Seba: Sven better than Fergie ....

Jens

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I hate the bloody tabloids.

<a href="http://www.thesun.co.uk/article/0,,3-2002230373,00.html" target="_blank">http://www.thesun.co.uk/article/0,,3-2002230373,00.html</a>

Veron: Sven better than Fergie
By DAVE KIDD

JUAN VERON believes Sven Goran Eriksson is a better manager than Alex Ferguson.


The Manchester United midfielder makes his stunning claim in an amazing new biography of Eriksson - serialised in The Sun this week.

Veron reveals he prefers the England coach's calm approach to the "strong words" of his Old Trafford boss Fergie.

The Argentina ace, who played for the Swede at Sampdoria and Lazio, said: "Eriksson is the same person in the dressing room as outside.

"Ferguson will challenge the team with strong words, which is not Eriksson's way.

"For me, the best coach is the one who is best at building his relationship with his players, so they feel at ease and supported.



ERIKSSON ... calm approach


"You need more than just a coach, you also need a friend, to perform to the best of your ability. There aren't many like that but it is the mark of Eriksson."

Eriksson brought Veron to Sampdoria from Boca Juniors in 1996. And, three years later, the pair linked up at Lazio where they won the club's first title in 26 years.

Veron, who cost United £28.1million, added: "Eriksson was very important to me - almost like a father figure when I first came to Europe.

"I had to live on my own for the first time.

"Sven was a big help during that period. For the first six months, he protected me.

"I wasn't having a good time on the field and he provided a calmness for me."



FERGUSON ... challenge


The book also claims Veron and Eriksson were almost reunited at Old Trafford.

The biography says "United did want Eriksson and shadowy, yet substantial contact was made through third-party agencies".

Eriksson, it is alleged, was "definitely interested and at one stage United were confident they had their man."

The book suggests the move was scuppered when Fergie decided to cancel his retirement on hearing of the move to appoint Eriksson.
 
This is not going to go down well...

Anyways, anyone think Seba probably thought his old manager would be at the helm at OT and was shocked that Fergie said he would stay on?

After all, it was Sven who was influential in Seba's move. At that time, I had a sneaky feeling that he was getting His United team in place.
 
Originally posted by Marcus:
<strong>This is not going to go down well...

Anyways, anyone think Seba probably thought his old manager would be at the helm at OT and was shocked that Fergie said he would stay on?

After all, it was Sven who was influential in Seba's move. At that time, I had a sneaky feeling that he was getting His United team in place.</strong><hr></blockquote>

Seba is happy at United and has a good relationship with the manager who kept so much faith in him... it's the tabloids who are trying to stir up all this shit.
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The man is allowed his opinion. I'm sure Giggsy or Beckham would say the same about Sir Alex.

But, I think the record speaks for itself.
 
Seba has a preference for a certain style of management. Fair enough. Ofcource, that style of sentence just doesn't sell tabloids, does it?

As if he would talk to the Sun.
 
I remember Scholes saying the same thing about Kevin Keegan a few years ago. Perceptive words <img src="graemlins/lol.gif" border="0" alt="[Laugh Out Loud]" />
 
Point is here, that Veron is being quoted. This story is carried on the BBC website too. Why even say something like that? It's hardly alleviating the situation is it? In fact it encourages the tabloids to ghet more mileage out of the Veron isn't happy story. Surely it's Veron's job to curb such speculation not fuel it?
 
Originally posted by Dans:
<strong>Point is here, that Veron is being quoted. This story is carried on the BBC website too. Why even say something like that? It's hardly alleviating the situation is it? In fact it encourages the tabloids to ghet more mileage out of the Veron isn't happy story. Surely it's Veron's job to curb such speculation not fuel it?</strong><hr></blockquote>


DO we smell the "frankness" of Stam in the air??
ANd a similar end
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This is what I was thinking, although it isn't quite as revealing or critical as Stam apparently was.
 
