I guess those are the breaks when your club exists solely to launder the image of a corrupt nation state.
Phil Foden - What Is His Potential?
- Thread starter Davs
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I guess those are the breaks when your club exists solely to launder the image of a corrupt nation state.
Does he? He keeps saying how wonderful he is but never gives him an opportunity to prove it. He’s paying lip service.
My post was about whether Phil Foden should've started today's game. You can turn every post I make into some sort of dig about ADUG, FFP, etc. if you want, but not sure if it's not going to make for great debate.
Back to the topic of the thread, I think Foden should've started in the midfield 3 because he deserves to play, not because Guardiola should feel obliged to give academy players charity minutes if they don't deserve to be in the team on merit. This is the second most important trophy for me, and I'm desperate for City to win it, so glad that Guardiola's intention is to play strong teams, but I think he got the team selection wrong today.
Who cares - everyone knows he's wasting his career at City and he'll end up at a mid to lower table PL club in the next 2-3 years.
Unless Pep puts him in consistently then you could be right!
Pep only plays with finished products, I can't see him getting a prolonged run in the team any time soon.
Imagine bragging about building the so called best academy in the world to not even give your youngsters 5 mins vs the mighty Swansea city and that two with a manager who everyone thinks (for some reason 
) gives youth a chance.
) gives youth a chance. His agenda is to win the UCL at all costs. Emphasis on 'costs.' His job will be done then
Indeed. Would be great to see them dumped out by Spurs, but can't see it happening sadly.
Remember how he said he wished he had 1,000 Dantes?He rates every player....every Bayern Munich player was "Super super super".
He’s done well in his limited opportunities, you were playing a Championship side taking the most expensively assembled squad in the history of football with you. The nauseating puff pieces in the newspapers about your academy are all part of the same facade to launder.....well - you know. It’s all hollow and comes back to the same thing that you don’t want to talk about but it colours and ultimately taints everything you do.
Sancho is 18. As is that Vinicious at Madrid.
So there are two? In the entire world...
There’s only one who won best player at an age group World Cup, however.
I think Guardiola wants to try to win any competition he enters. He is driven by winning trophies and success, and he picks the teams he feels are best able to accomplish that. I don't think he's driven by laundering the image of Abu Dhabi or the UAE, even if you may think this is a byproduct of City's potential success in the FA Cup. Evidently he didn't think Foden was part of the his best team today (I disagree with him).
Happy to talk about FFP, UAE, ADUG, etc. and debate where it makes sense and doesn't derail threads on other topics. I wrote a long post on the topic yesterday in the City 18/19 thread and have made plenty of posts in the FFP thread.
But in a month the question is “how many more games have 19 year olds played compared to him.”
And then you’re thinking well Dalot has played more at united. Sane was a teenager at Schalke. Martial was 19 when he signed for united. Hundreds of other examples.
And you’re thinking well Foden has played in 15 premier league games this season and he has. For a total of roughly 110 minutes of football. You’re a harder run in the cups from him playing less than 180 minutes in domestic competitions. He isn’t trusted v Swansea today and he’s supposed to be a class talent.
He’s 18. He doesn’t need to play now. But he needs to play soon and he won’t. Too many players are hyped before they do owt for the first team. Wilshere. Morrison. Possebon. Until you do summat in a game I don’t believe the hype at all.
Yup, but unfortunately for his be has to be better than Bernardo Silva, David Silva, KDB and Gundogan to get in our team.
Dominic Solanke was voted best player at the u20 WC in 2017. Should he play up top ahead of Firmino and Salah? Better yet Rhian Brewster was top scorer at the WC where Foden won player of the tournie, someone should compare his minutes to Fodens. Hardly makes them world beaters.
The 4 previous winners of the same award Foden got...
Nwakali (currently rocking out with Porto reserves)
Iheanacho (we all know his story, can't get in the Leicester team),
Julio Gomez (never got out of Mexico, I think...)
Sanni Emmanuel (I'll be honest I had to google this guy. Made 0 appearances for Lazio before peaking in the Isreali league)
So the last u17 WC best player who made it to the top is Toni Kroos.
I agree he needs to play a lot more, and unfortunately for the lad we don't have a B Team system for him to play. If you look at the league cup thread I was furious he didn't start the final, so much so it kind of killed my enjoyment of the win.
Dalot's competition is 2 aging fullbacks, Sane was at Schalke. Martial had no real competition when he arrived at United (he's also potentially a WC player) and was much more physically developed than Foden. Phil has to get minutes vs. the Silva's, KDB and Gundogan, he's trying to break through more players of higher quality.
Time will tell whether he's right to stay at City or whether he should follow Sancho out the door. Honestly though when should he play, who gets dropped for him?
I completely agree with your last sentence, talent alone is not enough, as I posted above look at who won best player at the u17 WC between Foden and Kroos. There is zero guarantee he'll be world class.
You’ve just listed the reasons why Foden should leave City.
The u20 World Cup is a little different because it happens during the league season so you often don’t really get the best players there all the time because by that age many of the best players are involved in league campaigns.
Nigeria have won a lot of titles because they are physically superior and overrun everyone. If that’s because Africans go through puberty sooner, age doping or a mix of both I don’t know. Either way, that’s why they have so many players that have starred in that competition that have disappeared.
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Thank you for your response. We are in agreement. I’m gonna watch the second half of Man United now. I hope your personal life is going well but I hope your football team struggles in the upcoming years.
Keeper beaten at his near post
Shaw made a show of
Sometimes, it's easy to blame the manager
Shaw made a show of
Sometimes, it's easy to blame the manager
Phil Foden's fault?
