Martinez as the inverted fullback?

Pexbo

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Is this just an emergency or is this something we might see more of with De Ligt and Yoro playing in the middle?


The Zinchenko role, pivoting into the middle and an extra midfielder?
 
It kind of makes sense when you think of it. By pivoting into the central channel, Martinez can operate in a dual role, oscillating between an advanced-lying regista and a false fullback. This inversion could potentially disrupt the opponent's pressing structure, often dragging wide attackers out of position, which in turn opens up vertical passing lanes for the interior midfielders (Mainoo, Casemiro) or the advanced playmakers (Bruno, Mount).
 
I've thought all summer long, with the media insistence that we're after 2 to 3 CBs, that Martinez might be a 3rd choice LB.
 
Samid said:
It kind of makes sense when you think of it. By pivoting into the central channel, Martinez can operate in a dual role, oscillating between an advanced-lying regista and a false fullback. This inversion could potentially disrupt the opponent's pressing structure, often dragging wide attackers out of position, which in turn opens up vertical passing lanes for the interior midfielders (Mainoo, Casemiro) or the advanced playmakers (Bruno, Mount).
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Exactly and it’s a role a fit Shaw can play too.
 
Martinez as the inverted fullback could be a cool tactical shift! If De Ligt and Yoro are solid in the middle, it might be more than just an emergency fix.
 
Why would we move our best CB to LB? Top clubs or managers don't play their best players out of position and expose their weaknesses(lack of speed will show even more on fullback) even more when they are building their team. Especially clubs that are in transition and don't have sorted defence to begin with, let alone do wild experiments.
 
Also he is great passer from the middle, moving someone that starts our every attack wide where he sees less of the ball with our style of football would make us look even worse.
 
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No. Didn't work, and as you said, it was an emergency. We literally had no one else.

If Shaw can keep his lazy arse fit, then Martinez will be back in the middle next to one of Yoro, Maguire or De Ligt, if we sign him.
 
Think he'd do the job of an inverted fullback decently well, but dont rate inverted fullbacks as a thing so no thanks

Give me someone running down the sides to help our attackers and get some crosses in please. We dont get enough of it from wingers anymore, the last thing you need is fullbacks being your 7th and 8th central player clogging up the middle
 
Walters_19_MuFc said:
No. Didn't work, and as you said, it was an emergency. We literally had no one else.

If Shaw can keep his lazy arse fit, then Martinez will be back in the middle next to one of Yoro, Maguire or De Ligt, if we sign him.
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Yeah but malacia is dead and Shaw always injured so would hardly be surprising if we end up in the same position for much of the season
 
Matt851 said:
Yeah but malacia is dead and Shaw always injured so would hardly be surprising if we end up in the same position for much of the season
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As a club, that's where they need to make a decision on whether they should move one of them on and buy a starting left back.
 
Walters_19_MuFc said:
As a club, that's where they need to make a decision on whether they should move one of them on and buy a starting left back.
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Agree although guess we would end up in the usual position of being unable to move them on fur to wages
 
He’s one of the best center backs in the world. I’d much prefer if we could play him there but… needs have a must.
 
Didn’t like it. We don’t have the progressive passes in our central defenders with him on the left. Maybe it could work if Shaw was LCB, but then there’d be no point because you’d just play Shaw LB anyway.
 
Think it makes a lot of sense. Also helps that he is a player who is tactically clever enough and technically good enough to go into move into midfield or form part of a back three at times.
 
Very much a case of him being shoved out there because there's nobody else. Here's hoping that one of Mazraoui/Shaw/Malacia can be fit at any one time.
 
this is where Areta was going to use him if he had chosen arsenal. No idea if he'd excel at it, but Ten Haag is not the only manager to think he has the ball skills to make it work.
 
I hope that we don't use that option often — he is visibly uncomfortable defending there. But it's an interesting option to have, especially if the opposition's right winger isn't that dangerous one on one and we'll have both of Yoro and Ligt fit and playing well at the same time.
 
I think it worked from a positional standpoint to the structure of the defense, i.e when City broke through the midfield or Mainoo / Casemiro press and the ball gets played beyond them, there's enough runners in defense that recovery is more nuanced.

However, the issue as others have noted is in isolation he doesn't have the athleticism so can easily get turned inside out.

I think the long term play would be playing three across the defense and using fullbacks to maintain the width.

Martinez is the club's best defender and it's more of a subtraction to limit him being wider.
 
