I get that but what I am saying is sometimes it takes time and is not that simple. Amorim has two options , give up on his ideology that made him successful for short term results or stick to his principles and ride the storm and reap the reward long term. I rather he try the latter and fail (if he fails) than doing the former like eth did and fail.
Ruben Amorim - Manchester United Head Coach
- Thread starter sewey89
- Start date
Quality post. Every weak livered bedwetter in this thread needs to print this out and read it before and after each game.
Teams week in week out are targeting our weakness which is defending set pieces and crosses. This is an issue that needs to be addressed.
I agree. But we’ve had the same issues manager after manager. The players are awful yes, but a managers job should be to get the best out of the players. Ipswich don’t have a better squad than us, yet McKenna is racking up wins against Chelsea. Neither do forest, they finished like 17th last season and now there top 4. Because nuno is getting the best out of them.
To the point that people are making about Amorin being too stubborn persisting with the 3-4-2-1, trying to develop unsuitable players that may ultimately be leaving soon, I would counter this approach with one of the criticisms of EtH.
EtH got most of his plaudits for how his Ajax team played, then said he couldn't play that way at United and was criticised for that approach. This time the coach is sticking to his principles and surely his best chance of success is in doing things the way he knows how.
Also, when he's playing a back 3, with fullbacks as wingbacks and 2 deeper midfielders, and we're still easy to score against, shows Amorin every thing he needs to see about the current players... because you can't have a much more defensive set up than that. It's a system you'd expect wouldn't bring many goals for, but should have made us hard to beat.
EtH got most of his plaudits for how his Ajax team played, then said he couldn't play that way at United and was criticised for that approach. This time the coach is sticking to his principles and surely his best chance of success is in doing things the way he knows how.
Also, when he's playing a back 3, with fullbacks as wingbacks and 2 deeper midfielders, and we're still easy to score against, shows Amorin every thing he needs to see about the current players... because you can't have a much more defensive set up than that. It's a system you'd expect wouldn't bring many goals for, but should have made us hard to beat.
This is a fair point.
yes, I should have said the cupboard is bare. Elsewhere I did say without sales there are no funds for new players.
From the guy who thinks there was nothing the manager could have done that would have made a difference. Jesus wept!
It did make us harder to beat. Until yesterday all the metrics showed we were one of the hardest teams in the league to score against in open play. The reason we’ve conceded so many is set piece vulnerability and a couple of very poor goalkeeping errors. Which has nothing to do with our formation.
Yesterday the open play vulnerability was mainly because of our geriatric midfield. Which is hopefully something he won’t be forced to try out again any time soon.
Tell me what the manager could’ve done to make a difference last night? I’m all ears.
For those who watch the youth:
Who in the youth set up could replace Dalot and are they anywhere close to ready?
I'd certainly look to replace and few of these who are clearly not good enough/not willing with some of the kids surely they can't be any worse?! Get a bit of pace in there as well
Who in the youth set up could replace Dalot and are they anywhere close to ready?
I'd certainly look to replace and few of these who are clearly not good enough/not willing with some of the kids surely they can't be any worse?! Get a bit of pace in there as well
Glad to see he still has the backing from most of the fans. OT chanting his name yesterday.
Spot on from Rio…
Its funny how youve said this and then proceeded to shit on him with every other post.
Not been following what’s happened at Nice then?
I think there are other options than dropping a youth player in the deep end and seeing if they can swim. Like, use Antony at LWB, for instance. Not a great plan, but at least Antony has been kicked up and down the pitch in the PL for awhile, so he's more or less up to speed.
Of the actual youth who could come in, I thought Amass could come in for Dalot in cup games and so forth, but he's too young to be starting week in week out (he's 17). I know Yamal is 4 months younger, but he's an anomaly. I think asking Dalot to go full pelt and burn through his tank in 65 minutes, then replacing him with Amass might be an option. I feel like our players are trying to conserve their energy, so that might address this. It also could end up backfiring and destroying Amass's confidence both.
The concern would be having the mental toughness to handle getting rinsed by Salah, for example. Amass, Gore, Innes, Wheatley, Biancheri, and Collyer (who was on the bench) are all promising, but it's a massive step up. Wheatley looked lost when he featured preseason, for example, although he looked a worldbeater in the U21s. Collyer is a big body, maybe he can do a job. And then there's the simple fact that Amass hasn't been playing as a wingback, either, so it might be rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic.
Please read this you chumps
Maybe need a closer look?
Two of the bottom three have taken more points than Man Utd in the last six games.
In fact all teams lower than Man Utd except Southampton have taken more points in the last six games.
If the form of the last six continues for everyone then Man Utd end up 18th. Maybe saved from relegation by Man City being punished
Nailed it.
Excellent summary, Gazza.
Nice post, I actually needed to hear that and do feel a bit better. Hopefully things can improve sooner rather than later!
