ESPN's Top 100 Athletes since 2000.

charlton66

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Where do I start with this? Michael Phelps as number 1? Definitely, the greatest Olympian, but greatest athlete - not for me. I can see why he was chosen, but IMLTHO his greatest achievements come every 4 years whereas all the other top athletes are competing and winning on a much more regular basis. He is definitely a phenomenal athlete but that alone would rule him out for me. Serena Williams at number 2 is another problem. She is certainly the greatest woman tennis player of all time, but the only other woman in the top 100 is her sister Venus, whereas on the men's side we have probably the 3 greatest tennis players of all time, all who have played since 2000; Federer, Nadal and Djokovic so for me, just in terms of competition, they would all be above Serena. Then at 3, the athlete I would consider to be the real number 1 - Lionel Messi. Breaks my heart to say it, because I'm a big Cristiano Ronaldo fan, but Messi is the best there's ever been. Not just 25 years, the best ever (and I've seen Pele, Maradona and most of the rest who would ever be considered as the GOAT). My other gripes include 24 of the top 100 being basketball players. I love me some basketball, but 1/4 of the greatest athletes of the last 25 years being from a sport that while having grown tremendously worldwide since 2000 is still predominantly American is just out and out ridiculous. Last but not least, they actually throw in a token cricketer at number 97 - Virat Kohli. He definitely deserves to be in the top 100 and much higher than 97, but in the last 25 years we have possibly the best test batsman of all time (or at least since Bradman) in Steven Smith and he doesn't even get a mention. Also, where's Ponting, Warne, Murali, Jimmy etc... If you dont know anything about a sport don't mention it at all. Terrible, terrible list.

https://www.espn.com/espn/story/_/id/40446224/top-100-athletes-21st-century
 
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I think they're a little bit biased.


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It says it’s based on 70,000 from ESPN contributors. With that numbers, I assume it’s just readers right? Makes it all a bit moot. When we got down into the 30’s there were people I’ve never heard of before.
 
I think the top-13 is reasonably fine. After that their lack of knowledge of non-American sports becomes very apparent. Sticking with the sports they’ve included and the criteria that seems to apply, Max Verstappen seems like the strangest omission to me.
 
Immediate impression is very basketball heavy (and subsequently highly skewed towards the US as a whole).

Like what is the criteria for ranking the likes of D-Wade, Dirk, Steve Nash ahead of Jon Jones?
He is both a better athlete than them all and far more accomplished in his sport.

I don't know if any of those 3 (with admittedly limited knowledge) are even in the conversation of getting in an all-time starting 5, whereas Jones is the greatest ever in his field.

Participation levels can't be that big a deciding factor if there are fecking NASCAR drivers in this list...
 
Obviously no one outside of the US will take it seriously. Phelps first is defendable on his Olympic medals count, but swimming is the only sport can rack up so many golds, so how can you compare that to other sports? Biles from a very niche gymnastics and with only one good Olympics to her name ahead of Bolt and even Cristiano is laughable. Serena ahead of Messi is a bit funny too, even if I am a big fan of her. Many footballers, male and female, should be way above some fecking baseball or NFL nonames.
 
Not going to do a top 100, but my top 12 (which of course only includes sports I actually know something about) would be;

Lionel Messi
Cristiano Ronaldo
LeBron James
Phil Taylor
Novak Djokovic
Roger Federer
Rafael Nadal
Tiger Woods
Michael Phelps
Serena Williams
Tom Brady
Stephen Curry

Honorable mentions: Patrick Mahomes, Ronnie O'Sullivan

Still predominantly American, but I've lived here 40 years, so I guess it's sports I'm most familiar with.
 
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Jev said:
I think the top-13 is reasonably fine. After that their lack of knowledge of non-American sports becomes very apparent. Sticking with the sports they’ve included and the criteria that seems to apply, Max Verstappen seems like the strangest omission to me.
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it’s a list of top athletes, not a list of top “gifted a world championship, then romping home in a car 2 seconds a lap quicker than the rest of the field”s.
 
Thierry Henry being the third highest rated footballer is pretty fecking funny when you consider he doesn't even get into the top 5 for the Barcelona team he played for. He's also ahead of Zidane :lol:
 
No rowers, no cyclists, a multitude of low level basketball players. Embarrassing really that they put this type of stuff out.
 
Lance has murdered America's interest in cycling so much.... I mean, it can't be a steroids issue either, Bonds is there.

Though I do like the sole inclusion of a cricketer for engagement reasons... as well as acknowledging there's a few more sports outside of NBA, NFL, MLB, Athletics, Golf and Tennis. But even by their own logic, not including Ohtani is beyond bizarre, as well as Gronkowski... two dudes who broke their sports, to a degree.
 
