Ruben Amorim - Manchester United Head Coach

santeria13 said:
I'm just curious why you are so hard on amorim, not that you're particularly wrong, but with the context you were still adamantly defending ETH until the very end. It was clear for months we were going nowhere under him and a large part of our current situation is his fault.

One had 2 and a half years plus 500m to spend and the other came into a team in 14th and in free fall, with no pre season or transfer window. So why are you more harsh on the latter?
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I am defending Amorim on the aspects that matter - believing his system is going to be successful with the right players (as I used to with ten hag to be fair), and on his approach to management.

But he is failing to show pragmatism during transitional periods for the squad, almost running before they can walk. This is a mistake ten hag made too.

The money spent and signings I'm not getting into, I've always thought we wasted money under every coach and it's not manager specific but more structural. My hope is that is fixed for Amorim to be successful.
 
L1nk said:
Apparently Amorim got so angry he cried, not joking.
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Well I would cry too, after yelling at them and then suddenly you see players like Antony, Onana, Dalot etc looking back at you.
 
Another dressing room leak on this... I wonder who... was Rashford traveling in the squad and would he be in the dressing room? If not him then it's someone else
 
VP89 said:
I am defending Amorim on the aspects that matter - believing his system is going to be successful with the right players (as I used to with ten hag to be fair), and on his approach to management.

But he is failing to show pragmatism during transitional periods for the squad, almost running before they can walk. This is a mistake ten hag made too.

The money spent and signings I'm not getting into, I've always thought we wasted money under every coach and it's not manager specific but more structural. My hope is that is fixed for Amorim to be successful.
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So then is it your position that you disagree with Amorim's own position as per below?



Surely this is better logic. Why waste an entire year training players in a system that he is unfamiliar with, only to start from scratch next year?

Surely beginning 2025/26 season it is better to have six months of his new system under their belt, than none, and then hit the ground running? You must agree that a running start is superior to a stop start.

Even if he doesn't have all the right players now, don't you think it expedient that Amad, Mainoo, Yoro, Bruno, et al, all benefit from getting familiar with the system right this moment?
 
kkengvib said:
Another dressing room leak on this... I wonder who... was Rashford traveling in the squad and would he be in the dressing room? If not him then it's someone else
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It could be anyone, including Rashford whether he was there at the time or not. You'd have to be incredibly naive to think members of the squad who didn't travel wouldn't have found out about it - players talk to each other you know...

In saying that, there's absolutely no evidence that Rashford was the leaker and it's pointless to speculate given the wide net of possibilities.
 
VP89 said:
I'd rather he gave proper context behind it and acknowledged his inflexible approach to the system is contributing to it. He has a good set of players in a lot of areas but they aren't suited to his system.
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We have some good players but aren't very good from a physical point of view, too many slower, or weaker players (compared to other PL players).

It's pretty incredible that we've had two managers in a row now who either don't recognise this, or are choosing not to, and regularly exposing the players weaknesses with the highly physically demanding systems/formations they choose to use. This is usually in the form of being outnumbered in midfield, and the defence being exposed to foot races quite a bit when three of our better defenders aren't very quick.

That said, you can't play reasonably well against Liverpool and Arsenal and then get absolutely destroyed by Brighton playing the exact same system, that's unacceptable and on the players.
 
Hoof the ball said:
So then is it your position that you disagree with Amorim's own position as per below?



Surely this is better logic. Why waste an entire year training players in a system that he is unfamiliar with, only to start from scratch next year?

Surely beginning 2025/26 season it is better to have six months of his new system under their belt, than none, and then hit the ground running? You must agree that a running start is superior to a stop start.

Even if he doesn't have all the right players now, don't you think it expedient that Amad, Mainoo, Yoro, Bruno, et al, all benefit from getting familiar with the system right this moment?
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What's amazing is that you'll have many people that are conscious the squad is terrible, a mish mash of unsuited players for any style of play, that we've been mismanaged at senior exec level and at sporting level, that we need a drastc change, etc. And as soon as what they seem to intellectually recognise becomes reality, they will suddenly switch to a "yeah, but..." position.
 
