Player Ratings

[Neil Thomson]

Barthez 7 - Good saves, could've done better for the goal.
O'Shea 7.5 - Did well defensively, tried offensively but isn't what he's good at.
Wes Brown MOM 8 - Great display for him, was everywhere, tenacious.
Blanc 7 - Was ok, some good interceptions.
Mickey 6 - Poor crosses, at fault for the goal.
Scholes 7 - Some good work, though not much to show for it.
Veron 6.5 - PL Veron, giving the ball away and not tackling, but some good movement.
Giggs 4 - Absent without leave, started to try in second half, but with no quality.
Ruud 7.5 - Bright display from him rightly led to a goal.
Ole 7 - Crossed for the goal, but otherwise quite quiet by his standards.


No subs made. feck knows why.

 

[Gazza]

O'Shea and Wes were superb, Blanc was alright too. Silvestre was anonymous, same with Giggs - is there something about that side of the pitch?

I was really disappointed we let our concentration down at the end, even more upset that Larry and Ole missed their chances after their goal.

 

[Gazza]

Originally posted by Neil Thomson:
<strong>No subs made. feck knows why.</strong><hr></blockquote>

My hopes were raised when Richardson was warming up, and I cant believe he didnt come on. He should have replaced Giggs after an hour as it was clear nothing was going for him. If I was SAF I would give Davis and Richardson plenty of action this season, they are our brightest hopes along with Timm.

 

[RUnited]

JOS, Blanc, Barthez - 7.5
Brown, 8 - top of the night.
silvestre 6.5 - didn't see him much.. but did some alright defending up till the goal.

bascially the whole defence did a good job..

midfield, didn't really exist in terms of defending, but veron, scholes and fortune had a good game - 7.5

Ole - 6.. he had a lot of chances he could have passed on to his friends to score.. but he didn't.. tried them all by himself and missed.. if only one of 'em went in.. sigh..

RVN - 7.5, tried harder.. went down to help the defence a bit.. superb touch on the ball..

Giggs - 5, biggest disappointment.. didn't exist.. it was almost 10 of us against 11 of them.. did nothing wrong though.. so doesn't deserve a 4 IMO.

 

[RUnited]

Originally posted by Gazza:
<strong>

My hopes were raised when Richardson was warming up, and I cant believe he didnt come on. He should have replaced Giggs after an hour as it was clear nothing was going for him. If I was SAF I would give Davis and Richardson plenty of action this season, they are our brightest hopes along with Timm.</strong><hr></blockquote>

a lot of surprise in the no substitution thing i think.. can't believe SAF has lost that much confidence in the bench.. even forlan didn't come on.. must have been the first game he missed this season!

richardson should have gotten his minutes.. not so sure about davis.. don't think he would have been ready for this one IMO..

 

[giggzy]

Barthez 7
O'Shea 7
Wes Brown 7 - good comeback...
Blanc 7 - solid game
Mickey 6 -
Scholes 7 - worked hard
Veron 7 - very good first half... but pegged back in the second
Fortune 7 - played better in the second.
Giggs 5 - commentators seem to think he had a good game
Ruud 6.5 - touch was good but dwelled on the ball too much
Ole 6.5

 

[Gazza]

Originally posted by RUnited:
<strong>richardson should have gotten his minutes.. not so sure about davis.. don't think he would have been ready for this one IMO..</strong><hr></blockquote>about as ready as Richardson. He's been playing full first team games for the past three months. It wouldnt hurt to bring him on as a sub for Fortune, as he was doing nothing for the last twenty minutes.

 

[giggzy]

Originally posted by Gazza:
<strong>about as ready as Richardson. He's been playing full first team games for the past three months. It wouldnt hurt to bring him on as a sub for Fortune, as he was doing nothing for the last twenty minutes.</strong><hr></blockquote>

for fortune?!!

kinell he was the only cover we had in midfield!


remember, we were winning until, a couple of mins to go..any substitution had to be defensive..

 

[RUnited]

Originally posted by Gazza:
<strong>about as ready as Richardson. He's been playing full first team games for the past three months. It wouldnt hurt to bring him on as a sub for Fortune, as he was doing nothing for the last twenty minutes.</strong><hr></blockquote>

but both richardson and davis together would have been a big big risk to take.. although we give us a very good idea on how our kids are doing.. tough call.. very tough call.. i guess that's why SAF didn't put any of them down!

 

[RUnited]

Originally posted by giggzy:
<strong>

for fortune?!!

kinell he was the only cover we had in midfield!


remember, we were winning until, a couple of mins to go..any substitution had to be defensive..</strong><hr></blockquote>

absolutely agreed. but gazza was also right that fortune wasn't doin much anymore.. so wasn't giggs.. as i said, very tough call to make that one.

