That's not what I said though. What I said was that someone claiming that Ronaldo 'didn't have that much success at club level' is clearly someone who never saw Ronaldo play and doesn't understand how things were different then.
Nordic Ghost Yeti (Scandi Carroll) | Haaland at City
- Thread starter Samid
- Start date
He didn't though, I don't think anyone will say Harry kane had lots of success at club level, even if he's been one of the best strikers to play in the Premier league. Ronaldo didn't have much success at club level, having great performances is not the same as having success, which means winning things
Harry Kane has not won a single thing. Ronaldo won major trophies at almost every club he played for, and many of those teams did not have the advantages that superclubs have now. Winning the UEFA Cup was a big deal back then for example. Domestic cup competitions meant much more, they weren't the devalued mess they've become now.
Where's Haaland going to go when City get relegated to non-league football?
big lads!!
It's still not a lot of success at club level, if you look at other players at the same time who were considered the best, Zidan has much more impressive honours, Figo has way more impressive honours, I don't think Raul was ever considered the best player in the world but he had a far bigger trophy haul. To act as if playing for Barcelona, real and inter Milan and coming away with one league title and no champions league isn't a disappointing return is clearly wrong. Particularly given that Barcelona won the league in successive seasons once he left, and real had won two champions leagues very recently before he joined.
One league title was not considered a lot of success at any time, like I said you can argue that without injuries he'd have won a lot more, but he didn't and he had limited success at club level
Not saying Haaland is as good as Ronaldo on the ball but the timing of Haaland's runs yesterday for example was top class and elevated his team. Like for example one of his early chances was just a clipped ball over the top by Ake, nice pass but nothing unbelievable and Haaland timed the run perfectly, outran and outmuscled the defender and then nearly scored, how many forwards in world football would have done as well in that situation? Not many. And then the second goal, could be a foul on the keeper, but still the determination to press the keeper, which a lot of his kind of forwards don't do too much. Benzema does, but Mbappé wouldn't for example. Then the rebound, the leap to score it and time it right.
Anyway it's just an example of how he helps the team more than pure dribbling or first touch. I love Ronaldo but it's not right to say 'not remotely as good' when he's performing at the level he's currently at. He's only the 2nd player in L'Equipe history after Messi to get more than one perfect 10 rating in a match. If you look at his goal contributions per match, he's currently on Messi/Pele level. That's obviously contributing to the team in a considerable way.
yeah you wouldn't wanna mess with us
That's like saying ronaldo was a cl top scorer and winner just 4 years ago when he joined us but as it stood he was in heavy decline by then same as stoichkov.
The game has gone soft and that only benefits attackers.
Less offside goals though.
I agree with all of this and I maintain Haaland would of replictaed Ronaldo's success in the 90s if he played with PSV, Inter, Barcelona, Real and Brazil. Back in those days being primary a scorer was enough for success. Big, powerful goalscorers like Haaland would of ate!
Yeah you right about the age but what success Ronaldo have outside his goals? He never had a successful season when he scored few goals.
Stop hating on Stoichkov please
are you from St Louis?
Much harder to be a defender these days, and way fewer quality defenders around too.
Offside used to be level was offside in say Lineker's day, although to counter that you could get away with offside goals easier back then!
No I just live there
Haaland is an evolved form of Christian Vieri, and Vieri was a pretty great striker during the end 90s, so Haaland would absolutely strive during that era. He will become better than Lewa & Benzema's prime before 27.
Should not be compared to R9. He was a different kind of player.
Should not be compared to R9. He was a different kind of player.
Zidane has two more (European) league titles (mainly due to being in the right place at the right time) and one more champions league and that equates in your mind to 'much more impressive honours'. Especially when Ronaldo has more European club trophies than Zidane. But of course you don't get that the UEFA Cup and the Cup Winners Cup actually meant something back then. Even your absolute focus on the league and the Champions League as being the only trophies that are worth something shows that you don't understand generational differences. Ronaldo may well have won more without the injuries but it is wrong to say that he had limited success at club level.
Compare Zidane's club trophy list to that of Iniesta and Modric, two players with whom he is often compared. All of a sudden it looks like Zidane has had 'limited success at club level'
Read the thread, his goalscoring was only one aspect of his game, and that is why he was renowned (and still is till today) as one of the best players to ever walk the earth, this is quite obvious to anyone who watched him back then.
Obviously scoring helps, he also existed in an era where the style and artistry of the game were more celebrated than today.
Its like someone today asking why Zidane or Scholes were so great in seasons when they hardly got any assists
Just think like that, players like Messi / CR7 / Mbappe / Haaland / Benzema / Lewa - all have potentials to go in many list of top 20 players in their position of all time(for Messi/CR7 - probably top 5).
Compared that to defenders, do you honestly see any defender actually breaking top 20? I can not think of anyone barring Ramos/VVD, that too if I really try.
Its an era of attackers, and will remain till we get better era of defenders. I had read a stat that Maldini+Baresi have together conceeded only 23 goals per season in 6-7 seasons played together. Thats the type of defenders the 90s strikers used to be up against.
Compared that to defenders, do you honestly see any defender actually breaking top 20? I can not think of anyone barring Ramos/VVD, that too if I really try.
Its an era of attackers, and will remain till we get better era of defenders. I had read a stat that Maldini+Baresi have together conceeded only 23 goals per season in 6-7 seasons played together. Thats the type of defenders the 90s strikers used to be up against.