I have been reading through all the drama - well most of the posts are so bad it's not even funny anymore. It's been said since day one that Amorim came with his tactics and it probably won't work from day 1 but the work starts to implement it through the team - also said from day one how we probably have to play with pure defenders on the wings, because on most cases it's safer to teach a defender the role we need on the wings rather than teach a winger, who hasn't played similar role before.

And then people saying how we should sack him, well go back to football manager or FIFA or whatever the kids play these days. Pep's first year was as tough at points with multiple defeats that made them look like mugs and they were proven "champions" team before he took over.

Klopp got plenty of beatings as well. And they had just had a championship run before him also.

And now us, a team which scraped a 8th place last season and was widely off the pace most of the games, you expect us to be better?
 
Hoof the ball said:
So then is it your position that you disagree with Amorim's own position as per below?



Surely this is better logic. Why waste an entire year training players in a system that he is unfamiliar with, only to start from scratch next year?

Surely beginning 2025/26 season it is better to have six months of his new system under their belt, than none, and then hit the ground running? You must agree that a running start is superior to a stop start.

Even if he doesn't have all the right players now, don't you think it expedient that Amad, Mainoo, Yoro, Bruno, et al, all benefit from getting familiar with the system right this moment?
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I think it's more that there aren't just two extremes of his style versus something else. Surely he can (and does) tweak his ideas depending on the opponent. He could keep the back 3 but play two up top with only Bruno behind, or push the tens wider to be wingers even if just a stop gap, he could risk 1 DM to get someone a bit higher up. I am just spitballing but there's a myriad of options in between his system and abandoning it completely.
 
SparcMac said:
I have been reading through all the drama - well most of the posts are so bad it's not even funny anymore. It's been said since day one that Amorim came with his tactics and it probably won't work from day 1 but the work starts to implement it through the team - also said from day one how we probably have to play with pure defenders on the wings, because on most cases it's safer to teach a defender the role we need on the wings rather than teach a winger, who hasn't played similar role before.

And then people saying how we should sack him, well go back to football manager or FIFA or whatever the kids play these days. Pep's first year was as tough at points with multiple defeats that made them look like mugs and they were proven "champions" team before he took over.

Klopp got plenty of beatings as well. And they had just had a championship run before him also.

And now us, a team which scraped a 8th place last season and was widely off the pace most of the games, you expect us to be better?
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Thats the issue. Team was going down in league finishes. Going down in performances. Going down in quality of players. After 10 years of mismanagement and with new owners, the only way forward was change (more or less dramatic). If you change so much in coach profile, that tell you that ownership is probably going to change as well in recruitment and player profile. Is it expectable to do this and keep competing for titles?
 
Hoof the ball said:
So then is it your position that you disagree with Amorim's own position as per below?



Surely this is better logic. Why waste an entire year training players in a system that he is unfamiliar with, only to start from scratch next year?

Surely beginning 2025/26 season it is better to have six months of his new system under their belt, than none, and then hit the ground running? You must agree that a running start is superior to a stop start.

Even if he doesn't have all the right players now, don't you think it expedient that Amad, Mainoo, Yoro, Bruno, et al, all benefit from getting familiar with the system right this moment?
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As I said I'm fine with the "risk a little bit" until it becomes clear that it's a detriment to the current squad this season. I'm not sure whether this is definitely the case or not because I'm not in trainings, but from the eye test it's a prolonged problem, and it's not risk a little bit. It's risk a feck ton.
 
tomaldinho1 said:
I think it's more that there aren't just two extremes of his style versus something else. Surely he can (and does) tweak his ideas depending on the opponent. He could keep the back 3 but play two up top with only Bruno behind, or push the tens wider to be wingers even if just a stop gap, he could risk 1 DM to get someone a bit higher up. I am just spitballing but there's a myriad of options in between his system and abandoning it completely.
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OK, but why would he push the tens wider when he's trying to teach the existing wide players to learn how to play inside? It's a teaching point. The lesson is more important than the short term outcome because the long term is the important thing. That's his point of contention with Garnacho. That when Garnacho plays he doesn't try to play the role assigned to him and that this means Dalot ends up filling the no 10 position instead, but then that causes havoc because Dalot will be out of position on defensive transition.

