RedTiger vs P-nut/Enigma - Tactical Draft SF

Who created a better environment for their star player to shine?


  • Total voters
    23
  • Poll closed .

Šjor Bepo

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Team Tiger


Skillful Italy and Juventus forward Alessandro del Piero, renowned for his dribbling and finishing, is one of the most productive and consistent performers in Serie `A'. Now the all-time leading scorer of Juventus, he has scooped six Italian titles and a Champions League medal in a glittering career that has perhaps lacked only major success at international level. He could put that right as he features in his third World Cup this summer.

Del Piero is a creative and attacking player who is effective playing behind the frontline strikers as well as further forward. He is also recognised as one of the world's best dead-ball specialists.

Del Piero was born in Conegliano in the province of Treviso but such was his footballing talent he was spotted playing for hometown San Vandemiano he left home at the age of 13 to join the youth programme at Serie `B' club Padova.

He broke into the Padova first team in 1991 and two years later was snapped up by giants Juventus, his boyhood idols, in spite of interest from AC Milan.

Del Piero made his Serie `A' debut against Foggia in September 1993, scored his first goal in his next game against Reggiana and then grabbed a hat-trick against Parma on his first start. Juventus claimed their first Scudetto in eight years in his first season and success continued to follow. There were further titles in 1997, 1998, 2002, 2003 and 2005 and another one seems well on the way. He helped Juventus win the Champions League in 1996 and he has also lost three finals in 1997, 1998 and 2003

Philosophy/Ideology of tactical set-up
...

Style possession

Central player
Playing his favoured position behind the striker. Having Leonardo and Scifo on the flanks means they will naturally come narrow bringing the oppo fullbacks out of position and allowing Del Piero to play close to a free role in the final third. A solid central mid partnership of Essien and Stankovic meaning not too much on del piero to come deep.

Defense

Defensive Line - Normal
Marking - zonal
Off the ball - tucking in defenders to form compact defense
On the ball - Build up play

Midfield
...

Attack
...

Player Roles
Del Piero - Free Role/Trequartista
Fullbacks - provide the bulk of attacking wide play.
Essien - B2B
Stankovic- Sitting Midfield
The wingers - AM/inside forwards
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Team P-nut/Enigma


Formation: 5-3-2
Style
- Counter attacking set up. Sit deep and compact and break quickly.
Philosophy/Ideology of the tactical set up:

We're setting in a counter attacking formation with two no-nonsense defenders as stoppers, Vasovic sweeping behind and pushing forward in possession boosting numbers in midfield. 2 fast wingbacks, who are also good crossers of the ball and that can overlap in attack and man their flanks. In attack we are going with similar style to Herrera's Inter and using the basics - vertical football at great speed, with direct passes to get to the opponent's box as quickly as possible.

In defence we're staying deep, soaking the pressure, win the ball back in their half and launch the ball forward with speed and directness. Xabi Alonso or Vasovic can start an attack from deep and look for space on the flanks for our quick full backs, or either Signori, Mazzola or Vieri up field. All players can move quickly in transition and are used to counter attacking style of football. Directness is the key.

Mazzola has Vieri and Signori - two excellent goalscorers with solid link up game and most of all great off the ball movement which will allow him to create space for himself or use his passing and vision to set them up.

Player roles:

GK:
Thibaut Courtois - Solid in the air and excellent at starting the attacks if needed.
LWB: Zé Roberto - Stretch the attack, man his own flank moving vertically through the lines when in and off possession. Cross from deep and get the ball to the forwards.
RWB: Eric Gerets - Same as Ze Roberto from the other side.
Libero: Velibor Vasović - last line of defence, start attacks from deep, overload the midfield moving vertically.
LCB: Karlheinz Förster - One of the outstanding stoppers in the pool. Fluent in 5-3-2 system, excellent marker who is also a great overall defender
RCB: Carles Puyol - pacy and good on the ball can cover the right side when Gerets goes forward.
Deep playmaker: Xabi Alonso - look for openings both on the flank and up field, get the ball to the forwards as quickly as possible.
Box to Box: Bryan Robson - An all action box to box midfielder, leader of the 80's United side and a great ball winner in midfield. He brings a lot of energy and never say die attitude in the middle of the pitch.
Central player: Sandro Mazzola - focal point of the attack. Getting the ball to him, playing in a free role and pressing the opposition defenders off the ball.
LWF - Giuseppe Signori - use his pace on counters, stretch the attack wide and more often on his favorite left position.
CF: Christian Vieri - target man, keep the opposition defence honest, make space for Mazzola, use his strength in aerial duels to bring the ball down.

