Great U23 midfielders in the PL

[andersj]

An extensive list:




Since 2010 there have been very few young midfielders coming through at the top clubs. Yes, Rice and Caicedo have been very good at club not competing. But at the top clubs, there have been so few.

In fact, I struggle to name one from Man City, Liverpool, Chelsea, Arsenal or Man Utd. There have been a few attacking midfielders (Mount, Alli), but very few midfielders that «have made it» to an extent where they have dominated in the PL or been close to world class.

The last player I can think of was Fabregas. Does Mikel deserve a mention? Before that, maybe Fletcher? But he was not that popular at a young age even among a few Man Utd-fans. Going back, there has obviously been plenty.

In fact, it is not just «young talents coming through». There is just a few if you include young talents that clubs have invested in. A player like Billy Gilmour was once considered a huge talent. I remember he was great at youth level. Last year, he really did not do much at a club below the best at Brighton. This year, at the age of 22, it is starting to look like he will be ready to play regularly for a club who will be aiming for top six.

At the same time, we appear to pin our hopes on the likes of Mainoo, Mejbri and even Gore. It seems like a huge stretch to think that any of these will be ready to play regularly for a club with ambition of challenging or competing at the top in the PL.

 

[Dazzmondo]

Foden, Mount, Alli, Wilshere (excellent for a short time), Aaron Ramsey (same) are probably the only examples at top clubs.

 

[andersj]

Foden, Mount, Alli, Wilshere (excellent for a short time), Aaron Ramsey (same) are probably the only examples at top clubs.

First three probably as attackers? Maybe Wilshere and Ramsey, but in my opinion they are rather examples of talents who just did not make it.

 

[Remember the geese]

Not a stretch at all. Mainoo and Hannibal are very good talents. I think Mainoo in particular will be a terrific player for us.

 

[Oranges038]

Very few.

If you go back further when has a top team produced a world class midfielder in the last 20/30 years?

 

[andersj]

Not a stretch at all. Mainoo and Hannibal are very good talents. I think Mainoo in particular will be a terrific player for us.

I don’t deny that they are. I think Carrick and Lampard was huge talents too. But they did not really make it at great teams before the age of 25-26. Luka Modric played wide at Spurs at the age of 24 (in Zagreb at 23). Playing in midfield at this level require not only talent in terms of ability and physique, but maturity.

(My biggest concern with Mainoo is the injuries.)

 

[dcrompton]

Centre-mid is maybe hardest position for young players to break through due to both the physicality, stamina and technique required for the role. Players breaking into big teams under 23 tend to be generational talents like Keane, Vieira, Gerrard and Fabregas. If you look at class of 92, Butt broke through first mainly due to his physicality that made him stand out in the youth team but Scholes who ended up as the best CM started upfront due to his stamina and only moved to CM in his mid 20s. Fletcher was probably the next CM talent from our youth team but he started on the wing and again didn’t establish himself until mid 20s. Currently Mainoo is the best youth Project I’ve seen since 92. Shame he got injured as I actually think he may have started the season as a starter in this new role of RB/inverted CM that he played against Arsenal in pre-season and that Partey and Caicedo have played for Arsenal/Brighton

 

[FortunaUtd]

Interesting observation. It is indeed hard to find an example. @dcrompton gives good reasoning why. Pogba would be a name that comes to mind, but he also had to leave the PL to break through.

Very few.

If you go back further when has a top team produced a world class midfielder in the last 20/30 years?

Your question also refers to the PL, or generally? And with "produced", you mean coming through the youth ranks, or would you also include breaking through at a very young age?

In PL, it is only Fabregas?

In the rest of Europe, if I attempt to take stock, there would be
- Barca with the Xavi, Busquets, Iniesta midfield, then Thiago, and now Pedri.
- Bayern with Schweinsteiger (another case of starting out as an winger and only establishing himself as a top CM at a later age) and now Musiala.

Stretching the "produced" definition slightly more, you would also have :
- Kroos and Kimmich at Bayern (although Kroos broke through as an attacking midfielder, was still being used on the wing on loan at Leverkusen).
- Gündogan became world class at Dortmund at age 21/22 (then a top team..)
- Bellingham at Dortmund as a teenager (stretching the "top team" definition now..). He is still just barely 20, excelling at Real Madrid.
- Verratti joined PSG aged 20, I believe

Atletico produced a couple of midfielders performing well at a young age in Koke, Saul and Partey. Koke was arguably world class for a good while.

 

[Oranges038]

Interesting observation. It is indeed hard to find an example. @dcrompton gives good reasoning why. Pogba would be a name that comes to mind, but he also had to leave the PL to break through.


Your question also refers to the PL, or generally? And with "produced", you mean coming through the youth ranks, or would you also include breaking through at a very young age?

In PL, it is only Fabregas?

In the rest of Europe, if I attempt to take stock, there would be
- Barca with the Xavi, Busquets, Iniesta midfield, then Thiago, and now Pedri.
- Bayern with Schweinsteiger (another case of starting out as an winger and only establishing himself as a top CM at a later age) and now Musiala.

Stretching the "produced" definition slightly more, you would also have :
- Kroos and Kimmich at Bayern (although Kroos broke through as an attacking midfielder, was still being used on the wing on loan at Leverkusen).
- Gündogan became world class at Dortmund at age 21/22 (then a top team..)
- Bellingham at Dortmund as a teenager (stretching the "top team" definition now..). He is still just barely 20, excelling at Real Madrid.
- Verratti joined PSG aged 20, I believe

Atletico produced a couple of midfielders performing well at a young age in Koke, Saul and Partey. Koke was arguably world class for a good while.

Fabregas really should be counted as another Barca player. He was at Arsenal about a week before Wenger started playing him as a 16 year old.

Young midfielders breaking through early at top clubs doesn't happen that often, but there's a lot of different reasons why.

For me, I think the big one is that midfield is one of them positions where you have to be really intune with the game to make an impact from a young age, it takes times to develop the understanding of the game. For most it takes 4 or 5 years to build up their knowledge and understanding of the game to really get to grips with it and make an impact at the top. They also tend to end up having to play out of position or in multiple positions before really nailing it down, Modric, Keane, Kroos, Schweinsteiger etc all played in different positions from time to time before settling into midfield.