A lot of players just can’t wrap their heads around how different the PL is from something like the Dutch or Portuguese leagues. Players and managers alike. Antony and Malacia shredded the Dutch league but aren’t good enough for the PL. Ten Hag’s system worked like voodoo in Holland but was like trying to feck with a piece of rope when imported to England. Teams can outrun opponents in lesser leagues but the fitness and skill gaps are much narrower at the top, and pure athleticism won’t cut it. Amorim is in the midst of learning all this.
Ruben Amorim - Manchester United Head Coach
- Thread starter sewey89
- Start date
#Justice4AmmyStay strong Amorim
This seems to be modern football, sadly.
How is that any different from our early 20th century history and the post-Busby era? This club has always been big and difficult to play for even when we weren't successful. Madrid would be the same if they ever had a dry patch, some of the Italian giants have gone through this too in recent memory like Milan.
Where did he say anything about not sticking around ? We are 10 points off bottom 3 and he’s stating the obvious. If anything it’s a message to the board to back in the next week or so by getting one or 2 players in
Maybe Sir Alex was all it needed to keep it together.
Fact is we swapped teams, coaches, managers and even the structure, nothing works
Expect a new opposition song to be heard for the foreseeable
“Amorim’s right , United are shite “
“Amorim’s right , United are shite “
The exact extent to which we're constrained is inconclusive, sure. But our overall financial situation is not in a good state, and likely to get even worse in the next few years as a large portion of the debt becomes due for refinancing at significantly higher rates.Are we actually though? It always seems a bit inconclusive.
If we are, then Amorim's appointment seems insane considering half the players don't have a role in his system.
Hopefully his comment today about the worse United team ever, will give him some wiggle room to make sweeping changes and suffer the consequences - drop Onana, play some youngsters (there has to be some who can offer more in the attacking roles?) and be a bit more adventurous and play Amad, Garnacho/Antony at WB. I don't see how we can be less toothless in attach.
It's easy to pile on today, but aside from Southampton, our performances in the league haven't been too bad - we do have some control in games but the players just shit the bed when they have the ball. There are huge confidence issues with this squad and I feel we are just some good scoring performances away from getting going. I live in hope.
It's easy to pile on today, but aside from Southampton, our performances in the league haven't been too bad - we do have some control in games but the players just shit the bed when they have the ball. There are huge confidence issues with this squad and I feel we are just some good scoring performances away from getting going. I live in hope.
It's like he's one of the most exciting and sought after young classical conductors in Europe, and he's revitalised the Lisbon Philharmonic Orchestra.
And we're the promoter of a shit jazz band. And we hire Amorim to transform our shit jazz band into a great classical orchestra.
But he has to work with all the crap jazz players the last band leader brought in.
And we won't give him a violinist, instead we tell him to get a f**king saxophonist to play violin instead.
And we won't get him a cellist, instead we tell him to get the big bass player to play the cello.
And when this f**king frankenstein of a Manchester orchestra churns out absolute shite, we blame Amorim for it and give him the sack 6 months later!
Farcical!
And we're the promoter of a shit jazz band. And we hire Amorim to transform our shit jazz band into a great classical orchestra.
But he has to work with all the crap jazz players the last band leader brought in.
And we won't give him a violinist, instead we tell him to get a f**king saxophonist to play violin instead.
And we won't get him a cellist, instead we tell him to get the big bass player to play the cello.
And when this f**king frankenstein of a Manchester orchestra churns out absolute shite, we blame Amorim for it and give him the sack 6 months later!
Farcical!
Thoughts and prayers in this difficult time.
The guy who built the team and worked with them for 2 years had them in the bottom half. There's no evidence there's some system that can salvage results. There's little to salvage with the squad. Our most prominent performers are assisting opponent attackers. The solution is to buy a time machine and not let Arnold let Murtough let Ten Hag build a team for the Dutch league.
And yet he can't even get the band to play a couple of notes. He needs to take some of the blame.
Only Qatar can save us. With FSR it will take 5 seasons to get the squad right.
We don't have any money, he can send whatever message he wants but that's the reality.
That is what's become the United Way. SAF signings the majority of the time were well thought out, it was only when the moneygrabbers came in the signing got a bit wayward.
Worst United team ever. . I really like his style (at least in the pressers).
If the system gives us more control, the same system makes us worse attacking wise. At the moment its a defensive, cautious, hope to nick a goal formation that is getting dominated and outplayed most weeks. The increase in possession is not even enough to really be a thing to shout out, we haven't transformed into a possession team. What we have definitely turned into, both visually and from the stats, is a defensive team that have even less options tactically to attack. That isn't coming from the players, far from it, they were getting criticised under Ten Hag for being too attacking and not getting back enough. That mentality and set up is coming from the coach.
You can't really say it was only Sir Alex. Brian Clough could have won us a league if we got him in, some reckon the Doc was close to winning one before he got sacked for his infidelity.
The new structure is barely a year old, the manager has been in for barely three months managing a team that isn't his. This team itself is the result of the fabled and way too talked about "open heart surgery" that the fraud Rangnick went on about, ten hag pretty much did exactly that and messed it up, as did Ashworth. I still think Amorim should be doing much better with this squad, there are worse teams out-performing us this season and that is not something that should be up for debate. This team should be playing better, the season should not be a write off, and yet we're treating it as it is. This defeatest attitude from the fans is just as bad as the attitude they criticise from the players.
Can't believe people are still bending over and begging for Qatar on here
Yup. All of this and the promoters knew it when they hired him. So they can hardly blame him when he doesn't suddenly become a swing jazz composer or have our existing staff smashing out Mozart.