Last edited:
Well I mean he did compared to them, a lot of that is down to modric's longevity though. But Ronaldo had limited success compared to his peers who played at the same time, we're lt talking across eras, looking at players who played in the same era, and he's lacking compared to them. One league title is an underachievement, particularly if you're talking about someone as a GOAT
It's really not if you understand how things have changed. Also he has a title in Brazil but that will only confuse you further because you'll naturally assume that means exactly the same thing as it does now.
Ronaldo also won his first Ballon d'Or based mostly on his performances at club level, although he also played well in the Copa America that year. The difference between the Cup Winners Cup, UEFA Cup and Champions League was not anywhere near as big back then. Inter beating Lazio in the 1998 UEFA Cup final for example featured Nesta, Nedved, Mancini, Djorkaeff, Zamorano, Simeone etc.
Part of the problem is that defenders get slaughtered for every mistake that they make, even if they make 5 good defensive contributions before and after that. Seems worse now with social media. Doesn't happen with strikers, sure their mistakes are highlighted, but the goals they score more than make up for it.
The defenders were protected within systems, Maldini and Baresi are GOAT defenders that would excel in every era of football, but a lot of limited enough defenders were protected by everyone playing more defensively in outlook. In hindsight if we take a 70 or 80 year outlook, the 90s will be remembered as the deviation from the norm, rather than the standard, as the likes of Haaland are closer to some 50s, 60s and 70s records.
Part of the problem is that defenders get slaughtered for every mistake that they make, even if they make 5 good defensive contributions before and after that. Seems worse now with social media. Doesn't happen with strikers, sure their mistakes are highlighted, but the goals they score more than make up for it.
The defenders were protected within systems, Maldini and Baresi are GOAT defenders that would excel in every era of football, but a lot of limited enough defenders were protected by everyone playing more defensively in outlook. In hindsight if we take a 70 or 80 year outlook, the 90s will be remembered as the deviation from the norm, rather than the standard, as the likes of Haaland are closer to some 50s, 60s and 70s records.
Shearer as well. So many people talk about what a great player he was but he’s never talked about in the same bracket the true greats because he didn’t win much, and barely played European football.
I loved the guy bust as a matter of fact he was far from the player he once was by that time.
Ronaldo didn't really that great of team around him at barca or at inter for that matter, a ton of shiny names sure but it didn't operate too well.
Haaland is extremely impressive, but not the five goals yesterday. Penalty and four rebounds. I could have made them.
The im better at football than Erling Haaland line
But I actually am
Talent for dribbling and playmaking it's shown at early ages, what can change or improve it's accuracy in front of goal
Haaland hasn't shown anything to make people believe he will become a better dribbler and playmaker like R9, Henry or Benzema...not even Mbappe, considering that whenever his team isn't dominating he can't create anything for himself.
He will be one of the best strikers ever for sure, but i doubt he will become a top 15-20 player in history cause that requires more than just scoring a lot of goals.
Last edited:
Ooo you don‘t half tell ‘em
Well, certainly players 30 years ago were rated very high even if they didn't achieve much (in comparison to their talent).
R9, Zidane, and Dinho would be underrated nowadays due to not achieving as much as their talent suggest, since nowadays people seem to be obsessed with trophies, stats, xG, goals, and SofaScore/WhoScored, as the game it's becoming more robotic, mechanic, and more about work rate than talent.
That's why I also lost a bit of interest in football nowadays, don't care much about missing some games tbh.
Last edited:
It's so strange how easy it is yet no other player seems able to do it, almost as if being first to every rebound or in position for an easy chance is a very rare skill
Haaland is nowhere near the footballer that Vieri was. He’ll outscored him by orders of magnitude. But Vieri was a far superior player.
The underrating of late 90’s strikers, just because one has come along that’s a bit of a throw back is so damn odd. It was hard to be a quick, bullying forward back then. It’s easy now. Nobody plays against them now. Defenders of yesteryear had to do it most weeks.
Oh there are plenty, I'm sure there were many games Ronaldo or Messi could have been taken off but didn't. Comes down to being in the wrong place at the wrong time though and that's it
It's just not true that he doesn't create or pass well. Take the first so called "rebound" yesterday, where he pressure the goalkeeper into making a mistake, feed de bruyne and finally is there like a hungry wolf. Some of these posts are so goddamn stupid and void of any analysis, you'll wonder how people manage to collect their valuable likes.
No. He ended with 343 games for all clubs and 247 goals. Haaland I believe still is about 1 goal per game If you take all his teams and national team.
Not frail enough.
Frailties are but human, and it is for these that I love mankind all the more - Gandhi
Frailties are but human, and it is for these that I love mankind all the more - Gandhi
People still talking about how great Shearer was as a player.
As long he broke records in the PL, Harry Kane will always retain his reputation as one of the greatest strikers to play in PL.
EDIT:
Okay I forgot Shearer won PL with Blackburn, so ignore this post.
That's totally rational and completely justified. Defenders are there to stop things, strikers are there to score. You achieve the former by not making mistakes, you achieve the latter by trying a lot and succeeding a few times.
The perfect striker for United but because of our terrible owners we can’t compete at the very top at present. It’s amazing to see his numbers this season yet he is still criticised. I’m praying for the day he wants his move to Real.