A new elephant knocking on the door: can Bruno, Zirkzee and Højlund play in the same side?

Fortitude

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I was going to open with a Rolf gif, but that would be in bad taste...

But anyway, I think there's an elephant bumbling towards the room that might be too difficult to ignore soon enough. I think if you consider a few positions and roles on the pitch, it's an easy one to detect. It also has a feeling of inevitability given the contrasting styles and the potential that's there if the contender really clicks with the team.

If you are stumped up until now, it's Bruno and Zirkzee once Hojlund is fit and ready to return. Currently, Zirkzee goes in front and Bruno plays behind him. Hojlund is in Zirkzee's position, and it looks like there could be a toss up for who plays in behind him. That leaves a conundrum of what to do with the surplus. Is it simply a case of Zirkzee being relegated to the bench, or does Bruno get moved from the middle? Given Bruno's contract, it surely can't mean he goes to the bench, but... what happens if Zrikzee really does look like the linkman we've been crying out for?
 
I have said this in another thread before. But I think it’s worth trying a midfield trio of

Ugarte (6)
Bruno (8)
Zirkzee (10)

Especially against weaker opposition.

Bruno needs to play deeper and more positionally disciplined.

Zirkzee will be valuable in the final third due to his link up play. The combination of Zirkzee feeding Hojlund and two pacey wingers (Garnacho / Rashford / Amad) should be a great combination.

But Bruno is the key to making it work. Else Ugarte will get overrun.
 
Fortitude said:
I was going to open with a Rolf gif, but that would be in bad taste...

But anyway, I think there's an elephant bumbling towards the room that might be too difficult to ignore soon enough. I think if you consider a few positions and roles on the pitch, it's an easy one to detect. It also has a feeling of inevitability given the contrasting styles and the potential that's there if the contender really clicks with the team.

If you are stumped up until now, it's Bruno and Zirkzee once Hojlund is fit and ready to return. Currently, Zirkzee goes in front and Bruno plays behind him. Hojlund is in Zirkzee's position, and it looks like there could be a toss up for who plays in behind him. That leaves a conundrum of what to do with the surplus. Is it simply a case of Zirkzee being relegated to the bench, or does Bruno get moved from the middle? Given Bruno's contract, it surely can't mean he goes to the bench, but... what happens if Zrikzee really does look like the linkman we've been crying out for?
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We have done feck all with Bruno as our Lynchpin and would continue to be irrelevant when it comes to biggest competitions if we persist with him .

Don't know whether Zirkzee together with Hojlund is the answer but it wouldn't be the worst idea to change things a bit and start phasing out Bruno unless we have given up even the pretense of competing for highest honours and are more than happy being Europa league Club which occasionally qualify for Champions league only to get embarrassed at first stage .
 
I see this problem differently, Zirkzee vs Hojlund is not a competition, plenty of games for both.

What to do with Bruno is the elephant in the room. Yesterday was another game we've won despite Fernandes being Soton best player.

Zirkzee is looking good in the CF role, I don't see a reason to tinker with this.
 
How did Bruno’s contract change during the summer?
It seemed more like a strategic move to give him an increase to keep him happy for the current season.
We probably are considering moving him on as he still has market value and considering his age and likelihood of us not competing in the short term it makes sense to.
 
Zirkzee for Europa League, League Cup and FA Cup.

Hojlund PL when he's fit.
 
Kramer said:
I have said this in another thread before. But I think it’s worth trying a midfield trio of

Ugarte (6)
Bruno (8)
Zirkzee (10)

Especially against weaker opposition.

Bruno needs to play deeper and more positionally disciplined.

Zirkzee will be valuable in the final third due to his link up play. The combination of Zirkzee feeding Hojlund and two pacey wingers (Garnacho / Rashford / Amad) should be a great combination.

But Bruno is the key to making it work. Else Ugarte will get overrun.
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Bruno playing deeper is the reciepe for disaster. His only value is close to the opposition box, if he plays any other role it's net negative contribution, it's well known fact and if we do it again, it's on the manager, not Bruno.
 
Bruno is one of the best #10s in the world. Any manager with an ounce of sense would see this and stop faffing about. He plays there and you pick other players around him.
 