 

[giggzy]

Originally posted by RUnited:
<strong>

absolutely agreed. but gazza was also right that fortune wasn't doin much anymore.. so wasn't giggs.. as i said, very tough call to make that one.</strong><hr></blockquote>

maybe richardson for giggs.. coz it would have been like for like... however, we didn't have any def mids to bring on for fortune.

 

[Gazza]

Originally posted by RUnited:
<strong>

but both richardson and davis together would have been a big big risk to take.. although we give us a very good idea on how our kids are doing.. tough call.. very tough call.. i guess that's why SAF didn't put any of them down!</strong><hr></blockquote>I didnt say both of them together.

 

[rz99]

Don't see the point of ratings for this match. Nobody stood out except for O'Shea and Wes. We had no midfield. The defenders, as a unit, failed to clear the ball time and time again. And the strikers looked really tired in the second half from having to track back all the time to try and get the ball themselves.

 

[Amir]

Originally posted by Neil Thomson:
<strong>Barthez 7 - Good saves, could've done better for the goal.
</strong><hr></blockquote>

No he couldn't. Thats just ridiculous. Left stranded against Defoe from 10 yards.

 

[Gazza]

From Sky Sports:

West Ham played the brighter, neater football for long periods, but the visitors always seemed to carry more threat, inspired by a Ryan Giggs back to something approaching his flowing best.

WTF? <img src="graemlins/houllier.gif" border="0" alt="[Houllier]" />

 

[MancFanFromManc]

Barthez 7
O'Shea 7
Wes Brown 7
Blanc 7
Mickey 6
Scholes 7.1 MOM
Veron 6
Fortune 6
Giggs 7
Ruud 7
Ole 6

 

[MauritianRed]

Originally posted by RUnited:
<strong>bascially the whole defence did a good job..
</strong><hr></blockquote>Disagree. We were leading until 5 mins to go, BUT that was a false reflection on the game. How many times didn't they get clear cut chances that they didn't take. Defoe was having a ball running behind our defence. Individually, O'Shea(some excellent display mixed with some very bad passes) and Brown were good. Blanc was alright, but showed no urgency at times. Silvestre was poor, and was caught ball watching for WH's goal. His positional play is fecking awful.

 

[Red said Fred]

Barthez 7
O'Shea 7
Wes Brown 6.5
Blanc 7
Mickey 6
Scholes 7.5
Veron 5.5
Fortune 6.5
Giggs 7
Ruud 7
Ole 6.5

 

[antonio]

Originally posted by Red said Fred:
<strong>Barthez 7
O'Shea 7
Wes Brown 6.5
Blanc 7
Mickey 6
Scholes 7.5
Veron 5.5
Fortune 6.5
Giggs 7
Ruud 7
Ole 6.5</strong><hr></blockquote>

veron 5.5?? Crazy MOFO!!

 

[Murt]

Barthez: 7 not at fault for the goal but should have done better when O'Shea saved us in the 1st half

Silvestre: 7 good game, caught out for badly for the above incident though

Blanc: 7 Calm & assured as usual

Brown: 7½ great comeback, good to see him back to his best.

O'Shea: 8 mom, didnt put a foot wrong, great game

Fortune: 7 battled well, im beginning to understand that hes not a wide player

Scholes: 6½ out of position but was industrious

Veron: 8 pure class, was at the centre of all our play.

Giggs: 6½ good in flashes, still not willing to run with the ball

Ruud: 7did feck all apart from the goal.

Olle: 7 looked like our liveliest front player

 

[Livvie]

Originally posted by Murt:
<strong>
O'Shea: 8 mom, didnt put a foot wrong, great game

</strong><hr></blockquote>

O'Shea is the real shining light of the season. Seems as though he can play anywhere across the back.

 

[Red said Fred]

Originally posted by antonio:
<strong>

veron 5.5?? Crazy MOFO!!</strong><hr></blockquote>

Definitely a 5.5 if you know what he IS capable of! Just a shadow of the player he was during his Lazio days..

