Russian invasion of Ukraine | Fewer tweets, more discussion

This might turn into a huge proxy conflict. Hopefully this isn't true.

 
VorZakone said:
This might turn into a huge proxy conflict. Hopefully this isn't true.

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We can blame a lot of things on the US for Iraq, Afghanistan and Libya, but hiring foreign militias to fight (possibly) unconventional warfare on a theater of operations that is not the country of origin of those militias is a no-no.

What do Geneva Conventions say on that?
 
It is a wild guess, but I do believe that the arms are already in Ukraine. It makes no sense to leak this info beforehand which will help the enemy adjust its tactics. All I can say is that yesterday NATO looked hopeless, today things are looking better, and as the time goes on the support will grow. Putler was hoping to win it in 48 hours but horribly miscalculated everything it seems.
 
Classical Mechanic said:
Posters were supposing the idea.
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ah, okay. Never going to happen. at least not war against NATO members. It'll be interesting to see how he treats the non NATO countries at his border, though. Surely if he decided to attack Finland and Sweden, there'd be full scale war, no matter them not being NATO, right?
 
I'm probably way behind on this one, but when and why did Kyiv conventionally start being called that (in English) instead of Kiev?
 
Charlie Foley said:
I reckon a lot of the people saying it don’t think they would ever be the ones fighting
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I am currently reading (well, I was until yesterday) All quiet on the western front. I was thinking that I'd probably be first to desert minutes after deployment.
 
MTF said:
I'm probably way behind on this one, but when and why did Kyiv conventionally start being called that (in English) instead of Kiev?
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As I recall it coincided with them being recognized internationally as an independent state, so quite a while ago.
 
VorZakone said:
Any French speaking fellas who can summarize? Is the video about the dad leaving his daughter fake?


https://www.lemonde.fr/les-decodeur...e-ukrainien-a-sa-famille_6115245_4355770.html
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The relevant bit (at the end, after a long introduction describing the impact of the video) is this:
[C]ette séquence n’illustre pas le départ d’un père ukrainien rejoignant l’armée après l’invasion russe. Comme l’ont signalé plusieurs internautes, cette vidéo est antérieure à l’invasion russe survenue le 24 février. Et le contexte, bien différent.

Elle a été postée trois jours avant, le 21 février, sur la chaîne Telegram du maire de la ville prorusse de Gorlovka, Ivan Prikhodko. La ville est située dans le Donbass, à 40 kilomètres de Donetsk. Le 21 février, Vladimir Poutine, avant de décider d’envahir le pays, a reconnu l’indépendance des républiques séparatistes de Donetsk et Louhansk. A la suite de cette décision, des milliers de civils ont été évacués de ces territoires vers la Russie dans des campements de fortune, et des hommes de la région ont reçu l’ordre de rejoindre les troupes séparatistes. C’est dans ce contexte précisément qu’ont été filmés ces adieux.

Le maire de Gorlovka décrit la scène ainsi : « Aujourd’hui, nous avons assisté aux touchants adieux d’un chef de famille à sa femme et sa fille en Russie. » Et d’ajouter :

« L’homme, qui est resté dans la ville pour défendre la république [séparatiste de Donetsk] armes à la main, a accompagné, les larmes aux yeux, sa famille en Russie dans l’espoir de prochaines retrouvailles et d’une paix durable et éternelle qui s’établirait sur le pays du Donbass ! »
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To save me some time, this is how Deepl translates that:
[T]his footage does not illustrate the departure of a Ukrainian father to join the army after the Russian invasion. As several Internet users have pointed out, this video predates the Russian invasion on February 24. And the context, quite different.

It was posted three days before, on February 21, on the Telegram channel of the mayor of the pro-Russian city of Gorlovka, Ivan Prikhodko. The city is located in the Donbass, 40 kilometers from Donetsk. On February 21, Vladimir Putin, before deciding to invade the country, recognized the independence of the separatist republics of Donetsk and Luhansk. Following this decision, thousands of civilians were evacuated from these territories to Russia in makeshift camps, and local men were ordered to join the separatist troops. It is precisely in this context that these farewells were filmed.

The mayor of Gorlovka describes the scene as follows: "Today we witnessed the touching farewell of a family head to his wife and daughter in Russia." And adds:

"The man, who remained in the city to defend the [separatist Donetsk] republic with weapons in hand, accompanied, with tears in his eyes, his family to Russia in the hope of the next reunion and a lasting and eternal peace that would be established over the country of Donbass!"
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So this is a dad from the Donbass that was ordered by Russia to join separatist troops, and therefore had to say goodbye to his wife and daughter in the refugee camp in Russia to which he had been evacuated.
 
Paxi said:
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I doubt it has anything to do with appealling to the people of Ukraine. You can't full on invade and blow up a reasonably stable country and then try to spin it as being the good guys. It's probably more to do with controlling the anger of the Russian public and outside world in general. Particularly with Western media spinning the propaganda the other way and willing to use any footage they can to aid them. Russia can't afford a revolt from anyone not already against them.

The whole thing is a mess. The Ukrainian Prime Minister openly encouraging civilians to take on an army of tanks with a few rifles and Molotov cocktails is completely bonkers. I don't want to sound in anyway pro starting a war/massacre which is what Putin has done, but if we were taking military action in a foreign country that would straight up be used to show that it's because the country is being run by a madman.
 
MTF said:
I'm probably way behind on this one, but when and why did Kyiv conventionally start being called that (in English) instead of Kiev?
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Not sure when it happened but I remember Ukraine wanted the rest of the world to call it Kyiv because it's the Ukrainian name for the city. Kiev is the Russian version. Both are correct I suppose but giving the current events it might be more appropriate to call it Kyiv from now on.
 