Originally posted by Dans:
<strong>Point is here, that Veron is being quoted. This story is carried on the BBC website too. Why even say something like that? It's hardly alleviating the situation is it? In fact it encourages the tabloids to ghet more mileage out of the Veron isn't happy story. Surely it's Veron's job to curb such speculation not fuel it?</strong><hr></blockquote>

Where is he being quoted as saying Sven is better than SAF? He praises Sven but the comparison is made by the journalist and are not Verons direct words. Nothing to do with who is the better manager, just what style he prefers.
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Originally posted by AhmedDimwitson:
<strong>Where is he being quoted as saying Sven is better than SAF? He praises Sven but the comparison is made by the journalist and are not Verons direct words. Nothing to do with who is the better manager, just what style he prefers.</strong><hr></blockquote>Egggzackery!
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Originally posted by Dans:
<strong>Point is here, that Veron is being quoted. This story is carried on the BBC website too. Why even say something like that? It's hardly alleviating the situation is it? In fact it encourages the tabloids to ghet more mileage out of the Veron isn't happy story. Surely it's Veron's job to curb such speculation not fuel it?</strong><hr></blockquote>

He's got the right to say whatever he wants just like any human being does. It's not his fault there are people, who ahead of an England-Argentina clash especially, wish to cause as many problems as possible.

I suppose they are dreaming Fergie would call Veron and have a go at him, lowering his confidence and ruining his world cup.

Well sorry, I like the England national team, but I hope Seba teaches them a footballing lesson.
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Originally posted by Amir:
<strong>

He's got the right to say whatever he wants just like any human being does.</strong><hr></blockquote>

Like Stam did?
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Personally I think that similarly to Stam this was very ill advised and stupid. Its probably true that he prefers that type of manager, and he's already bonded with Sven from a couple of previous clubs, he says he is his father figure. The irony is that of all managers it is Alex that is most known for being a father figure for his players and building a relationship with them. I feel that if Sven had come to the club then we'd have got the best out of Veron, but I don't see Alex managing to do so because they are chalk and cheese, Veron is just not his sort of player, nor is Alex Veron's sort of manager. I doubt he'd be sold on the basis of these comments, more his crap performance this season - but Alex has defended him so strongly that I can't see that happen.
 
Originally posted by AhmedDimwitson:
<strong>

Where is he being quoted as saying Sven is better than SAF? He praises Sven but the comparison is made by the journalist and are not Verons direct words. Nothing to do with who is the better manager, just what style he prefers.</strong><hr></blockquote>

<a href="http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport3/worldcup2002/hi/team_pages/england/newsid_1999000/1999466.stm" target="_blank">Here is where he is being quoted</a>
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Originally posted by Dans:
<strong>

<a href="http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport3/worldcup2002/hi/team_pages/england/newsid_1999000/1999466.stm" target="_blank">Here is where he is being quoted</a></strong><hr></blockquote>

"For me, the best coach is the one who is best at building his relationship with his players, so they feel at ease and supported"

The bbc web site had conveniently cut the FOR ME part in the bold text. He says he prefers it this way, he does not say who is the best coach. There are different ways to reach the target which are equally as good as long as you reach it, Juan prefers a "softer" style.
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Originally posted by sebaveron:
<strong>dumbass tabloids always twist things and stir things up!!!!
:mad: </strong><hr></blockquote>

Can you clear this up for us then? Tell us what you really said Jonny.
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He's off to Barca I reckon..

Tho I hope he stays to provide the ammunition for his fellow South American success..

;)
 
He's blown it now. You don't cross Fergie like that !
 
what a load of crap. this is typical bad journalism. book about sven -- marketed to the press as having "something controversial" in it... sports editor tells journalist to go find whatever he can that will make a back page story.... so complimentary words about sven by veron are taken out of context and used to "add spice" to the tabloid-driven crap already out there about veron at OT.