 

[Murt]

Originally posted by Red said Fred:
<strong>Definitely a 5.5 if you know what he IS capable of! Just a shadow of the player he was during his Lazio days..</strong><hr></blockquote>

In that case Di Canio was a 2 and Blanc a 3 <img src="graemlins/houllier.gif" border="0" alt="[Houllier]" />

 

[golden_blunder]

Barthez 7 - coped well with what came at him
O'Shea 8 - best defender on the pitch
Brown 7.5 - not far behind O'shea, very good considering its his first match back
Blanc 7 - steady, some good interceptions
Silvestre 5.5 - woeful support play. caught out on a few occasions.
Fortune 7 - used his body well to shield the ball. kept it simple in midfield, involved in the buildup for Ruuds goal.
Scholes 7 - good and bad. played in patches.
Veron 7 - had a brilliant first half, ran the midfield. Dissapeared second half.
Giggs 7 - i dont see why some websites thought he as MOM!? ran down blind alleys at times.
Ole 7.5 - worked his socks off, setup the goal for Ruud. Unlucky not to score himself.
Ruud 8 - scored. fantastic all round display. I havent seen control like that since Hughesy was wearing the United shirt.

 

[OldRed1]

Originally posted by Neil Thomson:
<strong>Barthez 7 - Good saves, could've done better for the goal.
O'Shea 7.5 - Did well defensively, tried offensively but isn't what he's good at.
Wes Brown MOM 8 - Great display for him, was everywhere, tenacious.
Blanc 7 - Was ok, some good interceptions.
Mickey 6 - Poor crosses, at fault for the goal.
Scholes 7 - Some good work, though not much to show for it.
Veron 6.5 - PL Veron, giving the ball away and not tackling, but some good movement.
Giggs 4 - Absent without leave, started to try in second half, but with no quality.
Ruud 7.5 - Bright display from him rightly led to a goal.
Ole 7 - Crossed for the goal, but otherwise quite quiet by his standards.


No subs made. feck knows why.</strong><hr></blockquote>

Did we only play with 10 men?


<img src="confused.gif" border="0">

 

[RUnited]

Originally posted by MauritianRed:
<strong>Disagree. We were leading until 5 mins to go, BUT that was a false reflection on the game. How many times didn't they get clear cut chances that they didn't take. Defoe was having a ball running behind our defence. Individually, O'Shea(some excellent display mixed with some very bad passes) and Brown were good. Blanc was alright, but showed no urgency at times. Silvestre was poor, and was caught ball watching for WH's goal. His positional play is fecking awful.</strong><hr></blockquote>

for what they had i thought they looked good, honestly.

Rio is out, Gaz has been dropped and appeared to have also suffered an injury on Thursday - he'll out for about 3 weeks..

considering it's brown (return from injury), JOS, Blanc, Silvestre i think they did fine.. had Rio or Gaz been there i would have definitely expected more.

 

[kitgs11]

Barthez 7 - fair goal keeping
O'Shea 8 - good defense & some good cross play from right.
Wes Brown 8 - played & tried hard since his been long rested.
Blanc 7 - good defense but lack some understanding with brown.
Mickey 7 - good contributed in defense but run off from left defense position sometimes.
Scholes 7 - good play but could have created more problems to the opponent's defense if his shot more accurate.
Veron 7 - too defensive & less contribution to the attack.
Fortune 7 - Tried hard & contributed to the first goal.
Giggs 6 - seems too tired to concentrate in the game.
Ruud 7 - good finishing & get improved to run down more in the midfield.
Ole 7 - good play but overloaded to play in right wing as well as striker.

 

[Red Indian Chief Torn Rubber]

Barhhez: 7. Played well but twice almost got caught out of position.
O'shea: 8 . simply awesome
Wes Brown: A bit shaky but good for some one just back form injury.
Blanc: 7: A great captain and calm as ever.
Silvestre: 6. Defensively good but has lost some of his early season forward spark

Ole: 6: 100% effort bu a tremendous lack of seroiusness infront of goal. Hard he been seroius we woul have won 6-1.
Veron: 5: Great first half then totally disaapearerd.
Fortune: 7. Has quickly got used to his former position at athletico Madrid.
Giggs: 3: Was never in the match.
Scholes: 6. Can definitely do better. But a good performance all the same.

Ruud: 7: Great goal. His attitude was better too.

 

[matt72]

the sooner people realise that sylvestre is not quite good enough defencivly the better, can be good at going forward but time and time again he has these lapses IMO he cannot read the game and is at fault for too many goals

 

[becks75]

Well I couldn`t watch the game. But there is some amazing spread in the ratings of certain players.
Murt and some others think that veron had a graet game (pure class), other people gave him a 5.
Some think Giggs was awful and by far our worst player. While some other people and most of the papers say that he played quite well and was one of our better players.
Football realy seems to be a difficult game. <img src="confused.gif" border="0">

 

[uranushk1]

Originally posted by Murt:
<strong>

In that case Di Canio was a 2 and Blanc a 3 <img src="graemlins/houllier.gif" border="0" alt="[Houllier]" /> </strong><hr></blockquote>

So you also agree that Veron is just like Blanc, a player who can only decline and can never be as good as his peak again?

