Cutch said:
Team Cutch
Team MJJ (Substitutions made)
Original team:
Current team:
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Team MJJ (Substitutions made)
Original team:
Current team:
MJJ said:
All-Time Fantasy Draft - Cutch v MJJ
- Thread starter Brwned
- Start date
Longer profiles
Goalkeeper
Oliver Kahn 'The Titan' - Germany
Influential and fearless german keeper who’s peak was as good as anyone in the last 20 years, Schmeichel included. Only keeper to have won the FIFA World Cup Golden Ball, and to make the top 3 in the FIFA World Player of The Year. Came third twice in European Footballer of the Year.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oliver_Kahn
Defence
Luis ‘Fifo’ Eyzaguirre – Chile
Considered to be one of the best right backs in the world in the early 60s, only bettered by legendary Brazilian Djalma Santos. Was influential in helping Chile gain 3rd place at the 1962 World Cup. Chile were one of the most exciting teams to watch at this time and Eyzaguirre was a big part of that with his willingness to go forward, calmness in possession, and while also being a very capable defender.
Was invited by FIFA to play in a commemorative game to celebrate 100 years of football.
John Charles ‘The Gentle Giant’ – Wales
One of the best all round footballers of all time.
- Voted the greatest foreign player ever in Serie A (ahead of Van Basten, Maradona, Platini)
- Voted by Juventus fans as their best ever foreign player
- First non-Italian inducted to the Azzurri Hall of Fame
- Italian player of the year 1958
- 3rd in Ballon d’or 1959
http://www.mightyleeds.co.uk/players/charlesapp.htm
Fernando Hierro 'The Marshal' – Spain
Regarded as the greatest Spanish defender of all time. He was equally at ease as a central defender or defensive midfielder. He was an outstanding organiser and leader, and had the ability at his peak, to combine solid defensive play with a near-unlimited passing range. As a defender, Hierro had a remarkable scoring record. He led Spain in total goals with 29 before being overtaken by Raul, and scored over 100 goals in 497 La Liga games.
Nilton Santos 'The Encyclopaedia'– Brazil
Legendary Brazilian left back Nilton Santos was selected in the FIFA world team of century in 1998 and is regarded as the best full back in the history of the game. Outstanding in attack with his pace, world-class dribbling and crossing.
He was a pioneer and revolutionised the position of attacking full back and is the main inspiration for Brazil to have since been synonomous with world class attacking fullbacks.
http://www.fifa.com/classicfootball/players/player=44604/index.html
Midfield
Kurt Hamrin ‘The Little Bird’– Sweden
Flying Swedish winger. 7th highest scorer in Serie A history. Best remembered for his displays in helping Sweden reach the 1958 World Cup Final, scoring in the quarter final and a wonderful goal in the semi against West Germany. Played for Juventus, AC Milan, Fiorentina and Napoli in Serie A.
Bryan Robson 'Captain Marvel' - England
One of Manchester United and Englands greatest ever players. A supreme motivational force. Had endless stamina who could tackle, run, pass, shoot and head.
He's the longest serving captain in Uniteds history and had over 90 caps for England.
In August 2011 he was voted as the greatest ever Manchester United player from a poll of ex players as part of a new book, released to celebrate the 19th league title win.
Jean Tigana 'Le Don Quichotte du Mali' – France
Stylish French playmaker who was part of ‘the magic square’, one of the greatest midfield foursomes of all time with Michel Platini and co. 2nd in the Balon D’Or in 1984 after starring in Frances triumphant 1984 Euro’s.
See 0:36 to 1:00
George Best 'El Beatle' – Northern Ireland
Not sure what to say about him that would do him justice. One of the most gifted players of all time. Combined bravery, pace, acceleration, balance, two-footedness, goalscoring and the ability to beat defenders. A footballing phenomenon.
Forwards
Roberto Baggio ‘The divine ponytail’- Italy
World and European footballer of the year in 1993. Italys most popular and iconic player of all time. 4th in the FIFA internet poll for the best player of all time. 16th in the World Soccer awards 100 greatest players of the 20th century. Best remembered for his performances in dragging Italy almost single handedly to the final of 1994 World Cup when he was unquestionably the best player in the world at the time.
Marco Van Basten 'The swan of Utrecht'– Holland
World player of the year in 1992 and 3 time European footballer of the year. Voted 12th in the FIFA player of the century. 3 time European cup winner with Milan and starred for Holland in the 88 Euros scoring 1 of the best goals of all time in the final.
Brilliant all round centreforward with wonderful touch and technique.
