Herr Musk | Fascist

Fecking hell. One person mentioned Musk’s (alleged) autism as a possible factor in his behaviour on stage. And that person has an autistic son, is probably autistic himself and immediately retracted the suggestion as soon as he realised Musk made the salute twice.

I made a similar suggestion (also based on a clip where he only made the salute once) but never mentioned autism, only his habit for making awkward and bizarre, dorky physical movements on stage. I also retracted that suggestion when I found out he did it twice.

I have no idea what’s being said on X about what happened but why not stick to addressing what’s being said on redcafe, on redcafe.

The extreme sensitivity and self-righteousness on display in this thread is quite something.
 
Pogue Mahone said:
I got annoyed at people who took that initial post as some sort of defence or denial of his politics. Which is a stupid response, considering I made it clear that wasn’t my intention in the original post. I find stupid responses annoying. Although, to be clear I’m not actually angry!
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The pile-on you've received illustrates why the left/libs can often feel so insufferable.

It's not enough that you clearly oppose Musk. You need to be outraged in the exactly same way they are.
 
Pogue Mahone said:
Fecking hell. One person mentioned Musk’s (alleged) autism as a possible factor in his behaviour on stage. And that person has an autistic son, is probably autistic himself and immediately retracted the suggestion as soon as he realised Musk made the salute twice.

I made a similar suggestion (also based on a clip where he only made the salute once) but never mentioned autism, only his habit for making awkward and bizarre, dorky physical movements on stage. I also retracted that suggestion when I found out he did it twice.

I have no idea what’s being said on X about what happened but why not stick to addressing what’s being said on redcafe, on redcafe.

The extreme sensitivity and self-righteousness on display in this thread is quite something.
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good statement.

looking forward to your next speech at the klan rally. the last one received the longest standing heil of anyone so far.
 
VP said:
The pile-on you've received illustrates why the left/libs can often feel so insufferable.

It's not enough that you clearly oppose Musk. You need to be outraged in the exactly same way they are.
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Yup. And @Dr. StrangeHate got the exact same treatment despite being considerably nicer and less prickly than I was when challenged. You can’t win with this lot. The intentions are good but it doesn’t feel that way. Interesting timing coming the same day as Trump’s inauguration. Almost as though the two are connected.
 
Pogue Mahone said:
Fecking hell. One person mentioned Musk’s (alleged) autism as a possible factor in his behaviour on stage. And that person has an autistic son, is probably autistic himself and immediately retracted the suggestion as soon as he realised Musk made the salute twice.

I made a similar suggestion (also based on a clip where he only made the salute once) but never mentioned autism, only his habit for making awkward and bizarre, dorky physical movements on stage. I also retracted that suggestion when I found out he did it twice.

I have no idea what’s being said on X about what happened but why not stick to addressing what’s being said on redcafe, on redcafe.

The extreme sensitivity and self-righteousness on display in this thread is quite something.
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anyone minimising a nazi salute, at the inauguration of the president of all places, is quite something
 
Pogue Mahone said:
Yup. And @Dr. StrangeHate got the exact same treatment despite being considerably nicer and less prickly than I was when challenged. You can’t win with this lot. The intentions are good but it doesn’t feel that way. Interesting timing coming the same day as Trump’s inauguration. Almost as though the two are connected.
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Ah yes, its the damn libs fault that perfectly normal, centrist dads voted in a Nazis. If only they are a little bit nicer....
 
Pogue Mahone said:
Fecking hell. One person mentioned Musk’s (alleged) autism as a possible factor in his behaviour on stage. And that person has an autistic son, is probably autistic himself and immediately retracted the suggestion as soon as he realised Musk made the salute twice.

I made a similar suggestion (also based on a clip where he only made the salute once) but never mentioned autism, only his habit for making awkward and bizarre, dorky physical movements on stage. I also retracted that suggestion when I found out he did it twice.

I have no idea what’s being said on X about what happened but why not stick to addressing what’s being said on redcafe, on redcafe.