Central player - Sandro Mazzola

Mazzola’s
role in the Grande Inter team was particularly tasking. A wonderfully creative player who combined a glorious touch with dangerous pace and agility, Mazzola was relied upon to bring Suarez and Picchi’s sweeping balls under control and immediately feed Peiro or take a shot on goal. Inter’s system relied upon maximum efficiency up front, and it was largely down to Mazzola to turn hopeful passes into clear-cut opportunities. Mazzola was a brilliant dribbler and finisher often leading Inter goalscoring charts. The combination of notoriously hard to please and a strict disciplinarian - Herrara, and a perfectionist and hard worker - Mazzola, was always going to produce scintillating displays of football on the pitch. One where technique, flair and skill meet hard work, determination, tactics and will to win. Mazzola's role in defending was not to fall back on the pitch when not with ball, but to harry defenders get the ball back.

In this particular set up Vieri and Signori will compliment Mazzola's strengths but also allow him to play his natural game. Vieri with his strength up field can engage the central defencers in a way Peiro did, whilst allowing space for Mazzola to get the ball and run towards the goal or either look for Signori who will be hovering around the box or at the left wing. He will be overlapped by Gerets also allowing him to utilize the right flank and a 5-3-2 system will give more space for him to operate with two other clinical forwards around him.

Like Grande inter in this set up we have chosen two very efficient forwards in Vieri and Signori, fluent in counter attacking set up and very direct with their movement towards the goal.

The midfield is based on getting the ball as quickly as possible to Mazzola with two excellent passers in Robson and Alonso, who also possess considerable work rate and can stay deep to break attacks.

The set up is aimed to get the best out of Mazzola in a way that it would highlight his dribbling and creative talent by being our focal attacking point and would allow Alonso, Robson and Vasovic to find him into space while Signori and Vieri occupy the opposition defenders. In the same time we have very direct and fast players on both wings and up front who will give a lot of passing options for him to link up and combine in the attacking third.

Defence - Our defence is made up of 2 stoppers combined with a sweeper. A classic 5-3-2, composed of one of the best stoppers in history in Karlheinz Förster and Carles Puyol who slots perfectly into the RCB role. Both CB's will be tasked with no nonsense defending. When they win the ball they will simply shift it to either the sweeper in Vasović or play a simple ball to Alonso if it is on.

Vasović will be tasked with deciding when to step into midfield and when to drop off so that our defence always has the numbers to deal with any threat.

Both wing backs will provide the same roles of manning their flanks and providing outlets out wide. Ze Roberto will have slightly more license to tuck into midfield if the situation arises where he has to, however most of the time he will keep his width.

Defensive Line - Deep
Marking - Custom (1 stopper to pick up the striker, other sliding wide to help the wing back, sweeper following any strikers that drop deep)
Off the ball - Standing off
On the ball - Rapid transitions through sweeper (or Alonso)

Midfield roles:
Robson
will be playing as a complete box to box midfielder. His energy passing range and strength will be a huge boost. Both Xabi Alonso and Robson will be deeper when off the ball then either move vertically into space and shoot from distance, combine with Mazzola or get the ball to the attackers. Vasović in his libero role will be pushing up when needed to overload the midfield and keep things tight. When off the ball Zé Roberto can also shore the space by tucking in.

Attack - Three pronged attack all designed to give Mazzola space to work and options to link up with. Vieri will occupy the centre backs whilst Signori keeps the pitch stretched to afford maximum room. Attack can expect to receive the ball quickly and will stay high up the pitch in order to gain ground on quick counter attacks.
 
