Israel - Iran and regional players | Please post respectfully and stay on topic
- Thread starter Raoul
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I doubt my views on it are particularly welcome here, but making the connection to Israel just seemed dumb to me. They’d have absolutely no motive, it’s nothing like what they do, and they don't even seem particularly interested in taking on the proxies closer to home. if anything, theyve made conscious effort to isolate Gaza/hamas. Im not even sure Israel “have an interest” in it. That’s not the way to destabilise the regime.
I would not go that far. But I agree that I would not have had Israel at the top of my list.
Even if the attack wasn't the Israelis, there is still a significant proxy war going on between both sides at the moment, which will surely play into perceptions the other side is seeking to do them harm.
In the case of the Iranians, their primary proxy groups (Hamas, Hezbollah, and the Houthis) are doing all their dirty work for them and Israeli actions to strike Hamas, Hezbollah, as well as the US hitting Houthi targets to avoid shipping disruptions, are all disrupting Iran's goal of destroying Israel.
In the case of the Iranians, their primary proxy groups (Hamas, Hezbollah, and the Houthis) are doing all their dirty work for them and Israeli actions to strike Hamas, Hezbollah, as well as the US hitting Houthi targets to avoid shipping disruptions, are all disrupting Iran's goal of destroying Israel.
A bit off topic but I remember ISIS mistakenly attacking an IDF unit during the peak of the Syrian civil war and then swiftly apologising, claiming they were intending to attack Syrian armed forces. Did give me a bit of a giggle.
Do we need a separate thread for the current events in the Red Sea with the Houthi attacks on shipping?
You can post it in here since they are an Iranian proxy that are basically just intermediaries between Iran and Israel.
Alright!
Amir. Should have quoted.
Not that I defend Israel, they're a criminal state, but its not that Hesbollah, Yemen and others have been idle. There has been shooting between Hesbollah and Israel from the start of the all thing.
Also, nobody is mentioning hostages anymore, is Netanyahu capable of pushing Israel to all out war with everybody just to stay in power?
We'll never know if Israel is tied in any kind of way to the bombing, but what bothers me is that ISIS haven't uttered a single word since the Gaza massacre began. No "tough" talk, no threats, nothing. Now the first serious action ISIS takes in ages, while "fellow" muslims are massacred in the thousands in Gaza is to carry out a bombing in Iran which supports Hamas, two days after a high-ranking Hamas official is taken out on Hezbollah's turf.
When it comes to Israel, these vile sacks of shit are surprisingly lenient and have never tried anything serious against them while Israel has never been part of any anti-ISIS coalition. It is known that Israel has been not only providing medical assistance but also weapons to rebels during the Syrian Civil war, including djihadist groups like Al Nusra. Here's an interesting article as to why these two have never been at each other's throat. Israel's also suspected to have financed and trained MEK militants which wouldn't really be surprising.
Whilst there can be only speculations about wodunnit and what's the real motive behind the bombing, I personally think that Netanyahu's wet dream is to drag the US in all out war against Iran which he considers as the most dangerous threat. Especially because their nuclear program. Israel has been pushing for it for decades and the conditions right now are ideal, with the most lenient and subservient US administration there's ever been. It would also allow him to remain in power for a substantial amount of time. Ordering/paying a proxy to escalate the current conflict isn't that far-fetched, even if indeed basically impossible to prove.
When it comes to Israel, these vile sacks of shit are surprisingly lenient and have never tried anything serious against them while Israel has never been part of any anti-ISIS coalition. It is known that Israel has been not only providing medical assistance but also weapons to rebels during the Syrian Civil war, including djihadist groups like Al Nusra. Here's an interesting article as to why these two have never been at each other's throat. Israel's also suspected to have financed and trained MEK militants which wouldn't really be surprising.
Whilst there can be only speculations about wodunnit and what's the real motive behind the bombing, I personally think that Netanyahu's wet dream is to drag the US in all out war against Iran which he considers as the most dangerous threat. Especially because their nuclear program. Israel has been pushing for it for decades and the conditions right now are ideal, with the most lenient and subservient US administration there's ever been. It would also allow him to remain in power for a substantial amount of time. Ordering/paying a proxy to escalate the current conflict isn't that far-fetched, even if indeed basically impossible to prove.
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I don't think he'll go that far. A few days after the war with Hamas started, he worked very hard in order to avoid the strong attack on Hezbollah his minister of defence pushed for.
A wise choice given it would've needlessly escalated the war and been very bad for all parties concerned.
wouldn't be the first time
https://www.opendemocracy.net/en/north-africa-west-asia/isis-and-israel-on-golan-heights/
The article doesn't really establish this. If anything, it merely suggests Israel are more focused on their traditional adversaries of Iran, Hezbollah et al., and were at best non-antagonistic towards bordering tin pot Islamist factions opposed to Assad. They did provide some injured members of bordering groups medical care, but that was likely to extract Assad related intel out of them.