Oliver Kahn 'The Titan' - Germany
Influential and fearless german keeper who’s peak was as good as anyone in the last 20 years, Schmeichel included. Only keeper to have won the FIFA World Cup Golden Ball, and to make the top 3 in the FIFA World Player of The Year. Came third twice in European Footballer of the Year.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oliver_Kahn
Defence
Luis ‘Fifo’ Eyzaguirre – Chile
Considered to be one of the best right backs in the world in the early 60s, only bettered by legendary Brazilian Djalma Santos. Was influential in helping Chile gain 3rd place at the 1962 World Cup. Chile were one of the most exciting teams to watch at this time and Eyzaguirre was a big part of that with his willingness to go forward, calmness in possession, and while also being a very capable defender.
Was invited by FIFA to play in a commemorative game to celebrate 100 years of football.
John Charles ‘The Gentle Giant’ – Wales
One of the best all round footballers of all time.
- Voted the greatest foreign player ever in Serie A (ahead of Van Basten, Maradona, Platini)
- Voted by Juventus fans as their best ever foreign player
- First non-Italian inducted to the Azzurri Hall of Fame
- Italian player of the year 1958
- 3rd in Ballon d’or 1959
http://www.mightyleeds.co.uk/players/charlesapp.htm
Fernando Hierro 'The Marshal' – Spain
Regarded as the greatest Spanish defender of all time. He was equally at ease as a central defender or defensive midfielder. He was an outstanding organiser and leader, and had the ability at his peak, to combine solid defensive play with a near-unlimited passing range. As a defender, Hierro had a remarkable scoring record. He led Spain in total goals with 29 before being overtaken by Raul, and scored over 100 goals in 497 La Liga games.
Nilton Santos 'The Encyclopaedia'– Brazil
Legendary Brazilian left back Nilton Santos was selected in the FIFA world team of century in 1998 and is regarded as the best full back in the history of the game. Outstanding in attack with his pace, world-class dribbling and crossing.
He was a pioneer and revolutionised the position of attacking full back and is the main inspiration for Brazil to have since been synonomous with world class attacking fullbacks.
http://www.fifa.com/classicfootball/players/player=44604/index.html
Midfield
Kurt Hamrin ‘The Little Bird’– Sweden
Flying Swedish winger. 7th highest scorer in Serie A history. Best remembered for his displays in helping Sweden reach the 1958 World Cup Final, scoring in the quarter final and a wonderful goal in the semi against West Germany. Played for Juventus, AC Milan, Fiorentina and Napoli in Serie A.
Bryan Robson 'Captain Marvel' - England
One of Manchester United and Englands greatest ever players. A supreme motivational force. Had endless stamina who could tackle, run, pass, shoot and head.
He's the longest serving captain in Uniteds history and had over 90 caps for England.
In August 2011 he was voted as the greatest ever Manchester United player from a poll of ex players as part of a new book, released to celebrate the 19th league title win.
Jean Tigana 'Le Don Quichotte du Mali' – France
Stylish French playmaker who was part of ‘the magic square’, one of the greatest midfield foursomes of all time with Michel Platini and co. 2nd in the Balon D’Or in 1984 after starring in Frances triumphant 1984 Euro’s.
See 0:36 to 1:00
George Best 'El Beatle' – Northern Ireland
Not sure what to say about him that would do him justice. One of the most gifted players of all time. Combined bravery, pace, acceleration, balance, two-footedness, goalscoring and the ability to beat defenders. A footballing phenomenon.
Forwards
Roberto Baggio ‘The divine ponytail’- Italy
World and European footballer of the year in 1993. Italys most popular and iconic player of all time. 4th in the FIFA internet poll for the best player of all time. 16th in the World Soccer awards 100 greatest players of the 20th century. Best remembered for his performances in dragging Italy almost single handedly to the final of 1994 World Cup when he was unquestionably the best player in the world at the time.
Marco Van Basten 'The swan of Utrecht'– Holland
World player of the year in 1992 and 3 time European footballer of the year. Voted 12th in the FIFA player of the century. 3 time European cup winner with Milan and starred for Holland in the 88 Euros scoring 1 of the best goals of all time in the final.
Brilliant all round centreforward with wonderful touch and technique.
https://www.redcafe.net/f7/all-time-fantasy-draft-365063/index67.html#post12900385
Longer profiles for my team.
Longer profiles for my team.