It would be devastating to the point that we may never recover. I don’t think it will happen but we will finish bottom half of the table. Only hope is a run in the Europa League and possible UCL qualification by winning the whole thing. We have shown over the years that we’re a decent enough cup side.
Do people at least agree that Ruben should be doing better with what he has got, he has lost 5 of his 8 league games in charge so far (we had only lost 4 of the previous 11) with 2 wins and 1 draw which really isnt good enough, Klopp who took over Liverpool in mid-season (and arguably inherited a worse squad) got 3 wins, 3 draws, and 2 defeats from his first 8 league games.
Amass
Start Mainoo and maybe we don't lose.
But it was still a shitshow of individual mistakes as usual..
No new manager ‘bounce’, insisting playing a system with players that couldn’t perform in what they knew…with no budget to buy players.
Add in issues with (at least) Rashford and Garnacho…I mean it’s just an absolute dreadful start.
Add in issues with (at least) Rashford and Garnacho…I mean it’s just an absolute dreadful start.
Why do ‘tubers think this kind of stupid facial expression makes you want to watch their shite? This image alone and the click bait title Is enough To scroll past for me…..
Plus Rio has been out of touch since he turned on Ole. He’s joined the sensationalist ABU circuit. His opinion doesn’t really resonate anymore.
He already had Coutinho, Firmino and Lallana when he started there. You'd be hard pressed to find three players of that quality in our current squad. Their defence was shit, but right off the bat, they had the firepower to outscore most teams on their day.
It's funny how we easily lose perspective after going through a lean and disappointing spell. I have rarely seen anyone praising this squad as very good or strong so why shouldn't we overhaul it, surely you look at Eriksen, Casemiro, Hoijlund, Martinez, Zirkzee, Dalot and even Bruno and see a squad to just continue with, with minor twitches?
Ten Hag was sacked only because he was a poor coach, he also assembled this mediocre, slow and weak squad at great cost. No one is going to come and make Martinez taller and faster. A coach can do so much but at this level you need to have at least mastered the basics like ball control, short passing and the stamina of a professional footballer. Do you see any of these in this squad? If not then why should we burden a manager with it and demand success.
Granted the results aren't good, he has made his fair share of mistakes but it's not fair that people who saw Arnold, Murtough and Ten Hag get the sack for building this squad want to condemn someone for failing to polish a turd.
Beautifully put. Can this be threadmarked?
I just might.
What is something new? Nothing is new in this world.
Amorim has not invented anything new. We agree on that first.
Secondly, why teach the squad *something new" when it has been claimed we need a squad clear out? Why teach them yet in 12 months it's acceptable they won't be here most of them..
What's the benefit to incur losses, while teaching "duds"
When it's acceptable they won't be around...
Example...
Dalot as a wingback.. He's trained to be a wingback. Fine.
We finish 15th because we have poor squad.
Dalot leaves.
We buy another Wingback. Amorim player.
What benefits have we accrued in such a scenario? Because this is what is going to happen to many players.
Mainoo is only 19 - is it fair to throw the weight of responsibility on his shoulders when he's still developing. He should be involved of course, but he shouldn't be our saviour.
Playing that much at his age is risky as it could hinder his development. Playing youth only works well when surrounded by good experienced players who can take the pressure. We keep promoting youth too quickly without the required support and then wondering why they end up with a stunted growth trajectory. It's about time we stopped doing it, let the senior players suffer through this spell and see who has the mettle to stay long term.
Playing Mainoo seems to be the only possible variation he could have made. A nineteen year old who’s struggled so far this season. The criticism of the team selection is nonsensical.
Great post
We already lack physicality which was brutally exposed against Newcastle, Amass won’t help. This team needs established and proven talent to turn it around.
ETH was always just flexible, he wasn't a disciple of any style really. Most people didn't watch his interview, they just wanted a reason to criticise him and took the quote about Ajax out of context, the reality of what he said was just that United don't play like Ajax and he didn't want to put that into place and, even if he wanted to try and put that style into place, he wouldn't have the players to do so. He's much more in the Carlo school of thought of working with the players you have at your disposal. Amorim seems much much more tactically dogmatic - he has a single formation he uses and one way of playing, if players can adapt they will play, if not they are gone.
I think you’re right, it has to be Ugarte, Mainoo, Bruno, Mount and Hojlund through the middle. I’d like to see the 3 at the back who were doing well in Mazraoui, De Ligt and Martinez. Dalot and Amad back at WB. Build from there again. Then try to introduce Yoro and tweak from there. To me that is probably his best setup that has the closest mix of work rate and quality to what we need.
No not really. Let’s look at what he has got.
- No left sided wingback - mostly playing RBs there instead. CB that are accustomed to playing as a pair but a 3.
- Various attacking Wingers as RWB.
- An aging DM/CM pairing,
- No.10s who are either injured or suspended,
- one ST/no.9 who is learning his trade but forced through previous incompetence to be the main man.
- A GK who is a confidence player and prone to brain farts.