Taurasi ahead of Mayweather is hilarious. Also why is KG so high on the list. He's not better than Wade or Jokic.
 
I don't understand these lists. Including athletes from different sports and ranking them in the same list, makes no sense to me.

Anyway, all these lists (like the ones the rolling stones do) are really pro american biased and awful because the criteria are so vague. Ronaldinho, one of the most talented football players ever existed, at nr 94 while Marta, Henry and Xavi in front of him (by some distance too), just shows how bad these lists are.
 
led_scholes said:
I don't understand these lists. Including athletes from different sports and ranking them in the same list, makes no sense to me.

Anyway, all these lists (like the ones the rolling stones do) are really pro american biased and awful because the criteria are so vague. Ronaldinho, one of the most talented football players ever existed, at nr 94 while Marta, Henry and Xavi in front of him (by some distance too), just shows how bad these lists are.
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I think the list is terrible, don't get me wrong, but I don't think they're actually trying to rank one athlete/sportsman against another per se. I think they are actually trying to rank their relative legacies/impact on their own sports relative to one another. They've just done a really, really poor job at it.
 
Suggesting that Phelps only competes every 4 years is insane. First of all it not true. Secondly, do World Cups not matter now?
 
charlton66 said:
I think the list is terrible, don't get me wrong, but I don't think they're actually trying to rank one athlete/sportsman against another per se. I think they are actually trying to rank their relative legacies/impact on their own sports relative to one another. They've just done a really, really poor job at it.
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So essentially they are comparing sports. Which again is baffling. I m not following Cricket but I m sure they are millions (perhaps even a billion) who adore some certain athletes, try to emulate them and rank them high and don't care at all about Phelps or Biles.

And I am sure that Ronaldinho has been copied by hundreds of millions in every football pitch there is. Only behind Messi and Cristiano.
 
charlton66 said:
Not going to do a top 100, but my top 12 (which of course only includes sports I actually know something about) would be;

Lionel Messi
Cristiano Ronaldo
LeBron James
Phil Taylor
Novak Djokovic
Roger Federer
Rafael Nadal
Tiger Woods
Michael Phelps
Serena Williams
Tom Brady
Stephen Curry

Honorable mentions: Patrick Mahomes, Ronnie O'Sullivan

Still predominantly American, but I've lived here 40 years, so I guess it's sports I'm most familiar with.
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Steph or Lebron over Kobe Bryant?

Floyd Mayweather is easily in the top 10
 
The holy trinity 68 said:
Steph or Lebron over Kobe Bryant?

Floyd Mayweather is easily in the top 10
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Not a big boxing fan, so I don't know enough to make that call.

As to Steph and LeBron over Kobe, I've had that discussion on the NBA thread numerous times and I'd take either one over Kobe who I believe is massively overrated.
 
UnrelatedPsuedo said:
Suggesting that Phelps only competes every 4 years is insane. First of all it not true. Secondly, do World Cups not matter now?
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It's not that he only competes every 4 years, it's that most of the credit that pertains to his legacy comes from events that only happen every 4 years.

As to World Cups, I have Ronaldo 2nd on my list (rightly or wrongly) and he's never been close to winning a World Cup. It's what he has done in the 20+ years of his overall career that matters to me.
 
led_scholes said:
So essentially they are comparing sports. Which again is baffling. I m not following Cricket but I m sure they are millions (perhaps even a billion) who adore some certain athletes, try to emulate them and rank them high and don't care at all about Phelps or Biles.

And I am sure that Ronaldinho has been copied by hundreds of millions in every football pitch there is. Only behind Messi and Cristiano.
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....and I'm sure their lists would be much different. Like I said, I only tried to create my top 12 based on sports I actually knew something about. It's certainly not definitive. I think trying to create something that supposedly includes all sports like ESPN tried to do is ridiculous.
 
charlton66 said:
Not a big boxing fan, so I don't know enough to make that call.

As to Steph and LeBron over Kobe, I've had that discussion on the NBA thread numerous times and I'd take either one over Kobe who I believe is massively overrated.
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That is a take. I love Kobe, but Lebron is an easy pick over him, how anyone thinks thats a debate is probably too bias. I think you could make a case for Steph too I'd probably agree with it but to suggest Kobe is massively overrated might one of the worst sporting opinions Iv heard.

I can go with Phelps at 1 even if I would go for someone's else it's not absurd to suggest that one. The rest is weird. Bolt being 9th might be the worst in the top 20. Having the NBA, NFL and MLB take up almost 60% of the list is a good laugh. Having so few boxers, 1 cricketer, no rugby players or cyclists or winter sport athletes. I get people will say its a US company doing a US list but it's not sold in that way. They sell it as a world list, they even said they asked around the world.
 
charlton66 said:
Not a big boxing fan, so I don't know enough to make that call.

