Was Joe Montana the greatest quarterback you ever saw...I thought he was the man..Who do you think was the best quarterback you ever saw??
Joe Montana..The Man..The Legend
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The best one I have seen would probably be Farvre, altough he is still playing. The best QB ever to play the game must be Johny Unitas.
Altough Joe Montana was quite a good QB for that height. I think Elway was better than Joe, but that is just my opinion.
With 1 min to go in a superbowl, touchdown down, I would take Farvre to lead my team.
Altough Joe Montana was quite a good QB for that height. I think Elway was better than Joe, but that is just my opinion.
With 1 min to go in a superbowl, touchdown down, I would take Farvre to lead my team.
Its hard to say. Montana, Marino, Elway, Favre are definitely up there.
It's hard to compare eras in the NFL. In the 40s and 50s, forward passing was very limited. In the 60s, it was used, but more so in the AFL than NFL. In the 70s, the aerial attack blossomed with Tom Landry's new found coaching style and Roger Staubach's arm. The current trend really started in the early 80s with 'Air Coryell' in San Diego and Bill Walsh's West Coast. Such gunslingers as Dan Marino, Neil Lomax, AND Danny White produced gaudy stats in pass happy offenses.
I think Montana was a great leader, but I also think the system he played in produced the stats. 5 and 7 yard slants are not that hard to complete and the majority of the yards gained occur after the catch. Young and Garcia have continued that trend. Garcia owns the club record for passing yards in a season, but he's nowhere near Young's athleticism (for my money, Young was the best of all SF QBs). Montana was very accurate but what sets him apart was his thinking. He could feel the pocket collapse. He could see that 3rd or 4th option on the move. He was a great player, and even though I will be slagged, I think Montana is over-rated when considered the greatest QB. I think he's the perfect example of the system QB. Why? Young and Garcia are doing the same things he did and Garcia is an average QB. Montana was surrounded by all pro talent. Much like Bradshaw and Aikman. However, Montana was a great QB as they are measured by wins. But I'd take Staubach, Elway, and Marino any day over Montana, Young, and Favre.
My top 10 QBs:
1. Unitas
2. Staubach
3. Marino
4. Elway
5. Starr
6. Young
7. Graham
8. Montana
9. Favre
10. Bradshaw
BTW, I was a Montana fan despite the Cowboys being my fav team.
I think Montana was a great leader, but I also think the system he played in produced the stats. 5 and 7 yard slants are not that hard to complete and the majority of the yards gained occur after the catch. Young and Garcia have continued that trend. Garcia owns the club record for passing yards in a season, but he's nowhere near Young's athleticism (for my money, Young was the best of all SF QBs). Montana was very accurate but what sets him apart was his thinking. He could feel the pocket collapse. He could see that 3rd or 4th option on the move. He was a great player, and even though I will be slagged, I think Montana is over-rated when considered the greatest QB. I think he's the perfect example of the system QB. Why? Young and Garcia are doing the same things he did and Garcia is an average QB. Montana was surrounded by all pro talent. Much like Bradshaw and Aikman. However, Montana was a great QB as they are measured by wins. But I'd take Staubach, Elway, and Marino any day over Montana, Young, and Favre.
My top 10 QBs:
1. Unitas
2. Staubach
3. Marino
4. Elway
5. Starr
6. Young
7. Graham
8. Montana
9. Favre
10. Bradshaw
BTW, I was a Montana fan despite the Cowboys being my fav team.
Unitas was the greatest ever.
Montana the greatest I've ever personally seen, without question!
Montana the greatest I've ever personally seen, without question!
When I used to watch American Football in the eighties I always thought that Joe Montana was the best quarterback in the NFL...
ANd I haven't seen one as good since so in my opinion Joe Montana was the best, I went to the US for the first time in 1987 and I judged San Francisco to be the best place, my favourite anyway so I followed the 49ers...
That was when Joe Montana was at the height of his powers...
Just my opinion though...
ANd I haven't seen one as good since so in my opinion Joe Montana was the best, I went to the US for the first time in 1987 and I judged San Francisco to be the best place, my favourite anyway so I followed the 49ers...
That was when Joe Montana was at the height of his powers...
Just my opinion though...