  • Draft matches would be decided based on who has crafted/built the more coherent and cohesive tactical set-up around his main star as opposed to who might win in a fantasy encounter. Hopefully, this paves way for interesting discussions on the set-ups themselves - delving deeper into the creation/evolution etc of said set-up - and the personnel fit.
  • Voters are asked to consider the XIs featured as 2 separate teams not like a classic game of football, and to consider to what extent the manager has succeeded in building around his central figure. This is not a fantasy match but a comparison of 2 tactical attempts.
  • Teams will be built and judged for best tactical fits rather then the quality of the team. First, team has to be perfectly built around the central figure, if both teams are very close then you look at the other specific pairings, good fits for the team etc. if the level is still close then you watch at quality of the individual players except of the central player.

good luck @RedTiger @Enigma_87 @P-Nut0712
 
Voted pnut and enigma, one of my favorites from round one, great job from day one. Not sure if they used reinforcement rounds to their maximum potential but thats irrelevant now.
Tiger has the same issues he had in previous round, not enough creativity within the team and while he used his upgrades fantastically for the previous game with Dani Alves replacing Angloma in this round it was an upgrade on a striker that didnt really change anything from the tactical point of view.
 
Few words on this game:

Not much changed in our approach or tactics. We have a like for like replacement in Robson for Coluna. Robson is another great box to box player who will contribute in both phases and provide energy in midfield.

He's in the same direct mold we're looking at and his trademark vertical runs will come of good use, as well as his top defensive prowess and superior positioning.

A bit more focus on our man of the moment - Sandro Mazzola:



A compilation of his top ten goals compared to our personnel and using the space.

10. Goal from inside the box - a quick counter, cross from the left(Ze Roberto), the forward(Vieri) heads it down to Mazolla to find the goal from close range.
7. Quick counter with Mazzola playing a quick one two and moving into space while finishing in the top corner.
6. A wide forward(Signori) cutting in and creating the space for Mazzola, teeing off him at around the 25 yards area and the latter finishing it with a long ranger.
5. Cross from the left, two forwards occupying the defenders(Signori, Vieri) centrally, which makes space for Mazzola to finish it from deep.
2. Quick one two with the left forward(Signori), Mazzola comes from deep and then dribbled couple of players in the area and neat finish after rounding the keeper.
 
Voted pnut and enigma, one of my favorites from round one, great job from day one. Not sure if they used reinforcement rounds to their maximum potential but thats irrelevant now.
Tiger has the same issues he had in previous round, not enough creativity within the team and while he used his upgrades fantastically for the previous game with Dani Alves replacing Angloma in this round it was an upgrade on a striker that didnt really change anything from the tactical point of view.

Cheers mate. Not much to do with the reinforcement round any better from our approach as Alonso was a required upgrade for us as Veron was seen as liability defensively from round one. Apart from that Forster was genuine upgrade on Samuel as we left our CB picks for the later stages of the initial drafting so we had to address one of them first. Puyol is a great fit for the RCB role, so any other CB in the pool would be only marginally better and probably sideways move as well.

We thought of shuffling the formation a bit, but needed two picks for the SF's and with only one we had to stick with our initial approach.
 
The draft became a bit stale, its idea isn't best suited to the play-off/reinforcements system. Had to check as I thought that RedTiger's team was literally the same in the previous round :lol:

Voted for P-Nut-Enigma; quite liked their set-up from the start and Robson is a great addition.
 
The draft became a bit stale, its idea isn't best suited to the play-off/reinforcements system. Had to check as I thought that RedTiger's team was literally the same in the previous round :lol:

Voted for P-Nut-Enigma; quite liked their set-up from the start and Robson is a great addition.

Yeah we wanted 2 reinforcements last round to be able to change formation more for variety than anything else really.

Maybe a stricter pool would have resulted in better upgrades through reinforcements as our team has been pretty much set from round 1.
 
