The next time there is a murder in Manchester he should immediately be the first suspect.
Ruben Amorim - Manchester United Head Coach
- Thread starter sewey89
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) and Imran (@Annihilate Now!) are here to discuss Amad saving our blushes in a win against Southampton as well as our now annual loss at home to Brighton. They discuss Amorim's post-match comments, revisit how mid-table we may or may not be, and discuss some transfer news.
Our issue against Southampton/Brighton was not lack of effort. It was lack of quality, lack of progressive passers in midfield, lack of creativity from out wide. We barely got our ball to our forwards.
We have always done well against big teams when we have to sit back and counter, its always the breaking down the low blocks that posed problems. Because we lack technicians.
It's a man screaming, shouting, and breaking things in a room full of people. Were I in Amorim's position, I would be very surprised if nobody ever found out about it.
Just watch our games.
The amount of blocked/wide shots and blocked/overhit crosses is actually unbelievable.
Players not being able to place the ball has nothing to do with formation or tactics.
They are highly paid professional footballers who fail to execute BASIC stuff.
Amorim has nothing to do with that. He is here to provide tactical setup, train patterns and position them around the pitch.
They are not youth, they are not U15s, his job shouldn't be to teach them how to cross a fecking ball!!!
The amount of blocked/wide shots and blocked/overhit crosses is actually unbelievable.
Players not being able to place the ball has nothing to do with formation or tactics.
They are highly paid professional footballers who fail to execute BASIC stuff.
Amorim has nothing to do with that. He is here to provide tactical setup, train patterns and position them around the pitch.
They are not youth, they are not U15s, his job shouldn't be to teach them how to cross a fecking ball!!!
So we’re not technically good enough to beat Brighton but we are to give arsenal and Liverpool a game? That doesn’t sound like a technical issue, it sounds like a mental issue.
The performances are night and day, we played the big boys and controlled the game with possession and aggressive play. Against Brighton we looked scared and second to everything. That isn’t a technical issue, it’s fear of playing at Old Trafford.
Wow, some on here take as much liking to another failed manager as our rivals and the media do.
Before the appointment: "We need to give him time to sort out this mess"
RA: "We need time, there will be up and downs"
After 8 Weeks of up and downs: "He needs to adapt. never won anything of meaning."
Winner of this whole situation: A team who got yet another manager in trouble
Unbelievable ...
Before the appointment: "We need to give him time to sort out this mess"
RA: "We need time, there will be up and downs"
After 8 Weeks of up and downs: "He needs to adapt. never won anything of meaning."
Winner of this whole situation: A team who got yet another manager in trouble
Unbelievable ...
What happens at work stays at work right?
There's a big difference in the qualities/technique needed to beat Liverpool away vs Brighton at home.
We see it time and time again.
Maybe if you're working at Cashman Field or the Bellagio.
I think what people are concerning about is the lack of signs that he is cleaning up the mess rather than just tripping over it.
I am frustrated as well but no one said it will be a quick fix.
Brighton was a good game up until the individual errors cost us and they lost believe. It wasn't perfect but not a bad game at all.
What makes me angry is coming on here and reading deluded stuff like going back to a formation, which got other managers sacked also, just because this bunch of well paid primadonna are more comfortable with.
It's fair to point out that there's no quick fix, but surely you'd like to see signs of improvement? Indications that he'll get there if he has enough time.
I'm not sure that really happened. Up until and including Bournemouth, we at least produced good chances and lost matches to not finishing and individual errors in defense, now we don't even create much anymore. If anything, we're regressing in attack.
The regression in attack probably doesn't happen if we aren't playing fullbacks wide. Those wide roles need a winger - see how much better we are when Amad is on the right versus Mazraoui. Nous looked class playing on the right of the back three, but he's extremely frustrating as a wide player. Doesn't get up the pitch to provide width when we have the ball, and off it he slinks into "hold the line" mentality rather than stepping out to press.
But we haven't got anyone who can play on the left (we haven't really had anyone for over a year now), and Amad can't play on the right when he's needed behind the striker.
So basically, it's all Mason Mount's fault for being injured.
Bizarre part is I don't even dislike him
I think we've used him badly. He's a wildcard, a luxury player, whom you utilise in a specific role to open up tight games. You don't build a team around him or ask him to dictate the tempo.
He also shouldn't be captain. He works hard and he seems good with some of the players, but he's naturally unlikeable - and I think the relentless decisions going against us are in part because he's always in the face of the officials!
The thought did cross my mind. He must be kicking himself for leaving SCP. It hasn’t worked for them, us or him presently.
Some forget the dire performances which got ETH sacked.
We were not good enough in front of goal but I wouldn't say we created nothing. One shot on goal from ten attempts is terrible. Brighton had 3 on goal from 6...
So sometimes it is like this that you train new things you don't feel as free in other parts but I see progress.
One thing we really need to improve is that build up phase and that is only possible if the players start to be more comfortable on the ball.
Yea i dont think it sounds good at all
Only on the caf could Amorim cracking be deemed as some kind of hairdryer treatment win. When the club needs a cool head to guide us through the tough times he's having tantrums in the dressing room.