Its impossible to compare QBs from the 60s to the Montanas, Elways, and Marinos of this world. The talent pool in the NFL wasn't nearly as high then, as it is today. There were less minority players around back then. For me you should make a list that 1970 and before, and 1970 and after.
I can only imagine the same wins and stats that would have been put up by Marino, Moon, Simms, Elway, White, Williams, etc. if they played in SF for Bill Walsh.
Sometimes the system makes the QB (Kurt Warner under Mike Martz).
Sometimes the QB is great and the system keeps him down (Elway under Dan Reeves).
Sometimes the QB is great and the system makes him a legend (Montana with Walsh).
Sometimes the QB and the system are equally crap (Jeff George under June Jones).
Sometimes the system makes a shit QB look good (Mark Rypien under Joe Gibbs).
Sometimes the system makes the QB (Kurt Warner under Mike Martz).
Sometimes the QB is great and the system keeps him down (Elway under Dan Reeves).
Sometimes the QB is great and the system makes him a legend (Montana with Walsh).
Sometimes the QB and the system are equally crap (Jeff George under June Jones).
Sometimes the system makes a shit QB look good (Mark Rypien under Joe Gibbs).
MrMarcello said:
The Broncos went to three SuperBowls under that system.
Raoul said:
More so due to Elway's play than the system. And the AFC wasn't exactly a strong conference in the mid to late 80s. Had Denver possessed a great RB, they might have won a SB in the 80s. I do remember Elway and Reeves parted on non speaking terms and some felt Reeves held Elway back.
I think the Broncos just encountered three very well coached teams.
NYG were a great team in 1986 and Denver only got to the SB on a miraculous drive at Cleveland. The SB was a blowout.
The 1987 season was another fortunate event- the fumble when it appeared Byner would tie the game late sent Denver on. The SB was a complete fluke of events in the 2nd quarter. Amazing how a team scores 35 points in one quarter...in the SB no less. Denver was dominating the first 15 minutes.
SF was a dominate team in 1989 and the AFC was weak. Denver had the top record at 11-5 but were no more than the 5th best team in the NFL. SF, Minnesota, LA Rams, NY Giants were all better than Denver that season. I don't need to point out the SB result.
I rooted for Denver in each of the 3 games although I knew they had no chance against SF.
The 1987 season was another fortunate event- the fumble when it appeared Byner would tie the game late sent Denver on. The SB was a complete fluke of events in the 2nd quarter. Amazing how a team scores 35 points in one quarter...in the SB no less. Denver was dominating the first 15 minutes.
SF was a dominate team in 1989 and the AFC was weak. Denver had the top record at 11-5 but were no more than the 5th best team in the NFL. SF, Minnesota, LA Rams, NY Giants were all better than Denver that season. I don't need to point out the SB result.
I rooted for Denver in each of the 3 games although I knew they had no chance against SF.
Anyway...Elway left his mark on the game by ending up with 5 Super Bowl appearances and 2 wins. He's easily one of the best ever.
Did I ever say Elway wasn't great? In fact, look at my list of Top 10 QBs. I believe you fill find Elway's name listed in this list (#4).
touchy touchy. 
Mr. M, you should put The Snake - Ken Stabler - on your list.
Alek M said:
Really he had that oppurtunity against the Broncos and failed. Elway Joe Montana or even Tom Brady deserves to be ahead of Farve in that scenario
Brady will probably end up in the Montana mold. Excellent at the fundementals and good enough to not make mistakes when the going got tough. Farve is more of a gunslinger. He'll also end up in the greatest ever pool, but it will be more of a Marino/Elway/Fouts type, as opposed to the Montana/Unitas model.
I think this Leftwich fella might end up in this list someday. Perhaps Vick, although I fear he may never have a solid team around him and end up like Randall Cunningham. And that's if Vick doesn't get killed running the ball so much.
I think Kyle Wright will be there someday.
Raoul said:
Agree somwhat but Elway isnt really in the same mold as Fouts or Marino. Those two are very similiar in the same ilk as Namath. Elway is with the Tarkenton Montana and Farve clan IMO. Unitas although great is more in the sonny jorgenson billy kilmer or Joe Kapp ilk.
my top ten
Unitas
Star
Montana
Elway
Bradshaw
Marino
Otto Graham
Farve
Tarkenton
Stabler
11. Brady
YMMV
manufanatic said:
Fouts and Marino probably deserve their own category, since they were so unique. Pure dropback passers with extremely quick releases. Their styles were very similar. There really aren't any more like them. Peyton Manning probably comes close but not completely.