The extreme sensitivity and self-righteousness on display in this thread is quite something.
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You brought this upon yourself and have no one else to blame. Playing devils advocate for the sake of it adds nothing to the discussion and is just some self righteous act of masturbation for you. Get over yourself.
 
HTG said:
You brought this upon yourself and have no one else to blame. Playing devils advocate for the sake of it adds nothing to the discussion and is just some self righteous act of masturbation for you. Get over yourself.
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:lol: Wind your neck in. Devil’s advocate would be saying he was justified in doing a Nazi salute or saying it isn’t a big deal. I did none of the above.
 
Tarrou said:
anyone minimising a nazi salute, at the inauguration of the president of all places, is quite something
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This is a discussion forum. Random theories and speculation are the life blood of this place. Even if they’re fairly easily proved incorrect. Which is what happened here. Frothing outrage over these particular speculations just seems a bit unnecessary. Whatever, though. The mob has had their pound of flesh. So it’s all good.
 
Pogue Mahone said:
This is a discussion forum. Opinions and observations are the life blood of this place. Even if they’re fairly easily proved incorrect. Which is what happened here. Frothing outrage over these observations just seems a bit unnecessary. Whatever, though. The mob has had their pound of flesh. So it’s all good.
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sure and I'm telling you I believe that the reaction was completely justified mate

do you see the irony at your own reaction at their reactions?
 
VP said:
The pile-on you've received illustrates why the left/libs can often feel so insufferable.

It's not enough that you clearly oppose Musk. You need to be outraged in the exactly same way they are.
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That's extremely disingeneous. The issue here is to give the idea that a man that is publicly sharing far right propaganda didn't actually mean to make a far right gesture. It's an issue for two reasons, first some people may not know what Musk is doing on X and they need to know and understand that he is on the far right and not just a dork, the reason is that it's insulting to anyone that knows what Musk is, it's like telling us that this shit toast is in fact nutella.
 
I think most people have the common sense not to do something that looks like a nazi salute.

He is stupid, but not that stupid. He knew what he was doing.
 
VP said:
The pile-on you've received illustrates why the left/libs can often feel so insufferable.

It's not enough that you clearly oppose Musk. You need to be outraged in the exactly same way they are.
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What are you thoughts on the matter I wonder?
 
Pogue Mahone said:
Honestly, no. You’ll have to explain the irony to me.
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sometimes moral outrage and panic are justified reactions to a sick society, for example Russia carving up a piece of Ukraine or Israel stealing a country

if Elon musk did a goofy nazi salute at comic-con or something you might have a point

this was at the inauguration of a president, by someone who has effectively paid-off that president to be a proxy vice-president and mould policy in his favour, who also just so happens to be doing Nazi'ish and fascist looking things on the regular, out in the open

if there is no moral outrage or panic now, we're literally fecked as a society
 
JPRouve said:
That's extremely disingeneous. The issue here is to give the idea that a man that is publicly sharing far right propaganda didn't actually mean to make a far right gesture. It's an issue for two reasons, first some people may not know what Musk is doing on X and they need to know and understand that he is on the far right and not just a dork, the reason is that it's insulting to anyone that knows what Musk is, it's like telling us that this shit toast is in fact nutella.
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That’s all true but only applies to anyone who continues to insist it wasn’t a Nazi salute, after it was pointed out he did it twice. So nobody on redcafe. There is a 100% consensus on here that he deliberately did a Nazi salute. And pants are remaining resolutely twisted.
 
Pogue Mahone said:
That’s all true but only applies to anyone who continues to insist it wasn’t a Nazi salute, after it was pointed out he did it twice. So nobody on redcafe. There is a 100% consensus on here that he deliberately did a Nazi salute. And pants are remaining resolutely twisted.
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unfortunately for you, pogue, you made a mistake, and those kind of things just aren’t tolerated by the likes of me who have never done anything wrong in their lives.
 