Zirkzee hasn't done nearly enough to take Hojlund or Bruno's spot. He'll drop to second choice when Hojlund's back. But that will still give him more than enough game time. Two CFs is a minimum over a PL season.
 
Borys said:
Bruno playing deeper is the reciepe for disaster. His only value is close to the opposition box, if he plays any other role it's net negative contribution, it's well known fact and if we do it again, it's on the manager, not Bruno.
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Bruno in the box is also big disaster, dude is about as bad as it gets at finishing. If Ten Hag wants a long utd career, he needs to force bruno into the deeper role,
 
We will soon be playing 2 games everyweek.

Hojlund, Zirkzee, Bruno and Mount will all be needed for the 2 positions up top(#10 and #9).

SAF always had 4 strikers. Bruno, Mount are not strikers, but they do stay quite high up in our 4-4-2 pressing structure.
 
I think it’ll more likely be either or of Rasmus and Zirk. Sometimes we might see them together but I don’t think Bruno will be affected really. His only competition is Mount.
However do have to wonder if the reason he was offered a bumper contract given we are trying to reduce costs was to appease him for the year, before selling him this summer.
Some sort of gentleman's agreement. He wants to win leagues and we aren’t going to be in a position for that for at least 2-3 years. Might as well go to Saudi and make a mil a week and set yourself up for life and possibly your children’s children.
 
Zirkzee is obviously the better player to start, but it will suit Hojlund coming on against tired defences.
 
Borys said:
What to do with Bruno is the elephant in the room.
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Bingo. And the answer is unfortunately keeping him as our undroppable captain following his new contract.
 
Coming deep to link up differs from facing your forwards and creating for them.

Bruno is one of the best in Europe in this role and there's no need to shoehorn a CF.
 
Highfather_24 said:
We will soon be playing 2 games everyweek.

Hojlund, Zirkzee, Bruno and Mount will all be needed for the 2 positions up top(#10 and #9).

SAF always had 4 strikers. Bruno, Mount are not strikers, but they do stay quite high up in our 4-4-2 pressing structure.
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That's how I see it too, although I do hope we move away from Bruno as an automatic pick. I really want to see how Zirkzee and Hojlund as a pair though. I think it will suit both their games.
 
Will be interesting to see how Rasmus and Zirkzee combine on the pitch. Could become a promising partnership.
 
I’m not really sure it’s an elephant in the room analogy if I’m honest.

It’s more refreshing to have some good options and variety in the forward areas after years of having Martial take up a spot whilst injured.

Bruno is the captain and will play. It will be Zirkzee or Hojlund I imagine, although we may see them both together in certain games or at certain points.

Zirkzee can also come off the wide areas, as can Bruno. Even if you add Mount there’s plenty of options which can interchange.

I suspect some fans have just forgotten what this feels like but it’s pretty common for the better teams to have this at their disposal.
 
Borys said:
Bruno playing deeper is the reciepe for disaster. His only value is close to the opposition box, if he plays any other role it's net negative contribution, it's well known fact and if we do it again, it's on the manager, not Bruno.
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We havent had a player like Ugarte for quite a while. Casemiro doesn’t count as he can’t cover the same amount of ground.

We can afford to try Bruno in a deeper role depending on the opposition / competition. He can definitely play as an 8. An effective 8.

Zirkzee seems to have superior link up play in the final third as well as being much more physically capable of holding the ball up.

Bruno has great games as a 10 but can be quite erratic as well.

It’s a combination worth trying if it gives us better attacking balance (which I think it will). And it won’t harm Bruno’s creativity too much. As he will get more freedom if Ugarte proves to be the defensive rock we hope.

But he needs to be coached to be more positionally disciplined. Remains to be seen if this is something Ten Hag wishes to do.

P.S. For what it’s worth, I don’t think Bruno is most effective close to the opposition box. His biggest asset is his vision and quick passing during our quick transitions. Which he can continue to do as an 8. His passing in the final third is quite erratic.
 
Bruno is in terrible form but neither Zirkzee or Hojlund have done enough to be guaranteed starting spots yet.

All 3 need to significantly improve their output.
 