How anyone could put Stabler and Tarkenton, not to mention Brady, above Staubach is beyond reason.
MrMarcello said:
personally i think you would have a better arguement for another cowboy Troy Aikman. Brady may have been a bit premature but he has won 2 superbowls and Everyone here would probably agree that Roger had more talent in Dallas then Brady has around him in New England.
I can see your point about stabler he and the dodger about the same but Fran Tarkenton should be well above staubach
Raoul said:
Your right R, They were unique and unfortunately never won the big one
manufanatic said:
Tarkenton is an all time great. He had the passing record until Marino passed him a few years back. His scrambling was superb. 4 Super Bowls no rings. Same as Jim Kelly. I think Aikman belongs more in the Bradshaw category. They had similar traits. Not too flashy, good at the fundementals, and both played on teams with excellent supporting casts.
Bradshaw (Harris/Swan/Stalworth/Steel Curtain) - Aikman (Smith/Irwin/Novacek/Dallas D of the early 90s). They were both able to win and not make mistakes when the game was on the line (the only exception being Aikman in the 94 NFC championship game).
For me Brady is obviously still an open case, but he seems to have a similar magic about him that Montana had. Maybe not as much, but then again he's only in his 5th year. You can just tell that something good is going to happen when Brady has time to pass - the same was true with Joe. If you asked me to pick one player to QB a team in the Super Bowl, then it would easily be Montana. Big game player if there ever was one.
The same that is said about Aikman and Bradshaw can be said about Montana. "Super Joe" had perhaps the greatest collection of talent assembled around him (actually, I would say Bradshaw had more). Montana had Craig, Rathman, Rice, Clark, Taylor, Jones, a superb OL although not on par with the Hogs or Boys mammoths. They had some very good defensive players too, including Lott. Montana was a standout QB, but just how much of his stats and wins were from the system he played in. Same thing critics use to bring down Aikman and Bradshaw they turn the other cheek when drooling over Montana. Don't get me wrong here...Montana was a great QB and one of my favs. But he wasn't exactly a one man show like Marino, Unitas, and Elway (the first dozen years).
MrMarcello said:
Rubbish. Montana had talent around him but it wasn't nearly as pronounced as Dallas with Aikman,Smith, and Irwin. Jerry Rice was only around for half of Montana's time and he hadn't fully blossomed during the peak of Joe's time in SF. The SF D was average as Super Bowl D's go. There was no running back to match Smith's consistency in Dallas. Wendel Tyler and Roger Craig weren't anything like Smith. John Taylor was a good receiver who was made to look like a star by Joe's accuracy. The early team of Solomon, Clark, Niemiyah etc, weren't anything like Dallas or Pittsburgh either.
Did Montana have less than Marino or Elway? Nope. Elway finally won with a true RB and some other good players around him. Marino never had that good RB, yet he constantly achieved success. Montana had Craig and although he was no Payton or Dickerson or Smith, he was one hell of a back. First RB to top 1000 rushing and receiving yards in one season. It's also imperative to mention the West Coast offense concentrated on the passing game more than the running game where as Pittsburgh and Dallas emphasized the running game.
Taylor was a solid #2 (probably over-rated just like Harper in Dallas), but the West Coast system produced the most yards after catch every season and Taylor had speed and made the majority of his receiving yards after the catch (to be fair, nearly all receives make the majority of their yards after the catch). The majority of Montana's passes were 5 and 7 yard slants/outs and dump passes to the RB and FB. It's a very efficient system and does not take the most accurate QB to make it work. However, Montana was very accurate and so was Young. But Garcia is doing the same thing as Montana and Young, and Garcia is nowhere near the QB those two were. System makes the QB in his case. Montana and Young and the West Coast were perfect together. Two great QBs in a great system.
Rice played 6 seasons under Montana (85-90) and by his 4th year he was considered the best WR in the league. In fact, Rice caught 22 TDs in 1987, his 3rd season. No other WR has topped 20 in one season.