Its a completely different game. Playing counter attacking football is one of the easiest ways to play. It doesn't require high technicality and mistakes from the opposition lead to much better chances than if you are trying to break down a deep lying team. There is a reason that the smaller teams generally play on the break far more. Pacy players, balls over the top to them. Defend.
Dominating games is far harder to do and when you do it badly you are open to the former, ie. counter attacks. We have slow CBs and lack the technical players in key positions to play how Amorim wants. He needs to work out how we get to the end of the season without getting turned over far too often when he tries to actually play how he wants.
Maybe he's tried other managerial techniques, which haven't had the desired effect, and this is his latest one (or he lost the plot). He's been here a while so probably more confident he can use this technique - however quite risky as could backfire and lose dressing room. Time will tell.
He looks like he's thinking how much he can get the bloke down on the price
But shouldn't Ruben be at the till with jim stood behind him with his arms crossed and a look of " You broke it, you pay for it "!
I'm worried about him.
We didn't play counter attacking though. Did you watch the games?
How is it cracking? Fergie regularly 'cracked' if smashing a tv and flipping a table is 'cracking'.
We had possession and more of the ball because Liverpool didn't really counterpress us. I guess Slot was cautious, he didn't want us to hit the quickly on the counter.
Brighton just exploited every personal player error. They didn't "play us out of the park". They punished us.
And our players made infinitely more individual errors against Brighton than against Liverpool, which puts another huge question mark on their mentality.
Yep… SAF, Klopp and Pep all famous for dressing room meltdowns (they haven’t do too bad winning trophies)
Which is what I've been saying. It's a mentality issue. They play with fear and anxiety whenever they play a game they should be winning. When the pressure is off they show all the technical ability needed to win a game of football. You don't get to this level by being technically shit.
There is a mentality issue for some time, coupled with signing too many average players who don''t have the attributes to succeed in PL. From an aging CM who can barely run, to a diminutive defender who gets bossed in the air. I fear though there is something more fundamental in Amorim. I've been looking a lot at a back 3, Chelsea of only 3 teams to play in Champions League with that system and the only team to win with it. Its used only occasionally in the PL now the other big proponent is Ange. There is a good analysis in the Times about how teams now how to expose it (as perfectly demonstrated by Brighton where forwards drop deeper) and the big drawback is you sacrifice the midfield. I am feeling very nervous now that Amorim will be gone within the next 12 months at most, at which point we'll have saddled ourselves with wingbacks we dont need. Its a mess, and this is on INEOS.
Perhaps there's been an underestimation of sides around us. Mitoma really punished us and many sides have a few players that can hurt you and most that can match you physically. We've really come undone to so called lesser sides that we used to be beat.
We still concede early or concede after scoring, or opposition have three shots and it's three goals. There's big issues with mentality and concentration, so many errors in games that we had a chance to win or draw under Amorim. It's up to the manager to motivate the side as well for smaller games and get them to treat each game as a must win.
We still concede early or concede after scoring, or opposition have three shots and it's three goals. There's big issues with mentality and concentration, so many errors in games that we had a chance to win or draw under Amorim. It's up to the manager to motivate the side as well for smaller games and get them to treat each game as a must win.
Amorim has won trophies
If this was an out of control outburst that he regrets (as opposed to him being intentional and letting himself go as a tactical choice), then it's the sign of a man cracking under unexpectedly high amounts of pressure.
For his sake, I hope it's the latter, and that this is him rising to the occasion instead of succumbing to it.
Either way, I'm concerned about the effect it can have on some of the young players who carry unfair expectations they are simply not capable of meeting - Hojlund, Collyer, Garnacho, Mainoo, Yoro.
Onana, on the other hand, completely deserved it. Worst keeper we've had in a while, with so many disastrous lapses of concentration.
For his sake, I hope it's the latter, and that this is him rising to the occasion instead of succumbing to it.
Either way, I'm concerned about the effect it can have on some of the young players who carry unfair expectations they are simply not capable of meeting - Hojlund, Collyer, Garnacho, Mainoo, Yoro.
Onana, on the other hand, completely deserved it. Worst keeper we've had in a while, with so many disastrous lapses of concentration.
If players cannot handle the pressure and expectations of Manutd, they dont deserve to be here.
Garnacho is a player that wants to start every game - we are not a charity to give players starting minutes for experience.
Hojlund was signed for 72m to lead the line, there should be pressure, he is just not good enough.
I don't think anyone expected there to only be downs for the first two months, and for those downs to be so prominent and desperate. Even in the wildest scenarios no one had us playing this badly and I think people are right to be concerned about where things are headed.
I still like him and want him to stay btw, just pointing out that this is not something we've experienced before even in the last dreadful decade, even under ten Hag who was incredibly bad already.
Sure, but it's also true that we're setting them up to fail. Hojlund, Garnacho, Mainoo, Zirkzee, Amad and Yoro are all being forced to take more responsibility and get more exposed than they should be because many of our senior players are either not good enough anymore (Casemiro, Eriksen), are unprofessional (Rashford), or are constantly injured (Mount, Shaw).
I guess the honeymoon period is offically over
+ brains
It hasn't been only downs.
Since he's arrived we've knocked Arsenal out of the cup, beaten City, drew with Liverpool, beaten Everton/Southampton and had back to back wins in the EL. Those are all positives amidst the shit.