
Click to expand...
It’s about time we adopted the school of Fernandinho fouling.
 
yumtum said:
I hate it, but then seeing City get away with it for a better part of a decade and the Spanish teams doing it for twice a long as that then you kind of adopt the attitude "if you can't beat them, join them" - it would have been much better of refs stopped cynical fouling in its infancy of course, as it is im glad we're finally getting better at the dark arts.
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I agree with this. I would love to see it out of the game. But, if it's not then we have to do it also to compete. I also don't think it needs to be a straight red card to stop it. Just needs the Ref to be brave and give a yellow every time he sees it. Fernandinho used to do it 4 times in the first half and get nothing but a foul for the first 3 and then a verbal warning after the 4th. Then in the 85th minute they might finally give out a yellow. The refs just need to give a yellow every single time it happens and the worst would soon Start receiving reds and would stop the practice. But, the refs don't have the courage for that, so I agree that we have to join in. But, it's a shame because fast breaks are among the most enjoyable and entertaining plays to watch.
 
duffer said:
I hate it. I hate that's its become part of the game and is so widely praised. You actually hear commentators saying "that was a good foul".

I also hate that I am often happy when my team does it.
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Jokes aside, you talk about it like its a new thing, but its not really. SAF's treble winners did it, and the Italians have been doing it for decades.
 
To compete for the league we have to become more savvy in this respect. Footballs often won in the details and done right a team that rotates cynical fouls to limit threat and slow momentum can have a big impact in both a single match and over the course of the season.

I do think it's a shit part of the game though. City have really perfected it and combined with their possession, opposing teams barely get chance to have a crack on goal.

Some refs deal with it by giving random yellow cards to undeserving players/fouls to punish a team but its not an effective deterrent at all. I do think there might need to be some sort of punishment/deterrent for collective fouling.

What we need is some sort of 2nd penalty spot 50 yards from goal whenever a team makes 4 fouls. 1 on 1 with keeper 90 WC style or maybe a free shot on goal but the keeper has to start outside the box (either side, not in front) and race their way to cover their net. Each foul adds risk to the offending team, and presents new opportunities to the opposition to draw fouls. White text.

You could even have the penalty spot move 5 yards closer to the goal with every foul that they make. That's probably going a little too far though.
 
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