It is something that I figured we might see as an option at times, but not very often (unless we get a lot of injuries, which surely wouldn't happen at leftback... :lol: ). Martinez started really poorly in this match but that may have been just rustiness from not playing for a while. Improved after the first 30 mins though.
 
I think we tried it for 30 minutes and it was a disaster and then moved away from it. Hopefully we don't see it again.
 
Gene Loblaw said:
this is where Areta was going to use him if he had chosen arsenal. No idea if he'd excel at it, but Ten Haag is not the only manager to think he has the ball skills to make it work.
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he’d miss half the games because arteta would have hired someone to steal his boots.
 
I've been suggesting it throughout all summer.

A- 1 converted FBs is becoming a norm. City does it, Arsenal does it and even ETH at Ajax did it with Blind
B- We haven't signed a LB despite Shaw and Malacia being perma crock. We are instead buying a RB, and possibly 2 other CBs one of whom can play in the converted LB role
C- We are in no position to spend so much in a kid only to send him on the bench and he certainly didn't swap Real's bench for ours
D- Martinez-De Ligt aren't a great partnership. Both aren't the fastest, De Ligt is good in air but is hardly enough to cover for Martinez, both are very aggressive (2 Vidic aren't ideal) and both are leaders. They will keep stepping on each other toes. However Yoro is the Rio in that relationship
E- These days FBs are more then failed CBs. They dictate the defensive line to make sure that players won't fall out of the offside trap, they need to be superb in passing the ball and one of them need to help out in the middle when the wing back goes gung ho upfront
 
It might just be because he's not had much training, but thought he was terrible today. If that's indicative of what we can expect from Licha at lb, I don't want to see him there very often. Not sold on Mazraoui or Dalot playing there either, but it feels like we've decided not to get a lb for some reason.
 
Dazzmondo said:
It might just be because he's not had much training, but thought he was terrible today. If that's indicative of what we can expect from Licha at lb, I don't want to see him there very often. Not sold on Mazraoui or Dalot playing there either, but it feels like we've decided not to get a lb for some reason.
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Licha had been out for most of last season and he needs time to adapt. That defense is hardly ideal as well. I think half of the CAF can beat Evans/Maguire in a run.
 
Absolutely f**k no! Why change roles for one of the bestc centre backsin the world, our best player and thebest centre back by a mile since Rio/Vidic.
 
I think he can invert into midfield, but if we switch to a back 3 in possession, I'd rather have Martínez as part of that back 3, and for Dalot/Mazraoui to invert into midfield next to Casemiro instead.

So:

------- Casemiro - Dalot/Mazraoui

-- Martínez - De Ligt - Yoro

----------------- Onana

But maybe Martínez would be even better for our build up as a CCB in this in-possession formation, because he has more and better angles for his line breaking passes from there, but then I don't think de Ligt / Maguire / Evans would be good enough as LCB/RCB. All three are too slow to be anything other than CCB. Also more ideal to be in the centre of the defense as an organizer, which they are (because of the communication). Getting Branthwaite next summer would help massively with all this. Great LB/LCB option and could easily play together with Martínez and be a very pacey, strong wide defender if we switch to a back 3.

But this is just one tactical variation, as we have a good number of traditional full-backs too, in Shaw, Malacia, and Amass.
 
We can’t keep shoehorning players into positions that aren’t their best to cover, this was a waste of Licha, much like the false 9 was a waste of Bruno. They are important players and we need them in their strongest positions.
 
Against weaker opposition it's fine. Against City firing, not for me.
 
jesperjaap said:
Absolutely f**k no! Why change roles for one of the bestc centre backsin the world, our best player and thebest centre back by a mile since Rio/Vidic.
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This. Put players in their best position. And in his position, he is one of the best. Never got this weird fixation with trying Martinez as a fullback when there's no indication he would be better there.
 
Even with Yoro and De Ligt in the squad Martinez is still our best CB and thats where he should play. He's far to good of a CB to be shifted out of position.
 
Maybe if we were moving to a system like city and arsenal who basically have 4 centre backs. Could be bad news for rashford though, who needs Luke Shaw on the left to even resemble a footballer.
 
Samid said:
It kind of makes sense when you think of it. By pivoting into the central channel, Martinez can operate in a dual role, oscillating between an advanced-lying regista and a false fullback. This inversion could potentially disrupt the opponent's pressing structure, often dragging wide attackers out of position, which in turn opens up vertical passing lanes for the interior midfielders (Mainoo, Casemiro) or the advanced playmakers (Bruno, Mount).
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I hate modern football
 
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