The draft became a bit stale, its idea isn't best suited to the play-off/reinforcements system. Had to check as I thought that RedTiger's team was literally the same in the previous round :lol:

Voted for P-Nut-Enigma; quite liked their set-up from the start and Robson is a great addition.
Indeed probably most of the teams have set up their teams in the way they liked from the off and it's hard to upgrade on that. We had tougher time deciding on the upgrades than the actual drafting process tbh. :)
 
Sup guys, at work now and will contribute in due time. I hope I haven't been roasted for my write-up yet:nervous:

Good luck @Enigma_87 :)
You're still trying to act like your quicksand tactics is an oversight? Let them argue, sit back and look how the vote is going your way :D
 
P-Nut and Enigma keep adding marginal improvements to a great Mazzola side. Meanwhile, I like the Del Piero-RvN pairing but still can't quite work out RTs midfield or how it would work in practice.
 
P-Nut and Enigma keep adding marginal improvements to a great Mazzola side. Meanwhile, I like the Del Piero-RvN pairing but still can't quite work out RTs midfield or how it would work in practice.
Anto, can you not envisage how the midfield will play? I'm sure you watched all 4 of the players mentioned and their playing styles. It's a hard working 4 with enough verve and attacking discipline to keep the ball and I intend to keep the ball.
 
P-Nut and Enigma keep adding marginal improvements to a great Mazzola side. Meanwhile, I like the Del Piero-RvN pairing but still can't quite work out RTs midfield or how it would work in practice.

Not much more we can do really. The 1 reinforcement last round meant we couldn't change much.
 
Anto, can you not envisage how the midfield will play? I'm sure you watched all 4 of the players mentioned and their playing styles. It's a hard working 4 with enough verve and attacking discipline to keep the ball and I intend to keep the ball.

Well, it sounds alright in theory. I'm not sure how it would work in practice, though. What you propose is, essentially, that Leonardo/Scifo will have the opposition wingbacks tracking them (infield) – and this seems to be their (your AM/winger combo's) primary function.

I don't know to what extent that actually makes sense, to be honest. It's hard to envisage a game in which both Ze Roberto and Gerets will be simultaneously busy with this tracking/getting dragged centrally business. Not least because they aren't fullbacks in a four.

Scifo, for me, would be mainly useful as a (creative) link between midfield and attack (Del Piero), i.e. someone who does a fair bit of playmaking, carries the ball a fair bit, etc. Here he seems to be more a factotum style “hard working” player whose only instruction (per the description given is precisely this dragging business).

So, yeah – I'm not clear on how this is supposed to work when you have the ball and when Leonardo/Scifo function as part of your offensive build-up. You intend to keep the ball, that's very well - but precisely what do you intend to do with it in order to get Del Piero involved as much as possible? It's a bit vague for me.
 
10. Goal from inside the box - a quick counter, cross from the left(Ze Roberto), the forward(Vieri) heads it down to Mazolla to find the goal from close range.
7. Quick counter with Mazzola playing a quick one two and moving into space while finishing in the top corner.
6. A wide forward(Signori) cutting in and creating the space for Mazzola, teeing off him at around the 25 yards area and the latter finishing it with a long ranger.
5. Cross from the left, two forwards occupying the defenders(Signori, Vieri) centrally, which makes space for Mazzola to finish it from deep.
2. Quick one two with the left forward(Signori), Mazzola comes from deep and then dribbled couple of players in the area and neat finish after rounding the keeper.

This is nicely done, I must say.

Given the draft theme, it's just the sort of thing the neutral observer wants to see.
 
Voted pnut and enigma, one of my favorites from round one, great job from day one. Not sure if they used reinforcement rounds to their maximum potential but thats irrelevant now.
Tiger has the same issues he had in previous round, not enough creativity within the team and while he used his upgrades fantastically for the previous game with Dani Alves replacing
Well, it sounds alright in theory. I'm not sure how it would work in practice, though. What you propose is, essentially, that Leonardo/Scifo will have the opposition wingbacks tracking them (infield) – and this seems to be their (your AM/winger combo's) primary function.

I don't know to what extent that actually makes sense, to be honest. It's hard to envisage a game in which both Ze Roberto and Gerets will be simultaneously busy with this tracking/getting dragged centrally business. Not least because they aren't fullbacks in a four.

Scifo, for me, would be mainly useful as a (creative) link between midfield and attack (Del Piero), i.e. someone who does a fair bit of playmaking, carries the ball a fair bit, etc. Here he seems to be more a factotum style “hard working” player whose only instruction (per the description given is precisely this dragging business).

