Not that I believe a word these sick fecks say.
Russian invasion of Ukraine | Fewer tweets, more discussion
- Thread starter Wednesday at Stoke
- Start date
Yea, they have been "withdrawing" for weeks now. A week or so ago he mentioned that Wagner will cease to exist soon with the casualty rate they are having, maybe the time has finally come because there is no way 100+ deaths each day only on Bakhmut front is sustainable in any way.
Translated statement:
In my opinion, there are 2 possible reasons for this announcement:
1. Prigozhin's last try to blackmail the Russian military to get better equipment.
His forces were the only ones advancing since last summer. The capture of Soledar and 80% of Bakhmut are the only advances worth mentioning on the russian side (we ignore the losses here), so he can be cocky about it. If he feels he has leverage with Putin, because his Wagners are the only competent force Russia has, he can behave as he did in the last couple of weeks, insult and ridicule the highest Russian militairs without consequences. If they begin to fear his withdrawal, they will give him what he wants by his logic.
2. Putin ordered Wagner's role in Ukraine to be reduced.
Maybe Putin doesn't like the way Wagner operates, maybe he fears their growing strength and influence. Maybe he wants the Bakhmut battle to be finished by Russian military rather then by illegal mercenaries to be able to sell it to his people. Maybe he needs them gone, if he ever wants to start talking with the west again. Maybe he remembered, that mercenary organizations are still illegal in Russia (lol). That he dismissed some higher militairs because of their connection to Wagner and Wagner's starvation of ammo and equipment supports that theory.
In this case, Prigozhin decided to blame Gerassimow and Shoigu rather than Putin of course, because Putin is the only one he truly fears.
--
In any case, this is pretty big. If Prigozhin officially announces to withdraw from Bakhmut, then I don't see how he will change his mind easily. Also I don't think the Russian military will start to supply him with everything he asks for. Then they would open themselves to further blackmail.
1. Prigozhin's last try to blackmail the Russian military to get better equipment.
His forces were the only ones advancing since last summer. The capture of Soledar and 80% of Bakhmut are the only advances worth mentioning on the russian side (we ignore the losses here), so he can be cocky about it. If he feels he has leverage with Putin, because his Wagners are the only competent force Russia has, he can behave as he did in the last couple of weeks, insult and ridicule the highest Russian militairs without consequences. If they begin to fear his withdrawal, they will give him what he wants by his logic.
2. Putin ordered Wagner's role in Ukraine to be reduced.
Maybe Putin doesn't like the way Wagner operates, maybe he fears their growing strength and influence. Maybe he wants the Bakhmut battle to be finished by Russian military rather then by illegal mercenaries to be able to sell it to his people. Maybe he needs them gone, if he ever wants to start talking with the west again. Maybe he remembered, that mercenary organizations are still illegal in Russia (lol). That he dismissed some higher militairs because of their connection to Wagner and Wagner's starvation of ammo and equipment supports that theory.
In this case, Prigozhin decided to blame Gerassimow and Shoigu rather than Putin of course, because Putin is the only one he truly fears.
--
In any case, this is pretty big. If Prigozhin officially announces to withdraw from Bakhmut, then I don't see how he will change his mind easily. Also I don't think the Russian military will start to supply him with everything he asks for. Then they would open themselves to further blackmail.
Last edited:
Looks like the first successful interception of the Kinzhal missile. If true, it would be huge.
Edit: @Ragnar123 beat to me to it.
I guess it's not really hypersonic.
As everything in Russia it’s all fake, to Putin it was probably sold as hypersonic by MoD since it wasn’t meant to be put to a real test anyway.
The most diplomatic "chat shit...get banged" ever caught on camera?
I'm just surprised that Russian guy even felt the need to do that. How stupid.
From his point of view it was a fast way to get in good graces with his higher-ups.
Russia is getting weaker by the day. As soon as Ukraine's active counteroffensive phase starts, the shit will hit the fan and they will start blaming each other. The preconditions couldn't be better for Ukraine right now.
Putin probably is now really wondering how many of his nukes could lift, and of those how many would detonate instead of just fizzling.
"They've got the ornithologists involved" 
One of the funniest rants I've seen so far.
One of the funniest rants I've seen so far.
"They've got the ornithologists involved"
One of the funniest rants I've seen so far.
It is, but one has to keep in mind what that actually means. Reaching a speed higher than Mach 5, that's it. Kinzhal is operating close to this lower boundary and therefore similar to the German V2, that's now 80 years old.
Yes, the speed is a problem for most systems, but this is exactly what Patriot is designed to intercept.