I like how you made up, from whole cloth, that bit about intel
And sure, they had an unwritten non-aggression pact, while Israel actively bombed Syrian adversaries of ISIS multiple times. A convergence of interests (which has happened again in Iran). Also made it funny when Israel started this war by saying the world should equate Hamas with ISIS....Give them room to operate and medical care?
I like how you made up, from whole cloth, that bit about intel
And sure, they had an unwritten non-aggression pact, while Israel actively bombed Syrian adversaries of ISIS multiple times. A convergence of interests (which has happened again in Iran). Also made it funny when Israel started this war by saying the world should equate Hamas with ISIS....Give them room to operate and medical care?
Its sourced from a link in the article you posted.
https://foreignpolicy.com/2014/06/11/exclusive-israel-is-tending-to-wounded-syrian-rebels/
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fair enough, but then this suggests that the cooperation was deeper than medical!
e - as far as i know, israel is the only entity that isis has apologised for attacking.
e - as far as i know, israel is the only entity that isis has apologised for attacking.
According to Aymenn Jawad al-Tamimi who is about as well-informed on the various Syrian factions as anyone on earth, this didn’t happen:
“Apart from a brief clash in November 2016 involving a few JKW members, no security incidents have arisen for Israeli forces. There is a misconception regarding the November 2016 incident that the Islamic State "apologized" to Israel for the matter. This myth was sparked by comments from former Israeli Defense Minister Moshe Ya'alon. No evidence supports the claim of an apology. Rather, the misconception has likely arisen from a garbling of the fact that the incident was not a planned attack on Israel, but was rather the reaction of a few JKW members to a perceived Israeli infringement on the group's territory. It may also be the case that JKW's leadership was angry with the JKW unit that engaged with the clash, not wishing to provoke a wider war with Israel. However, the reason for not wanting a wider war with Israel is simply a matter of priorities, not any kind of secret affinity, relations, or contact with Israel.”
https://aymennjawad.org/20017/israel-relations-with-the-syrian-rebels
The argument isn't secret affinity.
ISIS openly courted war with not just the Iraqi army remnants, not just Iran and its many proxies (including Hamas!), not just Syria/Assad, not just half the groups opposed to Assad, not just the Kurds/YPG, not just the Taliban in Afghanistan, but also civilians in Europe and the US and Russian militaries. Basically, every power in the world they could hit. It's really curious that this is the only one they very delicately avoided.
Well I'm addressing the specific claim regarding the alleged apology.
In any case as the article notes, during the Syrian war the ISIS affiliate group on the Golan was too busy engaged with fighting rivals and the Syrian regime. Apart from that one isolated faction that was not part of the original group with its origins in Iraq, ISIS had no common frontier with Israel in the context of the Syrian War (the jihadi group in the Sinai that subsequently pledged itself to ISIS is another story). ISIS's strength was centred on the opposite side of Syria and in Iraq. In the space between, which included the heavily-contested Aleppo-Hama-Homs-Damascus axis, a crazy variety of insurgent groups operated, as well as the regime and its own militias. Similarly ISIS struggled to establish a direct area of confrontation with Jordan, and despite hosting a massive number of Syrian refugees throughout the war ISIS attacks on or in Jordan were extremely rare.
If the argument isn't something along the lines of "secret affinity", I'm left wondering what exactly is being implied?
an unwritten alliance of convenience, which ISIS didn't usually have against their other enemies (mutually antagonistic to each other).
Just because the Israelis didn't attack some border faction doesn't mean they were in alliance with them (nor vice versa). They simply had bigger fish to fry - the Israelis in dealing with Hamas, Hezbollah, and Iran, and the "YMB" in dealing with Assad.
ISIS frequently prioritized fighting rival rebel groups rather than the Assad regime throughout the war as well, it's not really evidence of any degree of alliance, more that in the context of that war at times they demonstrated pragmatism when the situation demanded it.
In any case, what has this got to do with the attack in Kerman? Your initial response seemed to imply previous instances of Israeli-ISIS collaboration in launching such attacks?
The post I replied to seemed to be mocking the idea of such a thing, I was pointing out it isn't so far-fetched.
But do you think the war with Hezbollah might happen in the near future if things go on like this?
If it goes on like this then something will happen - because the current circumstances prevent the Israeli citizens who were evacuated from towns near the northern border from returning to their homes. Israel will have to do something.
But - I expect things to die down, as niether side wants a full escalation. Both sides have too much to lose.
Having said that, there's always the fear of a miscalculation from one of the sides which will get the other to react. Not just in the last few weeks - that fear has been there since the 2006 war. And I do expect that eventually, one day, a war will happen. Hezbollah hasn't been building their arsenal of rockets and missiles just to look at them.
Somewhat.
This one truly hits different
.I guess they can be now interviewed by Piers Morgan since they condemned Hamas.
Not sure if this is the right thread but it seems relevant enough.
Shit is about to go down?