Nicky Butt is playing at a higher level than Roy Keane over the past 6-8 months.
Discuss.
Discuss.
Controversial topic of the week....
- Thread starter Raoul
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Keane is a disruptive influence on the team. I recommend we sell him to Leeds for 10m and bring in Ferdinand for 40m. To build our defence, we should also get Nesta, Thuram, Ayala etc.
Are you Ichk in disguise ?
Originally posted by Gazza:
<strong> To build our defence, we should also get Nesta, Thuram, Ayala etc.
Yuk. No thanks.
Ferdinand will do. Ferdinand and O'Shea has a good ring to it for the future.
Originally posted by Raoul:
<strong>Nicky Butt is playing at a higher level than Roy Keane over the past 6-8 months.
Discuss.
butt is now playing at the same level of keane, i just seems he is playing at a higher level as its new to us, keane has been so consistant at such a fantastic level of preformace for so long it becomes boring ... "keane was great" ...
Butt is mearly moving into keanes class which is fecking great coz there both at UTD and butt is younger,loves the club and i'm sure he will continue to stand behind keane for another 1 or 2 seasons till we have to change <img src="graemlins/keano.gif" border="0" alt="[Keano]" /> from 'keano' to 'butty' .
Originally posted by Livvie20:
<strong>
Yuk. No thanks.
Ferdinand will do. Ferdinand and O'Shea has a good ring to it for the future.</strong><hr></blockquote>
I agree, Livvie, notice the
Butt's performances over the last months has been nothing but sensational. If he can keep this up next season then we've got another world class midfielder in our team. One can only hope and as we we all know: Form is temporary... etc.
To compare Butt and Keane isn't really fair as Butt isn't near as influential for the team as Keane. Butt has been great as of late but if one was to chose only one player I'm sure no one in his right mind would chose Butt over Keane.
Butt is possibly the best midfielder of World Cup so far and that would make him the best midfielder in the world ATM, IMO. We'll have to wait and see.
<img src="graemlins/devil.gif" border="0" alt="[Devil]" /> <img src="graemlins/keano.gif" border="0" alt="[Keano]" /> <img src="graemlins/keano.gif" border="0" alt="[Keano]" /> <img src="graemlins/devil.gif" border="0" alt="[Devil]" />
To compare Butt and Keane isn't really fair as Butt isn't near as influential for the team as Keane. Butt has been great as of late but if one was to chose only one player I'm sure no one in his right mind would chose Butt over Keane.
Butt is possibly the best midfielder of World Cup so far and that would make him the best midfielder in the world ATM, IMO. We'll have to wait and see.
<img src="graemlins/devil.gif" border="0" alt="[Devil]" /> <img src="graemlins/keano.gif" border="0" alt="[Keano]" /> <img src="graemlins/keano.gif" border="0" alt="[Keano]" /> <img src="graemlins/devil.gif" border="0" alt="[Devil]" /> I really wish Keano played for Ireland and Ruud for Holland in this world cup. We missed to great players, probably the best at their respoective positions
Butt's good, but he'll never put Roy on the bench. Maybe in a couple of years or along side Keane with Veron and Scholes on the bench.
Butt's good, but he'll never put Roy on the bench. Maybe in a couple of years or along side Keane with Veron and Scholes on the bench.
Originally posted by JOBT:
<strong>Butt is now playing at the same level of Keane, i just seems he is playing at a higher level as its new to us, Keane has been so consistant at such a fantastic level of preformace for so long it becomes boring ... "Keane was great" ...
Butt is mearly moving into Keanes class which is fecking great coz there both at UTD and butt is younger,loves the club and i'm sure he will continue to stand behind Keane for another 1 or 2 seasons till we have to change <img src="graemlins/keano.gif" border="0" alt="[Keano]" /> from 'Keano' to 'Butty' .
KEAnooo !!!!!!!
Originally posted by Gazza:
<strong>To build our defence, we should also get Nesta, Thuram, Ayala etc.
Don't forget Riquelme, Dunn, D'Alessandro, Crespo... to boost the rest of the squad
Agree about Duff and Rio.
I dont think Butt is on the same level as Keane. Keane is the best in the world. Butt is not the best in England. He is however extremely good lately and always very competant.