So, yeah – I'm not clear on how this is supposed to work when you have the ball and when Leonardo/Scifo function as part of your offensive build-up. You intend to keep the ball, that's very well - but precisely what do you intend to do with it in order to get Del Piero involved as much as possible? It's a bit vague for me.
It's not really about how the teams play each other but more how the teams are built around the central player. If it were the case if how they face each other then I would have played a 352 with Rattin as one of the 5 and angloma as a right sided centreback.
 
It's not really about how the teams play each other but more how the teams are built around the central player.

Yes, I get that.

But that makes it all the more important to specify why the players you've surrounded him with would make him shine (to quote the poll question).

The only specific thing I can see is – again – the fullback/wingback business. I get Leonardo in that regard (if he really is an ideal man for this centrally-drifting role, that is), since Del Piero liked to work the left channel. But that's about it as far as specifics go – unless I've missed something.
 
It's not really about how the teams play each other but more how the teams are built around the central player. If it were the case if how they face each other then I would have played a 352 with Rattin as one of the 5 and angloma as a right sided centreback.

your central midfield isnt suited to play the possession game. Bar Alves, Enzo and Del Piero i dont see a player in there that would be a great fit for a possession based team.
 
Well, it sounds alright in theory. I'm not sure how it would work in practice, though. What you propose is, essentially, that Leonardo/Scifo will have the opposition wingbacks tracking them (infield) – and this seems to be their (your AM/winger combo's) primary function.

I don't know to what extent that actually makes sense, to be honest. It's hard to envisage a game in which both Ze Roberto and Gerets will be simultaneously busy with this tracking/getting dragged centrally business. Not least because they aren't fullbacks in a four.

Scifo, for me, would be mainly useful as a (creative) link between midfield and attack (Del Piero), i.e. someone who does a fair bit of playmaking, carries the ball a fair bit, etc. Here he seems to be more a factotum style “hard working” player whose only instruction (per the description given is precisely this dragging business).

So, yeah – I'm not clear on how this is supposed to work when you have the ball and when Leonardo/Scifo function as part of your offensive build-up. You intend to keep the ball, that's very well - but precisely what do you intend to do with it in order to get Del Piero involved as much as possible? It's a bit vague for me.
Couldn't put it better myself. It seems to be predicated on the oppo FBs playing along and running around like headless chicken when it is more likely Vasovic will step forward and support Alonso and Robbo.
 
Stankovic no. Forgot to mention Leonardo but im not liking the partnership with Del Piero, think you would be better suited with a classic winger on that left side, specially with Cole behind.
 
This is nicely done, I must say.

Given the draft theme, it's just the sort of thing the neutral observer wants to see.
Aye, cheers mate. Will prepare some more for the final. It's essentially the best approach to depict the player roles and support around him.
 
Good game @RedTiger . You had a fine team and certainly a fresh approach on a team build around Del Piero.
It was definitely unorthodox, in a good way. I liked seeing Scifo involved even if I couldn't quite grasp the midfield overall, it's a very interesting combination he had there with Del Piero and one I think would work well.
 
It was definitely unorthodox, in a good way. I liked seeing Scifo involved even if I couldn't quite grasp the midfield overall, it's a very interesting combination he had there.

Yeah Scifo in a bit of a wideish playmaker role cutting inside and overlapped by Alves was a really great idea for that flank.

Man for man he had done pretty well in terms of upgrades, RvN/Del Piero is particularly tasty.

Scifo and Ceulemans had a good run in this draft have to say and in a roles that are important for the respective set ups.
 
Both fits for the star men were fine. The difference for me was the quality in midfield with RT having to use players who were not just inferior to PNut and Enigma's midfielders, but even their subs (Coluna and Veron) on the bench.
 
I've been keen to build a narrow 4-4-2 myself for ages so I liked RT's team overall, but I never quite grasped how the overall strcture related to Del Piero, and the overall quality in midfield was a bit lacking. I probably underrate Scifo though, as he was underwhelming most of the time when I seen him play back in the day, and I've never really researched him since.