For ballistic missiles those are normal speeds but that thing is supposed to be cruise , is it not? I haven't really read into the newer Russian systems and their claims.
"They've got the ornithologists involved"
One of the funniest rants I've seen so far.
"Have you got any brains at all?" - said a guy proudly wearing his CCCP sweatshirt in a TV show notoriously known for spouting all sort of ridiculous nonsense every day.
No, it is simply an air lauched ballistic missile
He handled this situation pretty well.
"They've got the ornithologists involved"
One of the funniest rants I've seen so far.
It's incredible how literal he tries to emulate Solovyov.
Was hearing about drones over Moscow. Kiev denying it. The US denying it is as Kiev. Even seen a video of Zelenskyy saying “we only fight on our territory”
Just curious but why can’t ukraine fight on Russia territory. I don’t want this to happen . But it seems to have been set as a moral line that Ukraine can’t/shouldn’t cross. But why ?
Just curious but why can’t ukraine fight on Russia territory. I don’t want this to happen . But it seems to have been set as a moral line that Ukraine can’t/shouldn’t cross. But why ?
I think it would be extremely beneficial for Ukraine if any sabotage / incident in Russia is viewed as an internal Russian struggle. Even if it's just to make Russians themselves believe that there is the possibility of an internal opposition.
Putin rules Russia by might and force. Whoever takes any bit of power from him is going to need to use the same.
They can and they do. But denying it means every single incident in Russia causes more unrest because they can never be sure if it's an internal issue, or if it's an attack.
It's also pretty clear that it is expected that Ukraine does this. Germany's Minister of defence recently said quite directly that it would be completely legit and expected if Ukraine perform attacks on Russian soil to cripple Russia's attacking potential.
It's more than likely that it's NATO that is setting this line, not Ukraine.
Attacking Russian territory would be seen as an escalation. NATO are willing to supply Ukraine for a defensive war and to retake their territory, but aren't prepared to fund potential escalation and risk Putin going for the nuclear option.
They probably are attacking Russia's supply and infrastructure, but it won't be acknowledged publicly. It'll be "wink wink, nudge nudge" to NATO.
I'm going with the theory (just cos I want to) that it's part of Putin's preparations for the counter-offensive. He wants to keep his pal Prigozhin on side so given him an excuse to get out before he/wagner gets crushed while setting Shoigu etc up to catake the fall for everythinig.
Just like the Iskander-M it has some in flight guidence capabilities so maybe semi-ballistic would be the best description but like you say it's definitely not a cruise missile.
Prigozhin is still on it. I don't know, seems to be genuinely pissed off? Or is some 4D chess move.
Putin must be enjoying the competitive handbags between his underlings - each competing for his approval at at time when Putin badly needs the support of his apparatus to safeguard his own life.
Well the good thing for him is, that Gerassimov, Shoigu and Prigozhin get all the blame. Putin isn't mentioned once in their dispute. But I'm pretty sure, that such an important decision to starve Wagner of ammunition and equipment was approved by him and Prigozhin knows this too of course. Further it's interesting to see, that Prigozhin openly admits of huge losses. Something the Kremlin hides, or tries to hide since the beginning of the war.
I'm curious to see, how long Putin will allow such outbursts. Prigozhin will eventually hit the limit, where his threat to Kremlin's order exceeds his usefulness.
Last edited:
Yeah that make sense. If Putin had any concerns that Prigozhin was getting too powerful, the easiest way to marginalize him is to make him look like a loser by starving Wagner for ammo. Naturally, doing that will also mean he has to deal with losing Bakhmut, which will have a massive effect on Ukrainian morale before their counteroffensive.
Sure, a defensive organization poses the threat, not the imperialistic regime that wages the worst european war since ww2.
Deny them all european help and money. They must not see even a cent from european and western banks anymore, until the Hungarians vote those corrupt and Russian bought fecks out.
Last edited:
Good point. Didn’t think about the psychological aspect. Although in the long run it is setting the frame in the publics mind that attacking on Russian soil is something Ukraine wouldn’t / shouldn’t do
Kremlin hides the regular army losses. I think to everyone in Russia mercs like Wagner are considered the lowest of the low and therefore expendable fodder.
Because more Russians would see the war as Russia under attack and justifiably defending themselves, and put patriotism first.
If the war is perceived in Russia as a foreign adventure with boys dying for nothing then more will be against it.
Ultimately, because its not feasible to fight on Russian territory. The Ukrainians have a very specific remit from NATO (the source of their weapons) that they don't use the weapons to attack Russian territory. They also have to deal with the fact that all their weapons and ammo are already needed to defend their cities sand villages. All of this plus what @711 said above.