Keane is not just a player, he is like a monster, a superman. Butt is not.
In one respect I sometimes think Butt may be better for our team. Butt holds allowing the other players to attack. Scholes has blossomed alongside his youth team partner. Keane meanwhile goes forward too meaning we're alot more vulnerable at times and some other players are rendered less 'free'. Butt can do for Utd what Dunga did for Brazil.
But in terms of all-round game, Keane is incredible. One gripe is how he treats his team mates. Its not the shouting thats bad. Its the alleged rumours of fights, arguments, pinning Veron up against a wall and blaming him for Utd's failed campaign etc. No smoke without fire is there? Who knows. Doesnt matter, Keane rules. For now.
Keane is not just a player, he is like a monster, a superman. Butt is not.
In one respect I sometimes think Butt may be better for our team. Butt holds allowing the other players to attack. Scholes has blossomed alongside his youth team partner. Keane meanwhile goes forward too meaning we're alot more vulnerable at times and some other players are rendered less 'free'. Butt can do for Utd what Dunga did for Brazil.
But in terms of all-round game, Keane is incredible. One gripe is how he treats his team mates. Its not the shouting thats bad. Its the alleged rumours of fights, arguments, pinning Veron up against a wall and blaming him for Utd's failed campaign etc. No smoke without fire is there? Who knows. Doesnt matter, Keane rules. For now.
Well worth debating this one. Just a few observations.
I said just after Christmas that Butt was playing well enough to aggravate the 'five into four' midfield dilemma to 'six into four'.
Passing has not been his strongest suit for Utd, but the England system across the middle has clearly suited him. 6 players, playing in 3 pairs. Butt / Scholes, Cole / Sinclair, Mills / Beckham. Whenever Nicky breaks down an attack, he has at least a couple of simple passing options whether he's on the left or right.
Utd's midfield system revolves around Keane's drive - but he's not the tackler he was a few years ago - and Beckham's right foot. Can we sustain this into 2002/3 ?
I feel we currently have too many guys who want to be the playmaker, who want to cut inside and dictate the pace of the game. Even Giggs keeps cutting inside now ffs. We could use more width and greater tackling ability.
If we acquired Duff, that would leave 7 players for the 4 midfield places. A couple of high profile departures would be inevitable. It's highly unlikely that Keano would be one of them as the Club will be based around SAF / Keano for at least a couple more years.
However, I do think it would be unwise for the club to continue to be so heavily reliant on Keane's form and fitness for our style of play. I'd prefer a more flexible approach.
I said just after Christmas that Butt was playing well enough to aggravate the 'five into four' midfield dilemma to 'six into four'.
Passing has not been his strongest suit for Utd, but the England system across the middle has clearly suited him. 6 players, playing in 3 pairs. Butt / Scholes, Cole / Sinclair, Mills / Beckham. Whenever Nicky breaks down an attack, he has at least a couple of simple passing options whether he's on the left or right.
Utd's midfield system revolves around Keane's drive - but he's not the tackler he was a few years ago - and Beckham's right foot. Can we sustain this into 2002/3 ?
I feel we currently have too many guys who want to be the playmaker, who want to cut inside and dictate the pace of the game. Even Giggs keeps cutting inside now ffs. We could use more width and greater tackling ability.
If we acquired Duff, that would leave 7 players for the 4 midfield places. A couple of high profile departures would be inevitable. It's highly unlikely that Keano would be one of them as the Club will be based around SAF / Keano for at least a couple more years.
However, I do think it would be unwise for the club to continue to be so heavily reliant on Keane's form and fitness for our style of play. I'd prefer a more flexible approach.
Originally posted by Gazza:
<strong>Keane is a disruptive influence on the team. I recommend we sell him to Leeds for 10m and bring in Ferdinand for 40m. To build our defence, we should also get Nesta, Thuram, Ayala etc.