Good teams have options. We finally have a few in multiple positions. I’m fed up of our bench looking like the queue in the job centre
 
TheReligion said:
I’m not really sure it’s an elephant in the room analogy if I’m honest.

It’s more refreshing to have some good options and variety in the forward areas after years of having Martial take up a spot whilst injured.

Bruno is the captain and will play. It will be Zirkzee or Hojlund I imagine, although we may see them both together in certain games or at certain points.

Zirkzee can also come off the wide areas, as can Bruno. Even if you add Mount there’s plenty of options which can interchange.

I suspect some fans have just forgotten what this feels like but it’s pretty common for the better teams to have this at their disposal.
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Good post. I don't think Zirkzee coming in from wide is a great idea though. His strength is that he's a 360 degrees player if that makes sense. I won't be at all surprised if Hojlund comes off the right in/during a few games. He played in a 352 at Atalanta, and the position of right forward is close already, to put it easily.
 
Competition is always healthy. If Zirkzee pushes Bruno to more consistent and disciplined then the team benefits. If Zirkzee becomes a hit at #10 and clicks with the attackers then we dont need to run Bruno to the ground. Win win for us. I hope this signing pushes Bruno as when Malacia pushed Shaw to improve.
 
This isn’t a problem at all.

We was desperate for a striker off the bench. We now have that in either Zirkzee or Hojlund.

Hojlund runs until he’s got nothing left to give, and last season we had no one to switch him with.

Both will have plenty game time as our striker.
 
I think Zirkzee as a 10 is pretty much a non starter, he doesn't cover enough ground at high enough intensity for it to be viable.

It is Zirkzee v Hojlund and I would always prefer to go with the more rounded footballer of the 2 over the finisher, the attack is just more likely to work fluently. Last seasons trio, Rash, Ras and Garnacho was never going to work because they are all one dimensional players at this stage, head down and run, Hojlund needs creators around him and the wide 2 need the striker to be more of a playmaker to find their runs and let them concentrate on scoring over setting others up.

The challenge for Zirkzee will be if if he can handle the intensity of the PL and the speed of the game, very impressive yesterday, loved the smoothness of his play, his touch, hold up and awareness of others is levels above Hojlund, but Southampton are a bit shit so should not go overboard.

Amad helps both of them as a starter.
 
I don’t see the problem. Neither Højlund nor Zirkzee have done anything to suggest they should be nailed-on starters yet. If Zirkzee proves good enough to relegate Højlund to the bench, that will mean we have strengthened one of the weakest positions in last season’s preferred lineup.
 
It's great to have these "problems", one of the reasons we pick up so many injuries is because we've basically fielded our best XI (or close) in all the cup games in recent seasons because our managers have been feeling the pressure to win something at all costs.

If I was Ashworth, I'd be saying to EtH that he MUST be using the early stages of the Europa and Carling Cup to rotate the squad - and that means we need players like Casemiro, Collyer, Eriksen, Anthony, Zirkzee and Mount to come into the team.
 
It could have the opposite effect and create healthy competition for places in the squad.
 
The more options the better and surely this was obvious when we brought Zirkzee in. :rolleyes:
 
Only position we can still use Bruno going forward is as a false-9. And we got better players to use there if we even want to use one.

Modern football require 100% control and pressing in midfield. Also, every player need to be press-resistent, a trait Bruno lacks 100%. Bruno is "ok" against lesser opponents, but not against decent and good opposition.

His numbers are good and consistent on paper, but he hurts the entire team, especially on the defensive side.
 
I’m deliberately not clicking on this, or commenting, just because of the title

Ah wait
 
Watching Zirkzee effortlessly link play for our players with a maximum of two touches without giving the ball away was so nice to see.

Goes to show the "he's taking risks" narrative is baloney.
 
casemiro is tired of these jokes about his weight. the first such incident occurred in 2022..
 
Typical knee jerk thread. One good result and we think there is a problem of plenty coming around.
 
CG1010 said:
Typical knee jerk thread. One good result and we think there is a problem of plenty coming around.
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It's not exactly a problem of plenty, it's emerging clarity over who is a better fit for the kind of the football that needs to be played.
 
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