It reminds me of my days when i was working for a news wire. in the run-up to Y2K, which journalists tried hard to turn into a big panic story, every single reporter from my news wire (bridge news, later taken over by reuters) was told to file two stories per month on Y2K -- ie, in order to generate a big story as the millennium turnover approached. i was covering utilities (yawn), so the way i was told to "make a story" was to ring up a company and ask if they had preparations for the Millennium date change. If the company said "yes, we've invested $100m to make sure we're prepared for a breakdown in the computers", I'd write the story with a big headline like "BRITISH GAS SAYS WELL PREPARED FOR MELTDOWN".

if the company said "yeah, we've done a bit, but we're not really convinced much will happen", then the story would be "BRITISH GAS IGNORES Y2K THREAT", etc, etc.

It is all complete and utter crap.
 
Bearing all that in mind though mancred, wouldn't you say it would have been a better idea not to speak to the press full stop, and if he really had to do so, to speak of Eriksson only and not pass any comment on SAF at all. If anything I think Veron is being a little naive.
 
Originally posted by Jens:
<strong>I hate the bloody tabloids.

</strong><hr></blockquote>

Me too ! I'm sure this interview has been distorted, once more ! I don't know where it comes from, but whenever I read an interview in the French press, then translated by a tabloid, it makes me angry...(the best example : "Beckham is not good", by Figo, this is not what he had said). But the worst is that after all the media, even the serious, BBC, Guardian etc... use the false interview
Another thing : I know that the tabloïds pay someone just to read the foreign press and pick what concerns foreign players playing in England...
:rolleyes:

So I don't take seriously this interview.
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Originally posted by Dans:
<strong>

Like Stam did?</strong><hr></blockquote>

Stam crossed his manager and his team mates by revealing inside information he shouldn't have. Seba merely spoke his mind on an issue he was asked (I believe it's a quote from a book about Eriksson). There's nothing in it.
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Well, let's not re-open the Stam debate. I think none of us knows what actually went on in that case. My point was more that both spoke frankly.
 
Originally posted by Dans:
<strong>Bearing all that in mind though mancred, wouldn't you say it would have been a better idea not to speak to the press full stop, and if he really had to do so, to speak of Eriksson only and not pass any comment on SAF at all. If anything I think Veron is being a little naive.</strong><hr></blockquote>


Yes, but its all down to the interview. Someone comes to Seba and says they'd like to ask questions about Sven. he agrees. says all these great things about sven. then the interviewer says "How does Sven's management style contrast with ferguson's?" Seba has a big grin and says, "well, ferguson's not that calm sometimes, but he's a great manager in his own way. some players need to have a firm talking to. I'm one of the players who responds better to sven's kind of management -- and Fergie knows this, and we have a good relationship."

Good journalist concerned with an honest story, repeats the whole quotation. Sun journalist says "AH! Bingo." and the story comes out as "I respond better to sven's management than fergie's" "Fergie is not calm, like Sven, my mentor was", etc, etc.

Seba and the journalist both know he hasn't dissed ferguson. but the reader is left with a totally different picture. its dishonest.

Ok, maybe Seba was naive to fall for the trap. possibly it wasn't a trap at all -- ie, the interview was done by the author of the book (which is probably authorised, and therefore has to be positive about SGE), and the author wasn't so crass with his words. I'm sure if it had actually been an interview with the sun, he would have been on his guard a bit more.


That's the other thing that is deceptive. from the headline and splash backpage in the sun, one would assume Seba had been sitting in a press conference, fresh from training with argentina, talking about how crap fergie is. But its only when you read further that you discover that his words come from a book, that the interview probably took place months ago, etc, etc.

shame on the BBC for regurgitating it!
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by the way, from the picture used on the BBC website (very old, from the press conference when he signed), it looks like Seba was on the sun bed a bit last summer.
 
