No Flair Draft - QF - Physio vs Edgar

Who will win the match?

  • Total voters
    12
  • Poll closed .

Pat_Mustard

I'm so gorgeous they want to put me under arrest!
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PHYSIOCRAT:

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EDGAR:

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PHYSIOCRAT TACTICS:

Tactics – Direct/ Mixed
Formation – 433 in possession/ 442 is the organised defensive phase
Defensive Line – Balanced
Marking – Zonal

Pretty standard 433. Best has more of a free role whereas Figo will hold the width. With Junior in the inside left position and Evra overlapping this will ensure the best Best. I really like Alberto Spencer as the striker here because not only is he a pacy dribbler but also great in the air making him an all-round threat. Edwards gets to play his full B2B game with Cocu providing smooth ball playing at DM – I recently rewatched the Utd Barca game from the 98/99 season and Cicu was impressive holding the fort of a midfield three on Giovanni and Rivaldo!. Carlos Alberto can play make from deep and get forward on occasion. At CB the animal Vierchowod and the classy Chivadze.

Crazy pace from Vierchowod.

EDGAR TACTICS:

Formation: 5-3-2

No intro needed for Sepp Maier other than a GOAT in that position. A strong central defensive trio led by Augenthaler, a classic libero, solid and versatile to roam all over the backline and defensive midfield cutting off passes and putting in some crunchy tackles. He's very comfortable on the ball too making precision runs to support the attack. Flanking him are Forster & Gentile, two no nonsense stoppers comfortable centrally and out wide.

Carlos & Alves are top shelf wingbacks able to able to consistently deliver attacking output. Speed, able to carry the ball, good crossing, they can do it all. With the extra cover offered by the 3 man defence, their offensive abilities will be utilized in full.

A hardworking and strong B2B midfield base in Simeone-Tigana with Phil Foden bring in his ability to orchestrate this attack. Foden's best fit is through the middle, though he's quite flexible to drift wide as needed.

Hoeness-Muller is a proven combination winning 1974 WC, 1972 Euros (runner up in 1976) and 3 consecutive European Championships in 1973, 1974 & 1975. Hoeness is a hard working team player who's very versatile and comfortable all over the forward line (LW, CAM, RCM, RAM, RIF, RW) and would drop back linking with Foden to supply Muller and stretch the defence with his pace. Awesome workrate and a speedy runner he's compliments Muller in a proper well rounded attack.

Why I'll win:

My strong defensive setup is a perfect counter to Physio's wingers. Auge is a good fit against Spencer both in terms of physicality and playing style.

Muller is the best forward on the pitch and he has ample support from midfield and wings to break the tie in my favour.
 
A 5 at the back is a bad option against a 433 unless he is going man to man since it gives me more space in the front of the back line. The 3 man defence makes sense against a front two but not a lone striker. Also a 532 in the defensive phase very much surrenders space outwide (Scotland demonstrated this) as the 3 shuffle from side to side so I can see Best and Figo getting lots of joy linking with my midfield. Also with the addition of Chivadze I can progress the ball for quick counters very well - Chivadze, Cocu and Junior is a very smooth combo.

@Pat_Mustard Thanks for setting up.
 
Physiocrat said:
A 5 at the back is a bad option against a 433 unless he is going man to man since it gives me more space in the front of the back line. The 3 man defence makes sense against a front two but not a lone striker. Also a 532 in the defensive phase very much surrenders space outwide
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I honestly can't think of any situation where a back 5 is worse defensively thank a back 4.

Ague is pretty much an extra man and I would rate him as a better base for my midfield than Cocu (who I also rate highly). Foden through the middle is where he's best as we saw through his hat trick vs Villa and he'll be a handful even for Cocu.



Carlos and Alves are the best wingbacks by attacking contribution of all time and I just don't see them stopped here.
 
Edgar Allan Pillow said:
I honestly can't think of any situation where a back 5 is worse defensively thank a back 4.

Ague is pretty much an extra man and I would rate him as a better base for my midfield than Cocu (who I also rate highly). Foden through the middle is where he's best as we saw through his hat trick vs Villa and he'll be a handful even for Cocu.



Carlos and Alves are the best wingbacks by attacking contribution of all time and I just don't see them stopped here.
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541 works well as the wings are covered by the 4 but with a 3 it makes for suboptimal placement. I see the problem again and again when I see 532 played today (now maybe it is poor sides who play it so it is unfair to look at them). Here Best and Figo will have loads of space to up against your wing backs. Figo on Bobby is a match up particularly in my favour.

Also what's the point of a back 3 up against 1 striker?
 
Though I've pictured it in OP to showcase Foden as the #10, this may well be the same as below. The only reason I chose OP picture is to showcase Foden being more the playmaker and Uli to support Muller in the attack.

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Foden and Hoeness are both comfortable through the middle or out wide. Both will help pitch in midfield battles and provide the bridge to Muller. Foden's creativity and Hoeness's blistering pace is a nightmare for Cocu to defend against.
 
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Physiocrat said:
541 works well as the wings are covered by the 4 but with a 3 it makes for suboptimal placement. I see the problem again and again when I see 532 played today (now maybe it is poor sides who play it so it is unfair to look at them). Here Best and Figo will have loads of space to up against your wing backs. Figo on Bobby is a match up particularly in my favour.