That and two tens holding wide would directly interfere with the wingbacks natural width.
 
Hoof the ball said:
OK, but why would he push the tens wider when he's trying to teach the existing wide players to learn how to play inside? It's a teaching point. The lesson is more important than the short term outcome because the long term is the important thing. That's his point of contention with Garnacho. That when Garnacho plays he doesn't try to play the role assigned to him and that this means Dalot ends up filling the no 10 position instead, but then that causes havoc because Dalot will be out of position on defensive transition.

That and two tens holding wide would directly interfere with the wingbacks natural width.
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I do agree with your point but I'd argue the 10s are already intentionally much wider than at Sporting. Amad and Garnacho repeatedly find themselves in those wide forward positions because of our current lacking in the wing back departments.

I don't buy the idea that he hasn't adjusted because we aren't playing like for like anyway. Obviously the variations in personnel come into play but our defensive line are much deeper, our WBs aren't wing backs, our 10s don't attack the box much, our striker barely runs the channel or makes early runs.
 
It gives me a tickle to think he went full Ultimate Warrior in there and suplexed the TV before dropping the DDT and Hulk-raging out!

I also can’t help but laugh at how we’ve turned the smiling, smooth, stylish, suave and charming guy into a raging, scrubby, gaunt mess inside 3 months.

And when I say laugh, I probably mean I’m perturbed. Not quite sure yet.
 
Amorim obviously isn't a top red. If he were he'd realise it's wrong to shout at our fragile players, just as it's wrong to boo them. They must be protected and adored to get the best out of them
 
This combined with with calling it the worst United team ever.

The armchair fan in me loves it, the amateur sports psychologist in me is quite worried now.
 
cirilus said:
Thats the issue. Team was going down in league finishes. Going down in performances. Going down in quality of players. After 10 years of mismanagement and with new owners, the only way forward was change (more or less dramatic). If you change so much in coach profile, that tell you that ownership is probably going to change as well in recruitment and player profile. Is it expectable to do this and keep competing for titles?
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Why then doesn’t he switch to talented youth players? Why is he sticking to Harry, Antony etc?
 
Too right, they’re going to end up getting him the sack from their constant individual errors, we must make more per game than any other team in the league
 
Hoof the ball said:
OK, but why would he push the tens wider when he's trying to teach the existing wide players to learn how to play inside? It's a teaching point. The lesson is more important than the short term outcome because the long term is the important thing. That's his point of contention with Garnacho. That when Garnacho plays he doesn't try to play the role assigned to him and that this means Dalot ends up filling the no 10 position instead, but then that causes havoc because Dalot will be out of position on defensive transition.

That and two tens holding wide would directly interfere with the wingbacks natural width.
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If you think of the system broadly, surely there are parts he believes are paramount right now versus things he could dedicate more time to in summer? Even the most fanatical coaches have things they change when they deem it necessary.

We have havoc in the defensive line already, the Brighton first goal was literally insane the more you watch it back with how the wider CBs are tasked with pushing up. You allow the run Mitoma makes, I'd argue you even encourage it. If he wants to persist with the 10s as they are, he has to risk the WBs pushing on way more than we do right now or we will never score. We had 1 shot on target against Brighton, it was a penalty.

Even forget changing any position, keep the exact same positions, but play differently. Keep the ball in the most boring way possible, literally for like 10 mins until someone presses/gets frustrated and we then can find a gap somewhere. Do the LVG special if needed, constant recycling of the ball. There are so many variations and options, it's not like Amorim only knows one specific way football absolutely must be played at all times.
 
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