Ultimately I think i've just got too many goalscorers for MJJ to keep out. Goals all over the team. Even the centre halfs are prolific. Garrinchas his star name but I couldn't have a better player to mark him than Nilton Santos that knows his game inside out. Best would prove to be a much better and effective team player than Garrincha in this one. Rui Costas slightly out of his depth I feel and nowhere the creative genius of Roberto Baggio. I'd fancy Van Basten for a couple in this one
Hmmm...not as clear cut as the voting seems to be going. Cutch has some very obvious talent in his front six, and in fairness I need to know a bit more about MJJs defenders - was surprised you didn't include Chumpitaz in the first XI.
I'm going to wait a while. The battle down the left flank of Cutch / right flank of MJJ is interesting!
I'm going to wait a while. The battle down the left flank of Cutch / right flank of MJJ is interesting!
The same santos who got turned inside out on garrincha's first trail? If we consider both of them at their peak then garrincha is better than best. On the other side I have got meazza, who was famous for his speed,dribbling and finishing. My team is as clinical as you can get and wont need a second chance to score.
Plus costa was a very talented player who had the bad luck of playing for an inferior nation in his prime.
Fortitude and a few other suggested that chumpitaz would struggle with height so dropped him for now. Zebec was a world class defender who could play anywhere on the pitch. Its said that he was impossible to beat in a one on one. Similarly suurbier was an excellent defender who used to own the right flank due to his pace,stamina and tackling. I also feel that meazza would help out the defense more compared to his wingers which will help me fend of the attacks of his right wing and double up on his RB.
Nasazzi and Quincoces were considered the finest defenders in the world for around four years so expect them to handle Van Basten whereas his defenders can be isolated and gotten at with pace and dribbling.
I keep looking at MJJ's right side with Garrincha. But then, he's up against Nilton Santos, with Tigana also able to come across and help out...
Then Best is up against Suurbier, who would be in trouble even with help.
Plus Baggio, Van Basten, Hamrin, even Robson bombing forward.
Cutch for me. So much attacking potential.
Then Best is up against Suurbier, who would be in trouble even with help.
Plus Baggio, Van Basten, Hamrin, even Robson bombing forward.
Cutch for me. So much attacking potential.
This is something I dont understand...in his first trail garrincha had the better of santos. So its natural to assume that at his peak he would not have trouble with him.
You say that tigana will help him out but ignore my two midfielders who would naturally do the same. Plus if you have robson bombing forward that leaves tigana alone with edwards,costa and monti. Monti already man-marked sindelaar out of a game, cant see anyreason why he cant do the same to baggio.
I think team Cutch has gone overboard with the attack, luckily for him it shouldn't be a problem in this game.
MJJ has it in him to dominate the middle of the park and I'd back Garrincha to get some change out of that left side of Curchs defence so it's not clear cut yet...
I think Cutch will have too much in the end though unless the managers can make some good tactical moves.
MJJ has it in him to dominate the middle of the park and I'd back Garrincha to get some change out of that left side of Curchs defence so it's not clear cut yet...
I think Cutch will have too much in the end though unless the managers can make some good tactical moves.
He nutmegged him in a kickabout if we put it into perspective. Nilton took Garrincha on board at Botofogo when he then signed up and was a mentor for him. Garrincha adored him and despite being a heavy drinker, never touched a drop around him. I could not have a better player marking Garrincha than Nilton Santos, infact Garrincha could end up even being a weak link as he'll be offering very little defensively to his right back being tortured by Best
I reckon MJJ would be in charge of the middle tbh, he has the numerical advantage since Baggio is more of a forward than midfielder and Edwards is a match against anyone in there.
Also, MJJ has Muller. Probably the best guy in history for nicking goals from any chance, I'm not convinced Cutche's defence will stop him getting at least one if not more.
It's basically the same formation. Baggio is the link between midfield and centre forward the same way Rui Costa is for MJJ presumably. If anything i'll have more men in midfield as my wide men will be starting much deeper than Garrincha and Meazza
I wasn't referring to the formation. Baggio will play higher up than Costa who will add to the midfield more.
All of that is irrelevant as it doesnt matter whether garrincha admired him or not.
Thats when he was 19, imagine him at the peak of his powers. Santos will get roasted and meazza/muller dont need a lot of chances to score.
Neither would best and hamrin tbf. Meazza is probably the only one who will help the winger and even he wont do a lot. So both fullbacks will be isolated. Garrincha at his peak was better than best whereas as good as hamrin was, meazza was better.
In the midfield edwards and monti>tigara and robson so I expect my team to dominate the midfield.
MJJ. Nilton Santos is one of the best full backs of all time, so it doesn't matter what Garrincha did to him in a training session. Anyway, the first time a full back comes up against a tricky winger is always the most difficult.