Also what's the point of a back 3 up against 1 striker?
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When Best/Figo are picking the ball from deep, they'll have to contend with Carlos/Alves. Closer to the box it'll be a shared responsibility between Forster/Gentile and Auge with fullbacks pitching in.

As to back 3, it just the best fit. Putting a XI should not be driven by opposition tactics, but rather what fits best for the team.

Throughout history, so many top teams and managers have played a back 5, so I don't really understand the "only poor sides play it" angle of argument.

A quick cross from my wings will pretty much edge it for me. Between Foden and Hoeness, Cocu will be outmatched. Also, though he can do the job, I personally prefer him as a LDM in a midfield 2.
 
Edgar Allan Pillow said:
As to back 3, it just the best fit. Putting a XI should not be driven by opposition tactics, but rather what fits best for the team.

Throughout history, so many top teams and managers have played a back 5, so I don't really understand the "only poor sides play it" angle of argument.
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How many top sides have played 5 at the back against a front 3/ lone front man?

My point on poor sides was that my assessment of the 532 could be wrong and that it could be better than I think it is - that is the reason I think it is bad could just be because the sides I have recently seen play it have been poor.

That said I think defensively shifting Foden left and Hoeness right is a lot better as you can have the 541 shape. Still when you up against a 433, a 451 would make more sense to me.
 
Edgar Allan Pillow said:
Juve and Inter come to mind obviously having had consistent success with a back 5.
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Fair enough, that's right. Juve's was very much an attempt to get the best out of their players especially Pirlo and Bonucci for Juve. Does anyone have an article on how Juve played back then? I would be interested to see how they approached defending a lone striker. All this said, didn't many Italian sides still play two strikers back then?
 
@Physiocrat you are basing your views too much on that abysmal Scotland side from the other day, there are plenty of 5 at the back teams that did well in the modern game against "one striker"....im leaning towards edgar actually, there is something lacking in that midfield trio of physio and dont really like Spencer as a lone striker, would probably be okay but he was roaming all around so think he would be better with more freedom.
 
Physiocrat said:
Fair enough, that's right. Juve's was very much an attempt to get the best out of their players especially Pirlo and Bonucci for Juve. Does anyone have an article on how Juve played back then? I would be interested to see how they approached defending a lone striker. All this said, didn't many Italian sides still play two strikers back then?
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I don't think this has anything to do with opposition strikers, but the way my team functions.

The ability of Carlos or Alves to provide width and crosses is beyond reproach. What my set up here provides is for a free interchange of fullbacks vs Inside Forwards that will overload specific areas. Carlos (especially) and Alves were both excellent starting out wide and running inside once close to the box. The ability of Foden and Hoeness (especially) to stay wide and keep the fullback occupied open up lots of channels to get the ball in.

It is not really a rigid set up with everything needing to flow through Foden. But rather, Carlos, Alves, Auge, Tigana, Simeone all providing the ability to carry the ball up to the attack. I think this is a balanced set up that can adapt easily on the fly with tactically and positionally versatile players.
 
Edgar Allan Pillow said:
Though I've pictured it in OP to showcase Foden as the #10, this may well be the same as below. The only reason I chose OP picture is to showcase Foden being more the playmaker and Uli to support Muller in the attack.

drY0On6.jpeg


Foden and Hoeness are both comfortable through the middle or out wide. Both will help pitch in midfield battles and provide the bridge to Muller. Foden's creativity and Hoeness's blistering pace is a nightmare for Cocu to defend against.
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This is a much much better formation graphic that makes it look less tiresome and defensive.
 
Šjor Bepo said:
@Physiocrat you are basing your views too much on that abysmal Scotland side from the other day, there are plenty of 5 at the back teams that did well in the modern game against "one striker"....im leaning towards edgar actually, there is something lacking in that midfield trio of physio and dont really like Spencer as a lone striker, would probably be okay but he was roaming all around so think he would be better with more freedom.
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I can see the Spencer point to some extent although Best will cut inside quite a bit so he doesn't need to be entirely static.

I'm not just basing my view on Scotland but also on other games (IIRC Hungary in the World Cup).

What is off about my midfield three? To me it seems perfectly complementary. DM/DLP with a B2B and an attacking, creative 8.
 
@Himannv @Physiocrat no idea, just a feeling, its probably because im not that big of a fan of junior and i struggle to evaluate edwards...its a minor issue, bigger problem i have is spencer.

Best and Figo can drift in, but most of those will be with the ball so most of the time you need Spencer up top providing presence and thats a waste, same reason i hate seeing fenomeno up top alone.
 
Šjor Bepo said:
@Himannv @Physiocrat no idea, just a feeling, its probably because im not that big of a fan of junior and i struggle to evaluate edwards...its a minor issue, bigger problem i have is spencer.
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I can understand the Edwards comment but not the Junior one. Left of a midfield 3 seems like a nice fit for him. The little I've seen seems to indicate a good player in that position.
 
Himannv said:
I can understand the Edwards comment but not the Junior one. Left of a midfield 3 seems like a nice fit for him. The little I've seen seems to indicate a good player in that position.
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meant im personally not a fan of him, his role here is perfect
 
Physiocrat's individual quality shades it IMO. Only think that makes me pause is his great wingers are up against great fullbacks..
 
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