MTF said:
I'm probably way behind on this one, but when and why did Kyiv conventionally start being called that (in English) instead of Kiev?
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BarstoolProphet said:
Not sure when it happened but I remember Ukraine wanted the rest of the world to call it Kyiv because it's the Ukrainian name for the city. Kiev is the Russian version. Both are correct I suppose but giving the current events it might be more appropriate to call it Kyiv from now on.
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Technically I think it's official name is going to be Kiev again pretty soon...
 
golden_blunder said:
No offence meant fella, I didn’t realise that you were on national service. I just read in your original post that you enrolled. I’m playing catch-up reading the rest
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No offense taken. I blame the language barrier if enrolled is the wrong term when used in the context of mandatory service. Which I’m not against by the way. I didn’t hate it when I was in my mandatory year, and I don’t hate it now that I’m training 5-6 days a year. I’m just not an “army guy”, and totally not ready for war. At all. I understand I have to defend my country when called upon, but I’m scared as feck just thinking about it. And it surprises me how many in here seem not so scared (though I believe they would be if they thought it was even a tiny chance they have to fight themselves, not just call for everybody else to fight for them).
 
The Taliban are calling for a peaceful resolution to the conflict in Ukraine



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VorZakone said:
Any French speaking fellas who can summarize? Is the video about the dad leaving his daughter fake?


https://www.lemonde.fr/les-decodeur...e-ukrainien-a-sa-famille_6115245_4355770.html
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Basically the video has been shared as a girl leaving for the west as her father stays to defend Ukraine against the invasion.

But the video is from February 21, it was shared by the Mayor of Horlivka, and according to that shows a girl about to leave for a makeshift camp in Russia while her father, answering the call to joint the pro Russian separatist troops in the region, says goodbye.
 
Skåre Willoch said:
No offense taken. I blame the language barrier if enrolled is the wrong term when used in the context of mandatory service. Which I’m not against by the way. I didn’t hate it when I was in my mandatory year, and I don’t hate it now that I’m training 5-6 days a year. I’m just not an “army guy”, and totally not ready for war. At all. I understand I have to defend my country when called upon, but I’m scared as feck just thinking about it. And it surprises me how many in here seem not so scared (though I believe they would be if they thought it was even a tiny chance they have to fight themselves, not just call for everybody else to fight for them).
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I grew up in a country where soldiers used to walk around with guns out, or they’d be scoping people as they walked about their business. It’s scary shit. And I’ve been shot before, it hurts and it’s not something I’d want to go through again. So trust me, I understand your fears.
 
bosnian_red said:
You have to understand the viewpoint of the side being invaded though. Coming from a country who was attacked. For years. You feel abandoned by the rest of the world as they watch you get slaughtered and it essentially turned into a situation where an entirely avoidable genocide happened, with the rest just sitting idly by. And only then when it was too late did they step in and stop it. Its about not abandoning Ukraine the same way Bosnia was abandoned for much of the 90s. That's why you see so many calling for NATO to step in, because they are practically the only ones who can properly step in before things descend into true horror for them.

Sure, I get all the risks with it as well. I get that nobody wants to invite WW3. I get that nobody wants to incite a nuclear war. Nobody wants to go to war in the first place... But in the process, you sacrifice a country of 45 million people to fall to Putin, and then hope that's all he wanted so he stops. Coming from a country that was abandoned and under siege for 4 years, I don't think I can ever support that point of view of essentially sacrificing Ukraine and not stepping in. Of course, there are a million things that can be done and should be done before it comes to stepping in with their military to attempt to calm the situation. But thats my thought process at least. I get it, but I don't necessarily like it or agree with it.

Nobody wants war, but war is here, and from there you have to take steps to stop it before they get out of hand, not sit back and wait for atrocities to happen.
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That was nice to hear, mate, real nice.
 
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Mike Smalling said:
Heartwarming how the Poles and Romanians are welcoming the refugees. Small bright spot in this mess.
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There was a lot of info, numbers etc. on the social media today (Moldova). People inviting refuges to stay with them. Even people who were driving to and from the borders to pick the refuges up. It's really heart warming.
 
What a world we live in when you’re getting statements like that from the fecking Taliban. We truly do need some kind of massive reset. Everything is so broken.
 
Dr. Dwayne said:
As I recall it coincided with them being recognized internationally as an independent state, so quite a while ago.
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Water Melon said:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/KyivNotKiev
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BarstoolProphet said:
Not sure when it happened but I remember Ukraine wanted the rest of the world to call it Kyiv because it's the Ukrainian name for the city. Kiev is the Russian version. Both are correct I suppose but giving the current events it might be more appropriate to call it Kyiv from now on.
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Thank you, gents. I grew up in Brazil so all of my life I've been saying it with an aggressive 'E', as we're fond of our Es in Portuguese. Guess I'll be updating my pronunciation.
 
sun_tzu said:
Technically I think it's official name is going to be Kiev again pretty soon...
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I hope not. It looks like it will drag on and countries will continue to supply arms for Ukranians. NATO countries border on Ukraine, so supply of arms will go uninterrupted. And should Putler feck with those, their troops will be combat ready.
 
Mihai said:
There was a lot of info, numbers etc. on the social media today (Moldova). People inviting refuges to stay with them. Even people who were driving to and from the borders to pick the refuges up. It's really heart warming.
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That is lovely.

I saw a post on Instagram about polish vets at the border to help people crossing with their pets. Now I’m doubly sad thinking about all the animals caught up in this too
 
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