<img src="graemlins/keano.gif" border="0" alt="[Keano]" /> <img src="graemlins/keano.gif" border="0" alt="[Keano]" />
Originally posted by Thebug:
<strong>WHAT ARE YOU ON! sell keano for 10 million get real he has performed at a high level for ages and he gives the team and supporters a kick up the arse when needed(prawn sandwich & we should break the team up)sell him my arse
<img src="graemlins/keano.gif" border="0" alt="[Keano]" /> <img src="graemlins/keano.gif" border="0" alt="[Keano]" /> </strong><hr></blockquote>
<img src="graemlins/yawn.gif" border="0" alt="[Yawn]" /> You're just in denial.
Originally posted by Jens:
<strong>
I reckon both Duff and Giggs could play up front.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Cue Livvie
Originally posted by arnie sidebottom:
<strong>
Cue Livvie
Might be interesting but I wouldn't want to see it.
We need four out and out strikers. Giggs is brilliant at running at defenders, and has scored some great goals - but he generally misses because he isn't a striker.
And preferably our strikers should be able to use both feet.
Don't think Nicky is quite in the Keano class yet but he is probably still improving. Even if he doesn't improve we now have four very good players fighting for two central midfield positions. When Keano misses out we now have the second best player in the country in that position as back up.
When Keano is in we have Nicky, Seb or Scholesy with Becks and Giggsy out wide. Get Duff as back up, a fourth striker, fix the defence and we're in for a great season.
When Keano is in we have Nicky, Seb or Scholesy with Becks and Giggsy out wide. Get Duff as back up, a fourth striker, fix the defence and we're in for a great season.
At present Roy Keane remains irreplaceable at United. I don't think he's a disruptive influence at all - quite the opposite, he's inspirational. Nicky Butt has done well but I don't see his WC performances up to the level of Keane's week in and week out efforts for United. Having said that Roy wants success badly and there could be trouble ahead if United don't perform to his level of skill and comittment. He's alluded to this before and Fergie has handled him with great skill but if there is any repeat of last season's below par efforts we could be hearing more from Roy. Until then he remains the most valuable member of Fergie's squad and whilst not wanting to demean Nicky's performances, he's not quite in the same class and quite frankly may never be.
It seems to me that when Fergie got the team right aka 1999,he then thought that you have to spend millions to get "world class players",when in effect they are here already.Of course you have to bring in the odd player or two but not disrupt the whole team.
When Veron came Fergie moved out Scholes and Butt who might i add are still in the World Cup.
I hope Fergie goes back to his old ways of bring the youth through and hopefully sticking with them.
Redwaz
When Veron came Fergie moved out Scholes and Butt who might i add are still in the World Cup.
I hope Fergie goes back to his old ways of bring the youth through and hopefully sticking with them.
Redwaz
This notion of Keane being a disruptive influence is really such bull, people are taking what happened at the world cup and trying to apply it to Utd. Sorry but you are comparing apples and oranges. If it illustrates anything it is the poverty of management that Ireland suffers from compared to Utd.
It's wonderful to see Butt doing so well and tis great to see him get the plaudits, but he will never be Keane class. He has as good defensie capabilities but he doesn't have the leadership talent that Keane has............
DISRUPTIVE.........BAH.. HUMBUG..........
It's wonderful to see Butt doing so well and tis great to see him get the plaudits, but he will never be Keane class. He has as good defensie capabilities but he doesn't have the leadership talent that Keane has............
DISRUPTIVE.........BAH.. HUMBUG..........
Keane Disruptive??? He speaks his mind and lets his play on the field do the rest. How many times have you heard Utd players saying Keane has gone too far. NEVER!!!
BUT I am ecstatic for Butt. He has matured and is finally doing what Ferguson always saw in him.
Maybe when Keane eventually moves on the Youth team Guvnor will finally take control.....but for now I am just happy to see him develop.
Nicky is not as inspirational as Keano right now BUT who knows ...in future....NICKY WILL TRANSFORM TO <img src="graemlins/keano.gif" border="0" alt="[Keano]" /> 2.
BUT I am ecstatic for Butt. He has matured and is finally doing what Ferguson always saw in him.
Maybe when Keane eventually moves on the Youth team Guvnor will finally take control.....but for now I am just happy to see him develop.
Nicky is not as inspirational as Keano right now BUT who knows ...in future....NICKY WILL TRANSFORM TO <img src="graemlins/keano.gif" border="0" alt="[Keano]" /> 2.