As for Best, I'm aware Suurbier will get help from midfield as well, I just think Best v Suurbier is a bigger mis-match than Garrincha v Santos.
As for Best, I'm aware Suurbier will get help from midfield as well, I just think Best v Suurbier is a bigger mis-match than Garrincha v Santos.
Whereas Garrincha is the greatest dribbler and probably the best winger of all time. It is relevant as it clearly shows that garrincha could beat him and your last point would have any relevance if both of them were the same age. That was garrincha's first trial whereas santos was already a brazilian star by that point.
Of course, Garrincha is the best winger ever, maybe top 3 players of all time. But when it comes to match-ups like this, I have to knit-pick. There's nothing in it so us voters have to go looking for something, however small, that might swing the game.
That match-up aside, I just think Cutch's team has more goals in it.
That match-up aside, I just think Cutch's team has more goals in it.
The more I look at cutch's midfield the more I think it's comparatively weak, but still not weak enough for him to lose this. Dont really want to vote for either at this moment in time but if nothing changes significantly (which it probably won't) I will end up siding with Best and Co.
Sorry MJJ, as good as your side appears to be, I've gone with a team that I know more about...
What's the point in voting then?
Wow this should be closer. I was actually leaning towards MJJ even though at first glance cutch has a better team. Going to think a bit about this.
Edwards was a really poor first pick.
Cutch has five greatest of all time level players (Santos, Van Basten, Baggio, Best and Charles), MJJ has only two (Garrincha, Muller).
Cutch has five greatest of all time level players (Santos, Van Basten, Baggio, Best and Charles), MJJ has only two (Garrincha, Muller).
Add to that Schmeichal, Meazza and Suarez who is considered the greatest Spanish footballer of all time.
I think Nilton Santos is outstanding but I've no idea how you can say he is a "greatest of all time pick" while Nasazzi, Schmeichel and Luis Suárez aren't. Baggio a class above Luis Suárez? Hmm.
MJJ has Schmeichel.
But overall I agree. Cutch wins the battle in terms of the players in the next bracket down, too.
I agree that Edwards was a poor first pick. Not a poor player clearly, but one not many have seen much of at all.
Really like Cutch team, only the right back I have no knowledge about. But Hamrin in front of him, that makes me happy as a Swede! No weak spots for me and I really like Tigana and Robson.
Goalkeepers are Goalkeepers for me, everyone in the draft has a great keeper, almost nothing between any of them.
He's playing Suarez out of position isn't he? As I understood it he was more a Falcao than a Baggio?
Schmeichal remains greatest of all time level.
Suarez is equally capable there or a little deeper, I actually prefer him where he is, he'll naturally drop deeper if the game dictates that he should.
He's playing a midfield three with Suarez at the tip. I don't think he is meant to be behind the striker. He's got full control of that midfield in my eyes now he has put Suarez in there.
Ooops. Voted for MJJ by accident. Not that it makes much of a difference...
So is Kahn.
Edwards considered the best in the world in his position. Meazza best italian player of all time and one of the greatest forwards of all time. Saurez, considered the best spanish player ever. Nasazzi one of the best south american players ever while chumpitaz is not far from that level.
Thanks BD.This has been my main problem imo. I am dominating the midfield, wingers are around the same level(I feel mine are a bit better) while his defense is better than mine. Only difference is that his players are better remembered while mine are not. Meazza in particular is getting hugely underrated on here.
For Barcelona he played higher up as a true attacking player, at Inter where he would eventually become known as the greatest Spanish player of all-time according to many, he played deeper and took control of the game much more.
Honestly, in my eyes MJJ has the better defense and midfield (with Suárez naturally dropping deeper he can dominate the midfield) + the greatest goalgetter in the history of the game. The only area where Cutch has got him beat is perhaps in terms of tactics, but his backline will surely collapse under the combined weight of Meazza-Müller-Garrincha with such a perfectly balanced midfield behind it.
Either way the difference in votes is way too big...
He won the European football of the year playing for barca as an attacking mid but its a moot point.
That's not what this is all about. It's about whether the side ultimately can win the game. Having the best of all times in certain key roles obviously would help because they will be bloody good, but that sort of 5-2 to Cutch logic doesn't fly, AT ALL.
Voted MJJ - thought long and hard. Think Cutch has bigger names, but MJJ might just have a better team Probably won't matter though - very close game (in real - not vote terms)
Same here. If Cutch had Joe Allen instead of Bryan Robson in midfield I don't care how good the other 10 are, his midfield (already comparatively weaker) would get pulverised, Best or no Best.