Originally posted by JSV:
<strong>He hasn't crossed him at all...</strong><hr></blockquote>

No, but he's bad-mouthed him. And that's usually enough
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Originally posted by blythy:
<strong>

No, but he's bad-mouthed him. And that's usually enough</strong><hr></blockquote>

bad-mouthed? show me quotes where he bad-mouths fergie ...
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I've done some media work and I know how to sculpt a reader's opinion without them knowing - that is a very good example of it and the Sun are very good at this 'trick'- which EVERY journalist practices, even students know how to do it.

This is how the media is used to control people, by controlling how they see the world and more importantly how they FEEL about it. Its the difference between being a hero and being a terrorist depending on how the journo feels like presenting it.

I cant believe the Sun hates us so much that they turned a serialisation for Sven's book into a continued swipe at Veron+Ferguson. Wankers. Dont pay attention.
 
Seems like an attempt - 'defence in advance' to forestall any action to sue following the 'bust up' story! Got as much basis too. Since when did quotes (inverted commas) make anything true?
 
Is he making an excuse for his poor form or is he trying to buy his ticket out of Manchester like Stam. Every one knows never <img src="graemlins/nono.gif" border="0" alt="[No No]" /> cross the boss. But what I'm looking forward to is to see how the boss would react :confused: <img src="confused.gif" border="0">
 
Hope I'm right. I see this as very much a non-story.

Journalist asks for opinion on Sven "Like a father figure", "protected me when I first arrived in Europe", etc tec. What's he like as a manager? blah blah blah.
Ten minutes and several issues later "What's Fergie like?" not "Who's better?".

What is also important to remember is that Lazio signed Seb as an unknown 20(?) year old, United signed him as easily the most expensive player in Britain, star player of one of the leading national sides in the world and of a top European club side. Fergie could not treat him the same way because he was a star not some unknown hopeful.

On Seb's constant references to Lazio I will say this. I like it when ex United players fondly remember their time at OT. Some are guest panellists on SKY and are expected to be biased towards United. It is natural. I don't think Seb has been critical of United. (I might be wrong because we don't get the same coverage in Australia). The quotes I read seem to be "I am happy at United and intend seeing out my contract but I love the adoration I received at Lazio" (Think Keano, Beckham, Giggs etc). I think he is loyal to those that he has been involved with (like the panellists) and after a successful few years here he will talk about the great times at United. Unlike Paul Ince but that's another story.
 
Originally posted by Cantona07:
<strong>Is he making an excuse for his poor form or is he trying to buy his ticket out of Manchester like Stam. Every one knows never <img src="graemlins/nono.gif" border="0" alt="[No No]" /> cross the boss. But what I'm looking forward to is to see how the boss would react :confused: :confused: </strong><hr></blockquote> <img src="graemlins/houllier.gif" border="0" alt="[Houllier]" />

Do you actually read the words? Or do you just follow with the tabloid flock and believe everything they say?

Kinell, no wonder journalists in the UK make so much dosh when they have you lot buying the rags. <img src="graemlins/smirk.gif" border="0" alt="[Smirk]" />
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Another Seba Storm in a Teacup engineered by the tabloid press.

I don`t think Veron was implying anything or being snide about or badmouthing Sir Alex - he was making an honest point about Sven`s style compared to Sir Alex`s style.

Many Manchester United players have been quoted one time or another talking about Sir Alex`s style and not necessarily liking it.

And surprise, surprise, Argentina are in England`s World Cup group, etc, etc. In fact the Seba Saga engineered by the tabloids is becoming unbelievably dull. Yawn ad nauseum. :o :o :o :o :o :o :o
 
Nice to see that the majority of you have seen this story for the manipulative twist of words it realy is.

The interview was conducted for a book about his friend and mentor Sven Goran Eriksson and not in the context of Veron spilling his soul to a dirty tabloid rag.

In the same paper there is also the 'Exclusive' of United moving for Anelka which contains no quotes from the player, no quotes from Fergie, Peter Kenyon, or any OT spokesperson. In fact, the only quotes in the article are taken from the LIverpool press release announcing the thinking behind Anelka's release.

Go figure.
 
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