Tarrou said:
sometimes moral outrage and panic are justified reactions to a sick society, for example Russia carving up a piece of Ukraine or Israel stealing a country

if Elon musk did a goofy nazi salute at comic-con or something you might have a point

this was at the inauguration of a president, by someone who has effectively paid-off that president to be a proxy vice-president and mould policy in his favoue, who also just so happens to be doing Nazi'ish and fascist looking things on the regular, out in the open

if there is no moral outrage or panic now, we're literally fecked as a society
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Ok, yeah. I’m with you. Now we’ve established it was definitely deliberate I’m all in on the outrage. I’m not for one moment saying we can’t attack Musk for what he did. It’s disgusting.

I just got triggered by the exchange with @Dr. StrangeHate over the last couple of pages. Where he expressed a personally well informed opinion and was willing to change his opinion when he got more information and still ended up at the bottom of a self righteous pile-on. That was a bit naff.
 
JPRouve said:
That's extremely disingeneous. The issue here is to give the idea that a man that is publicly sharing far right propaganda didn't actually mean to make a far right gesture. It's an issue for two reasons, first some people may not know what Musk is doing on X and they need to know and understand that he is on the far right and not just a dork, the reason is that it's insulting to anyone that knows what Musk is, it's like telling us that this shit toast is in fact nutella.
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No it isn't. I read the original post and Pogue's subsequent clarifications. There is no way it deserves the sort of pile-on it actually triggered.
 
langster said:
People saying they don't believe Musk is that stupid ...

Ffs. He's a complete and utter fecking moron. He's also incredibly arrogant and narcissistic with an ego the size of Trump's. He's also the richest person on earth so he feels entitled and untouchable and he honestly thinks most people like or agree with him because of his Twitter following.

The salute is nothing compared to some of the shit he's posted or said on Twitter. I don't get why people are surprised. The forums Centrist dad has had a shocker trying to defend it today and now it's being excused or explained because of his autism. Why can't people just accept the man is a fecking evil cnut and one that isn't anywhere near as smart as many think or portray him to be.
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I think Elon has only rudimentary knowledge of designing electric cars, rockets and coding. But I do believe he has good to great sense about business/trends, because of which he is in charge of such fantastic companies. Those companies have moved on from him though other than the Cyber truck and only his name is now associated with them.

I just don't understand what has happened with him. Has he been brain washed by right wing propaganda, is this who he is, is he just really thick and by chance he made great business acquisitions. Yes his money does play a role in me not believing he is that stupid. Because this is not just purely inheritance we are talking about, he has been at the right place several times (PayPal, Tesla and SpaceX) to become the richest person on that planet.
 
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If you’re not aware of his stock:

Pexbo said:
It’s beyond edge lording. He’s the grandson of Canadian Nazi’s that emigrated to Apartheid South Africa because that was the place for them to be. He retweets Nazi propaganda on his own platform and has relaxed the rules on far right and Nazi content to the point where people can message Jews that they are going to put them in a gas chamber and the result of reporting it is “This message does not break community guidelines”. Meanwhile using the word “Cis” result in the tweet being deleted.


I don’t get why people are so keen to dismiss his worst behaviour as him being a bit of a nerd. He holds and shares very extremist views and he’s now got the ear of POTUS.We are in a dangerous timeline and trivialising his behaviour because it fits into your “everything he does is because he’s a painfully uncool nerd” narrative does nobody any favours.
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Plus openly supporting fascist and far right causes wherever he can.

What benefit of the doubt is there supposed to be?
 
Pogue Mahone said:
:lol: Wind your neck in. Devil’s advocate would be saying he was justified in doing a Nazi salute or saying it isn’t a big deal. I did none of the above.
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As an autistic person, I got taught that when people keep misunderstanding me and my intentions, it might be my fault and not theirs. So I keep adapting and try to communicate in a matter better suited for others. It’s what reasonable people do. Even if it doesn’t always work.
You however have decided that anyone who ever criticises the mighty you must be wrong and misunderstands you for no reason other than being overtly sensitive and self righteous. It’s absolutely impossible for you to be in the wrong and everyone else needs to change.

And then they say autistic people lack empathy and social skills.
No need to reply. I know I’m wrong after all and every one mistreats you.
 
Pogue Mahone said:
Ok, yeah. I’m with you. Now we’ve established it was definitely deliberate I’m all in on the outrage. I’m not for one moment saying we can’t attack Musk for what he did. It’s disgusting.