As to Steph and LeBron over Kobe, I've had that discussion on the NBA thread numerous times and I'd take either one over Kobe who I believe is massively overrated.
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Mayweather made his debut in 1996 and retired in 2015 (I don't count the McGregor match) with a record of 49-0, 50-0 if you count McGregor.

He had 19 title defences from 2000 to retirement, along with fighting in 26 continuous world championship bouts.

He won the world title in 5 different weight classes.
 
Rooney1987 said:
That is a take. I love Kobe, but Lebron is an easy pick over him, how anyone thinks thats a debate is probably too bias. I think you could make a case for Steph too I'd probably agree with it but to suggest Kobe is massively overrated might one of the worst sporting opinions Iv heard.

I can go with Phelps at 1 even if I would go for someone's else it's not absurd to suggest that one. The rest is weird. Bolt being 9th might be the worst in the top 20. Having the NBA, NFL and MLB take up almost 60% of the list is a good laugh. Having so few boxers, 1 cricketer, no rugby players or cyclists or winter sport athletes. I get people will say its a US company doing a US list but it's not sold in that way. They sell it as a world list, they even said they asked around the world.
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"Massively overrated" is all relative. I would have him in my top 10 all time players, but I've seen many people have him in the top 5 and even as high as number 2. That, to me, when you're talking about the best of the best is "massively overrated."
 
charlton66 said:
"Massively overrated" is all relative. I would have him in my top 10 all time players, but I've seen many people have him in the top 5 and even as high as number 2. That, to me, when you're talking about the best of the best is "massively overrated."
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That is fair and I would probably agree you on that.

I read ESPN had NBA tv rights in play when doing this so probably played a part. The list seems to be a mix of BBCs sports personality of the year and who is the actual best athletes. Feel like the people doing the voting went for different things.
 
charlton66 said:
"Massively overrated" is all relative. I would have him in my top 10 all time players, but I've seen many people have him in the top 5 and even as high as number 2. That, to me, when you're talking about the best of the best is "massively overrated."
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Forget about Kobe man, your list doesn’t include MJ either :lol:
 
RobinLFC said:
Forget about Kobe man, your list doesn’t include MJ either :lol:
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Pre-2000. List is only supposed to include athletes from the last 25 years. I'm ignoring MJ's Wizards career and pretended it didn't happen.
 
charlton66 said:
It's not that he only competes every 4 years, it's that most of the credit that pertains to his legacy comes from events that only happen every 4 years.

As to World Cups, I have Ronaldo 2nd on my list (rightly or wrongly) and he's never been close to winning a World Cup. It's what he has done in the 20+ years of his overall career that matters to me.
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Phelps will be over the moon that you’re disregarding his World Championship medals along with all the others.

Regarding rightly or wrongly… Ronaldo second on a list of greatest sportspeople of the last 24 years is utterly insane.
 
charlton66 said:
Pre-2000. List is only supposed to include athletes from the last 25 years. I'm ignoring MJ's Wizards career and pretended it didn't happen.
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Oh okay fair enough, missed that! Lots of GOATs contenders since 2000 if you think about it then.

I’d add Kipchoge, no idea where he fits in.
 
UnrelatedPsuedo said:
Phelps will be over the moon that you’re disregarding his World Championship medals along with all the others.

Regarding rightly or wrongly… Ronaldo second on a list of greatest sportspeople of the last 24 years is utterly insane.
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I understand Phelps won many World Championships outside the Olympics, but as I said his legacy amongst the average fan base (once again, rightly or wrongly) is predominantly built on his Olympic achievements. A lot of people obviously agree with you since he was picked at number 1. As I said in my original post, I can understand why he was chosen, he just wouldn't be my pick.

As to Ronaldo being at number 2. For me, that wasn't a difficult choice. He's the all time leader in goals scored, both at club and international level. He's won league and cup doubles in 3 of the top European leagues. He's won 5 Champions League titles, the Balon d'Or 5 times and also has more international caps than any player in football history. He's not as good as Messi, but IMLTHO he's no worse than the 4th best player of all time and personally I'd have him at number 2.
 
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Imagine how upset Ronaldo is at not making the top 10 when Messi is 3rd.

It’s a stupid list, but the thought of him sitting at home on his sofa treadmill with a pout on his face makes it worthwhile.
 
diarm said:
Imagine how upset Ronaldo is at not making the top 10 when Messi is 3rd.

It’s a stupid list, but the thought of him sitting at home on his sofa treadmill with a pout on his face makes it worthwhile.
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Hey, he is 2nd on my list, so I'm sure that cheered him up.
 
I don’t really understand the criteria. If it’s best athlete in the true sense of the word, then no golfer should be on there.

But if it’s who has been the best and most dominant in their field, then I don’t think anyone comes close to Tiger Woods for anywhere close to a similar length of time.
 
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