 

[Livvie]

Originally posted by becks75:
<strong>Well I couldn`t watch the game. But there is some amazing spread in the ratings of certain players.
Murt and some others think that veron had a graet game (pure class), other people gave him a 5.
Some think Giggs was awful and by far our worst player. While some other people and most of the papers say that he played quite well and was one of our better players.
Football realy seems to be a difficult game. </strong><hr></blockquote>

I nearly did a topic on that. Opinions seem to be vastly different.

 

[uranushk1]

Originally posted by becks75:
<strong>Well I couldn`t watch the game. But there is some amazing spread in the ratings of certain players.
Murt and some others think that veron had a graet game (pure class), other people gave him a 5.
Some think Giggs was awful and by far our worst player. While some other people and most of the papers say that he played quite well and was one of our better players.
Football realy seems to be a difficult game. </strong><hr></blockquote>

I also haven't watched the game, but your question is easy to answer. Murt think Veron is player of the season even though he is so poor in the PL. That shows as long as Veron is walking on the pitch and make one or two nice passes Murt will give him at least 8 marks.

The Giggs situation is similar. Many people agree that Giggs has declined a lot this season, his speed slow down and he can no longer beat defenders. Yet there are still some people think Giggs has a good injury-free season. Why? It is because some people just don't know how good was Giggs when he was at his best. If a fan has followed Giggs since he was 18, I don't think he would say Giggs has a satisfactory performance in this season so far.

 

[Davo]

Originally posted by Murt:
<strong>,
Veron: 8 pure class, was at the centre of all our play.
</strong><hr></blockquote>

<img src="graemlins/lol.gif" border="0" alt="[Laugh Out Loud]" />

Love to see him have a bad game then...

 

[Murt]

Originally posted by uranushk1:
<strong>I also haven't watched the game, but your question is easy to answer. Murt think Veron is player of the season even though he is so poor in the PL. That shows as long as Veron is walking on the pitch and make one or two nice passes Murt will give him at least 8 marks.</strong><hr></blockquote>

Untrue, as long as he is performing better than those around him ill give him higher marks than them. Veron was our best midfielder yesterday and i grade him accordingly.

 

[uranushk1]

Originally posted by Murt:
<strong>

Untrue, as long as he is performing better than those around him ill give him higher marks than them. Veron was our best midfielder yesterday and i grade him accordingly.</strong><hr></blockquote>

Have you given Veron less than 7 marks in any PL match this season? How many times if you have?

 

[Murt]

Originally posted by uranushk1:
<strong>

Have you given Veron less than 7 marks in any PL match this season? How many times if you have?</strong><hr></blockquote>


<a href="http://www.redcafe.info/forum/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic&f=1&t=009348&p=2" target="_blank">http://www.redcafe.info/forum/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic&f=1&t=009348&p=2</a>

Veron: 5 started well but faded. <hr></blockquote>



Ill give him less than7 if he deserves it.
Your laughing at my suggesting him for player of the yr. If its so ridiculuos show me 5 players that have without a doubt performed better than him.

 

[uranushk1]

Originally posted by Murt:
<strong>



Ill give him less than7 if he deserves it.
Your laughing at my suggesting him for player of the yr. If its so ridiculuos show me 5 players that have without a doubt performed better than him.</strong><hr></blockquote>

If you're talking about CL, he is without doubt one of the top 5, or may be even the best one.

If consider PL, I'd say Veron is one of the worst, if not the worst, in the team. He was being substituted during a match more times than any of his teammates, and his scoring and assisting rate in PL are just shameful.

Consider EPL has more matches than CL and should be rated more heavily, I'd say Veron is the 7th or 8th best player of this season. Barthez, O'Shea, Beckham, Scholes, Keano, Butt and Ole are "without doubt" better than him.

 

[RUnited]

Originally posted by matt72:
<strong>the sooner people realise that sylvestre is not quite good enough defencivly the better, can be good at going forward but time and time again he has these lapses IMO he cannot read the game and is at fault for too many goals</strong><hr></blockquote>

he has done very well in place of Giggs who has suddenly changed his playing style to no dribbling down the line. considering that we have lost the least goals (almost the least?) in the EPL i'd say our defence has been pretty good.

honestly we need someone like him. who can play all the way up field.. it's very hard to train someone to be able to do this. i'd say he's not among our biggest problems right now.