I just got triggered by the exchange with @Dr. StrangeHate over the last couple of pages. Where he expressed a personally well informed opinion and was willing to change his opinion when he got more information and still ended up at the bottom of a self righteous pile-on. That was a bit naff.
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yeah fair enough, that's understandable
 
VP said:
No it isn't. I read the original post and Pogue's subsequent clarifications. There is no way it deserves the sort of pile-on it actually triggered.
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If you are going to broadcast things on the internet on delicate topics, think them through. This is not the caf in 2006 where everyone knows each other. Perhaps the pile on wasn't deserved but that's just proportionate to the number of people reading it and what it appears to say.

It's funny because Pogue isn't a nazi sympathiser, but this hasn't happened in a vacuum and he is a renowned contrarian who does argue for the sake of it a lot, so maybe it's as much who said as what is being said.

If you are going to post something that may be interpreted to be mitigating the rise of fascism, just be careful how it's worded. This is not an argument about a red card or offside.

And if you do post something that may be misinterpreted, just apologise instead of telling everyone that they are idiots and turn it into some culture war nonsense.

Pogue's post was a hilarious clusterfeck and any of us not addicted to online 'debate' can see that. That includes everyone still arguing about it.

Pogue is not a Nazi sympathiser, he's just mostly not doing his job. We are Redcafe at his employers are all concerned about this.
 
Best part is that on X he just endorsed tweets which made a joke about it in the sense of it was just him giving hearts and waving.

That's ok then.
 
i don't think "autism" is a valid excuse, most people have explained why. he has been on many rallies before with thousands of people, and never done anything like it. strange moment to start.
i do think there's some possibility with @Pogue Mahone theory of being awkward and missing what he was supposed to do. he is after all, horribly awkward.

however, given his politics, i think he knew how this would look. i think he did it deliberately, precisely to have this kind of discourse. did he mean it, why aren't people angry, why are you being unkind to the neurodivergent...
the right loves doing something that looks bad but also deniable, and then laughing at the loser left and woke libs for pointing out they're doing something that looks bad.

 
Both Elon and Trump work by creating information overflow.

This wasn't dorky, and I doubt he dreams of Adolf either. The idea is to keep people talking about inconsequential things.
 
VP said:
No it isn't. I read the original post and Pogue's subsequent clarifications. There is no way it deserves the sort of pile-on it actually triggered.
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People largely commented on the first post and then he had a back and fourth with a couple of other posters. There was no actual pile-on and the amount of reaction to the initial post was totally justfified, in fact there is no way Pogue didn't expect that amount of responses to his original post.
 
Pogue Mahone said:
Yup. And @Dr. StrangeHate got the exact same treatment despite being considerably nicer and less prickly than I was when challenged. You can’t win with this lot. The intentions are good but it doesn’t feel that way. Interesting timing coming the same day as Trump’s inauguration. Almost as though the two are connected.
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You’ve literally done the same thing tbf. Be a prickly righteous dickhead when challenged and then continue to argue with everyone, but it’s all the children who are wrong?

Almost as if Centrisrs being wrong and completely oblivious/intransigent to it and then punching left to soothe their own egos is partly how we’ve ended up here too.
 
berbatrick said:
i don't think "autism" is a valid excuse, most people have explained why. he has been on many rallies before with thousands of people, and never done anything like it. strange moment to start.
i do think there's some possibility with @Pogue Mahone theory of being awkward and missing what he was supposed to do. he is after all, horribly awkward.

however, given his politics, i think he knew how this would look. i think he did it deliberately, precisely to have this kind of discourse. did he mean it, why aren't people angry, why are you being unkind to the neurodivergent...
the right loves doing something that looks bad but also deniable, and then laughing at the loser left and woke libs for pointing out they're doing something that looks bad.

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Yeah, that theory works. The awkward body language theory falls apart knowing he did it multiple times. Someone else suggested it was intended as physical version of internet trolling. Trying to impress 4Chan et al by offending the libs. Which also makes sense considering his behaviour online over the last few years.
 
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