Is the defensive line still too low?

[Wednesday at Stoke]

I can't see a place that lists how high teams set their defensive line but watching on the tele, it feels like United are still starting too far deep while playing an aggressive man marking press at the front, which in turns leads to players having to cover more ground if the opposition plays through the first line of pressure. I thought getting Onana, who is supposed to be the extra man in build up and having pacier center backs was meant to reduce the space between our defense and attack, shrinking the pitch, but this still doesn't look like it has transpired?

 

[fergiewherearethou]

There is always so much space between our lines, which is a big problem and we concede so many chances. Why it happens, I don't know, I expected us to be more compact with less space between the lines, especially now, when is no Maguire.

 

[Eddy_JukeZ]

I do wonder how it compares to our line from last season(even though the sample size is miniscule).

There must be a stat for this somewhere, but I'm unaware which site potentially has it.

 

[dinostar77]

Yes, tifo I RL, said that it should be higher, but it may that players are still adjusting.

 

[Trex]

Against Wolves they played a mid block against us and we struggled to play through it, against Tottenham the idea was to counter press them and we were effective in the first half. We can only move the line higher when we push teams back and pin them deep during prolonged spells.
I think Forrest is the sort of opponent we should be looking to pin back (wolves as well to be fair). We will see how successful we are at playing through the opposition.

 

[leeroyTX]

I think it feels that way because the midfield has been a mess. Mount just doesn't seem to know what his role is and where to be...which is leaving Casemiro (who's off to his own bad start) to get overrun once the ball is turned over. It's spreading out the back line leaving too many gaps.

I would like to see them push higher and pressure Nottingham from the get go. I do worry about getting countered though. Absolutely have to get the first (4) goal(s).

 

[RedStarUnited]

Whatever it is, we are just not compact enough. I noticed in the Palace Arsenal game, whenever Palace broke Arsenal always got their shape back pretty quickly. When teams break against us, we are all over the place.

 

[Devil You Know]

Our defensive line and possession stats have actually got worse under EtH than they were under Ole:

Season	Manager	Possession	Goals scored	Height of defensive line
19/20	Ole	54.6%	66	45.07m (5th highest in the league)
20/21	Ole	54.5%	73	46.16m (4th highest in the league)
21/22	Mostly Rangnick	52.1%	57	42.82m (14th highest in the league)
22/23	EtH	53.8%	58	42.92m (14th highest in the league)

 

[Oranges038]

It's 2 games in.

Lets see how it looks after 20.

 

[Teja]

There must be a stat for this somewhere, but I'm unaware which site potentially has it.

It is a bogus stat mostly, doesn't take game state into account. At the very least you need a lot of context to interpret it correctly which most people don't have the interest in doing.

If you sit back and invite pressure, then yes your average height will be low. We've done that a lot in early ETH days where we took a 1-0 lead and immediately sat back in a mid block.

Conversely, if you go down a goal often, the opposing team will sit back and invite pressure leading to your defensive line height necessarily being higher.

It doesn't say anything about the phase of play (when you're in phase one -- i.e., attacking and in the other team's half, how high are your CBs?)

 

[Red Indian Chief Torn Rubber]

Since we are wedded to the high press we need to play a much higher line to support casemiro

 

[Crashoutcassius]

Our defensive line and possession stats have actually got worse under EtH than they were under Ole:

Season	Manager	Possession	Goals scored	Height of defensive line
19/20	Ole	54.6%	66	45.07m (5th highest in the league)
20/21	Ole	54.5%	73	46.16m (4th highest in the league)
21/22	Mostly Rangnick	52.1%	57	42.82m (14th highest in the league)
22/23	EtH	53.8%	58	42.92m (14th highest in the league)

I've been reading on the forum that when we replace Maguire and ddg it will be instantly fixed

 

[JPRouve]

It doesn't matter how high the defensive line is when he defensive block isn't compact enough and no one really has tactical covers. There is no synergy in our transition.

 

[Plastic Evra]

I think the biggest variance in those numbers are the defence. To be confirmed this season but another campaign keeping it under 60 goals would be good.
On defensive line height 3 meters or so is apparently where half the league stands...

 

[Devil You Know]

I've been reading on the forum that when we replace Maguire and ddg it will be instantly fixed

The whole thing is based on assumptions rather then reality. With Maguire especially, I think a lot of people are using stereotypes and Twitter narratives.