Taylor was a solid #2 (probably over-rated just like Harper in Dallas), but the West Coast system produced the most yards after catch every season and Taylor had speed and made the majority of his receiving yards after the catch (to be fair, nearly all receives make the majority of their yards after the catch). The majority of Montana's passes were 5 and 7 yard slants/outs and dump passes to the RB and FB. It's a very efficient system and does not take the most accurate QB to make it work. However, Montana was very accurate and so was Young. But Garcia is doing the same thing as Montana and Young, and Garcia is nowhere near the QB those two were. System makes the QB in his case. Montana and Young and the West Coast were perfect together. Two great QBs in a great system.
Rice played 6 seasons under Montana (85-90) and by his 4th year he was considered the best WR in the league. In fact, Rice caught 22 TDs in 1987, his 3rd season. No other WR has topped 20 in one season.
MrMarcello said:
Montana, Marino, and Elway are all different types of quarterbacks, each with his own set of attributes that makes him great. We're discussing Montana here, so lets stay on topic. Joe Montana vs Aikman vs Bradshaw. If you want to talk about Marino, he was a great dropback passer with a lightning quick release who racked up over 60,000 yards. That's what he's known for. And no, Marino never achieved success. He had a cinderella year in 84 and never made it to the Super Bowl again. He just racked up amazing stats with his passing, which doesn't make him too dissimilar from Tarkenton, Fouts, Moon, and a few other very good passers who never won squat in the NFL. And its no coincidence that none of the afforementioned had a dominating running back, whereas Aikman and Bradshaw did.
As for Roger Craig, he was a good running back, a versatile running back - but he was no Emmit Smith, which is my point
MrMarcello said:
In Garcia's defence, they also don't have Walsh or Seiffert running the show. Mariucci and Erikkson aren't exactly brilliant like their predecessors in SF.
As for Rice, he wasn't considered THE best receiver in the league in the late 80s. Certainly one of the top young receivers at the time, but no one knew he would be such a freak of a legend at the time. Furthermore, if you look at Rice's career, he didn't fully develop into what the complete package until the 90s. He was more of a deep threat specialist in his early days, and became the possession guy in the early to mid 90s in SF.
All of the above posts ('cept for the one that says Staubach is not top 10) show what I say to most people: it's near impossible to compare NFL players from different eras. You should only compare players during a certain decade or stretch of years, especially WRs and QBs. The passing game really kicked off in the early 80s and was redefined in the 90s.
Still shocked that Bob Hayes is not in the HOF.
Still shocked that Bob Hayes is not in the HOF.
I'm appauled that the likes of Pelluer, Sweeney, and Laufenberg were left off.
Raoul said:I'm appauled that the likes of Pelluer, Sweeney, and Laufenberg were left off.
They sucked. Staubach is easily amongst the 10 best ever. Then again, it's hard to compare different eras.
Raoul said:I'm appauled that the likes of Pelluer, Sweeney, and Laufenberg were left off.
And you left out Hogeboom and Walsh.
MrMarcello said:
I wouldn't include Walsh in such esteemed company.
manufanatic said:
Have to disagree. Stauback was one of the greats. Aikman wasn't and Brady hasn't played long enough. When Staubach played the talent on Dallas was better than NE's, but the talent in the whole league was better as well. Tarkenton was a great scrambler, but an average QB. I think that the Snake was great, but he was no Staubach either.
MrMarcello said:
I agree with those exceptions, but otherwise it's a pretty good list. Staubach lost time in the Navy, but was a great great QB.
Raoul said:
He had a below average arm and I think had some records because he played for a long time. The real strength of Minny was its defense. He had some spectacular runs where he would retreat up to 40 yards, but for all tye running around he did he was pretty much an average or slightly better than average QB IMO.
Some coach once said Young was the left handed version of Staubach...mobile, accurate, strong arm, leader. Can't remember whom said this, but I want to say Landry or Siefert of some big name coach. Heck, it may have been a friend of mine who roots for the 49ers. Can't remember.
MrMarcello said:
I can see the comparison, but Roger was never as quick to run as Young and Young could never compare to Staubach in the last two minutes of a game. Roger was a better QB than Young.