If they knew they weren't going to be able to help him change our existing set up into something else they should not have hired him.
PSR would still be a factor, the poster must surely know that?!
Bending over for whom?
Dont see much of a difference between SJR/Glazers and Qatar.
Well the former actually exist. There was no serious bid from Qatar. If there had been, then they would have blown Ratcliffe's out of the water
No, they wanted full ownership. Glazers wanted to co-own.
I made this same point but with a tuba player being forced to play a guitar solo.
Did any of you actually watch his post match interview ?
He obviously means their performance is the worst, as he mentioned just before that that they were breaking negative records.
He didn’t attack any of his players. He actually defended them. “How can they do well when their confidence is so low and they need to adapt to a new system with which they are so unfamiliar “. Along those lines. He was even defending Rashford (when asked upon).
Also he’s not broken. You can see he’s tired and hurt, but shouldn’t he, after such a game? Yet his spirit is clearly full of fight about wanting to improve things.
What I saw was a tired, disappointed, but far from broken man, defending both his players and the fact that he finds it difficult to (find the time to) implement his style of play
I’m not saying I don’t think he makes mistakes, but just that it’s silly to look at such quotes without interpreting the context
So why did he say the worst team and not the worst performance? WHich this isn't even our worst performance, that would be the 7-0 against Liverpool or even the 6-1 against city 12 years ago.
No he didn't.
I watched the presser just now, he is talking about since he joined, and how theyve only won 2 league games in that time from 10 games.
He won’t on the assumption he lasts until the summer
Too many on big money and no desire to move on to challenge themselves, the only way the club gets rid of these failures is too let there contracts run out but people at the top are to stupid to keep rewarding them as they seem them as commodities when in reality they have little or no value
He was trying to make a point. We are dreadful. Him and the players need to fix it.
I'd back him even if relegated and he decided to stay.
This is on the owners and the fans who let the Glazers stay so long and then cheered on this INEOS fast one.
Don't think we are that constrained by psr. More constrained by budgetAre we actually though? It always seems a bit inconclusive.
If we are, then Amorim's appointment seems insane considering half the players don't have a role in his system.
Does he need to? They need to come through the other side and help themselves again. They’re all playing with anxiety, and they’re professional footballers playing for United, there’s no where to hide at this level and they shouldn’t hide behind the coach.
I think the fact here is - any manager who wants to play front foot progressive football, even Ten Hag himself, would be 8 players short because all of our senior defenders are so one paced, the full backs so lacking in any form of offensive quality and the forward line is just mediocre.
This is not just about meeting Amorim's specific needs but our inability to compete physically and technically. You need to be able to keep the ball under pressure, can we? You need to be able to circulate the ball quickly and accurately so as to unsettle teams, can we? When games are tight you need to take your chances, can we?
Before Amorim this team and the one before it failed at these basics. If they could do the basics we wouldn't need 8 players. So short of hiring Ole or Mourinho who could play the sit deep and break tactics, every manager we hire will need guarantees that this squad will be overhauled. We might as well overhaul it with Amorim given the fact that by May he will have an intimate knowledge of the squad and what needs to come immediately.
Whilst I agree to a certain extent, it doesn't seem to matter than Mazraoui is at wing back or Dalot is on the wrong side against teams like Liverpool or Arsenal...or that we have made changes.
Again, its very simple for me. When we have to play on the front foot, we are appalling. Our fowards are young and inexperienced, or lack the quality needed.
Under Jose, we looked good and finished 2nd when we played conservative football. Under OGS, we looked good and finished 2nd when we played conservative football. Both times, the wheels fell off when we tried to be more progressive.
I go back to my point...and I don't know the answer by the way...is it better to stick dogmatically to a system and hope it clicks...or is it better to bunker down and accept our 60-70pts ceiling playing like a "normal" team, and pursue 'evolution' not 'revolution'?
In my experience, playing deep and countering is significantly, by an order of magnitude, easier than playing on the front...and in my experience, it's also nearly impossible to change everything at once and expect results.
The point is lost and he looks like he's losing it and throwing the players under the bus.
While I don't want him to get sacked I think there has to be a conversation soon as it's clear the players we have now cannot pay his system and we will just keep getting worse.
Therefore we need a lot of new players either transfers or promoting youth to try and make this work.
Can we afford this? and if we can't it's it with keeping him with these players?
Therefore we need a lot of new players either transfers or promoting youth to try and make this work.
Can we afford this? and if we can't it's it with keeping him with these players?
He's protected them enough, You still want these players to be protected because they're precious? aww their feelings going to get hurt? Diddums
I think the fact here is - any manager who wants to play front foot progressive football, even Ten Hag himself, would be 8 players short because all of our senior defenders are so one paced, the full backs so lacking in any form of offensive quality and the forward line is just mediocre.
This is not just about meeting Amorim's specific needs but our inability to compete physically and technically. You need to be able to keep the ball under pressure, can we? You need to be able to circulate the ball quickly and accurately so as to unsettle teams, can we? When games are tight you need to take your chances, can we?
Before Amorim this team and the one before it failed at these basics. If they could do the basics we wouldn't need 8 players. So short of hiring Ole or Mourinho who could play the sit deep and break tactics, every manager we hire will need guarantees that this squad will be overhauled. We might as well overhaul it with Amorim given the fact that by May he will have an intimate knowledge of the squad and what needs to come immediately.
I think he is trying to jolt them, to extract a response from them if they have any semblance of professional pride left in them that statement ought to sting. They don't deserve any coddling or protection when they collectively and individually shit the bed and cost the team points due to schoolboy errors.