Pep’s, doing the bidding of his evil superiors....duh.
This seems an identical thread that was made about Jack Wilshire a few years ago. Let’s hope he makes more of his career.
Hardly good examples to prove your point, in fact it does the opposite, Solanke was at Chelsea, who refused to play him when he didn't want to go on loan or sign a new contract (a bit like another player currently on their books) and it seems Foden could be headed the same way as him, promising at 17/18 but simply not trusted to play during the years where playing time is needed.
And Brewster has been injured for over a year now, I'm sure he'd have had just as much, if not more playing time for Liverpool than Foden has for you guys if fit.
It's all guesswork by everyone though, he could get his chance at 21 and still be a world class player, or he could get it next season and fail miserably though.
One things for certain though, I wish Foden was a United player.
Good luck
Training and playing with top midfielders under the tutelage of one of the best managers, a former top midfielder, is not a bad option. Chances are he might learn more from D. Silva, KDB and Guardiola than regularly playing with mediocre players for a random manager. Quick success is not always the best thing for a youngster.
He should have gone on loan to West Ham with Lanzini out, Pellegrini likes good passing football and he'd have started as a CM or on the right, 3rd name on the midfield teamsheet after Anderson and Rice, with 1 or 2 of their extremely 12th placed midfielders (Antonio, Snodgrass, Noble) then completing the midfield depending on if they go 2 up front or no.
He'd have played 2000 minutes and be ready for big minutes next year.
He'd have played 2000 minutes and be ready for big minutes next year.
He has done that in the last 21 months.
There's only so much learning while watching you can do, there come a point where putting what you've learnt into practice, and making mistakes along the way, he's not going to learn much more after being in the first team squad for a year.
He's played more minutes than Pereira and about as many minutes as McTominay who are 4 years older than him.
Maybe he is going to play a lot more next season when D. Silva will turn 34 and Fernandinho 35.
Yh but, with due respect to McT & Pereira, there isn't really much hype around them. McT is a decent squad player and a lot of the caf don't mind if Periera leaves. We keep hearing that Foden is incredible but then seeing him play in the PL or CL is like waiting for a Blue Moon (see what I did there). Personally I don't think Pep is planning to stay long term so he just wants maximum points and maximum chances at winning stuff, if he develops a player or two that's great but he has been brought in to win the CL. IMO Foden should move or at the very least go on loan.
He just seems so small and frail, he has a silky touch and great technical quality but he just really seems like a little fella without the strength to hold off challenges. That being said, I've barely seen him play a match, only highlights but right now he's the one I've got the biggest doubts out of all the -20 potential prodigies.
Fair points but he is still 18 y.o. Many great midfielders did not start a single game at his age, including Xavi, Iniesta and our very own Scholes. Not going out on loan didn't hamper their development at all, did it?
Think people's view is skewed by Sancho's and CHO's development. Both are wingers and wingers tend to develop earlier. Giggs was starting games when he was 17 y.o. whereas Scholes made his debut when he was nearly 20 y.o. How many 18 y.o. midfielders are starting games in the best leagues (for good teams)?
Precisely this. The list of 18 year old central midfielders regularly starting games in the Premier League, let alone for a title chasing team, is a short one. But this topic gets bumped again and again as a talking point to criticise City's academy or Guardiola's use of academy players. Both City's academy and Guardiola's use of academy players are worthy of criticism as there have clearly been missteps, but Foden is just a really poor talking point to use for the critique, despite his obvious talent.
The reality is Foden is not going to be leaving City any time soon. He's just signed a new long-term contract and he's a City fan. I definitely wouldn't be averse to him going out on loan next season though, preferably within the Premier League to a team that plays decent football that will suit his style, and where he'd get more minutes than at City. West Ham or Bournemouth may be good candidates.
It'll be interesting to see what happens with FIFA's investigation on City academy transfers, which may result in a transfer ban, and which might negatively impact Foden in a rather ironic way. If we get a two-window ban that starts this coming window, then City will keep Gundogan even though his contract is running down, and he may start next season still ahead of Foden in the pecking order. If we don't get a ban, and Gundogan keeps refusing to sign a contract, then City will likely sell Gundogan and Foden will move up a place in the pecking order. So a transfer ban related to academy players may hurt an academy player in the short term. We'll see.
Yh this part is true, I guess if you have searing pace you can probably get into a wide role and then improve on the 'footballing' side as you play.
I wonder how good someone like Foden could be though if he was playing regular PL football. For example, City must have won ~50% of their PL games by 2 goal margins (or more) but yet has only had more than 20mins as a sub in the PL twice (WHUM & Cardiff). This to me suggests Pep wants to set records for goals scored and isn't too bothered about developing him, which isn't necessarily a negative for City but is for Foden's personal development.
I think Xavi actually did make his debut at 18, I think he scored in a cup final and then the season after became a regular with King Louis. Pirlo apparently made his debut at 15...that's a seriously long career!
He is doing the right thing by staying at City.
Really don’t get (well I do) the constant reference to Foden’s supposed lack of minutes at City. For his age, and the quality of the team he plays for, he’s getting his fair share. Not sure what people expect. Weekly starts? Ahead of who exactly?
We’ll see where he is when he’s 20, and he can make a decision on what he wants to do with his career then. For now, he’s played in every major tournament, started a handful of games at 18 too, and is coming along well I think.
We’ll see where he is when he’s 20, and he can make a decision on what he wants to do with his career then. For now, he’s played in every major tournament, started a handful of games at 18 too, and is coming along well I think.
Who is saying he should have weekly starts ? Playing more often and having weekly starts are two different things altogether.