70s Fantasy Draft - DanNistelrooy v Team Brian

Who will win based on players in their prime, team tactics, balance & bench strength?

  • Total voters
    29
  • Poll closed .

Brwned

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Important note: For the purpose of this competition, these players are considered at the level when they were in their prime.

Dan's Brazilian Army
DanNistelrooy said:
Dan's Brazilian Army

Tactics:

Julio Cesar - Brazil's number 1 and over 200 caps for Inter. Won the treble with Inter in 2010 and was named UEFA Goalkeeper of the year

Cafu (c) - World cup winning captain - One of, if not the best right full back of his generation. Won 2 Copa America's, 2 World Cups along with a host of other club competitions; including the Champions League, 1 Club world cup, Serie A titles with Roma and AC.

Lucio - World cup winner and one of the best centre backs of the 2000s. On top of the Wolrd Cup, has won the lot at club level - also part of Inter's treble winning side in 2010.

Juan - Underrated, solid defender who has played with Lucio for Brazil. Juan is the 20th most capped Brazilian player of all time, anyone with that record for a team like Brazil has had an impressive career.

Sylvinho - Providing the width on the left is Sylvinho. Good servant for Arsenal, and part of Barcelona's 2006 and 2009 Champions League winning team. Also won a few La Liga titles and is capable of getting forward as well as putting in a defensive shift

Gilberto Silva - Solid, disciplined defensive midfielder who will keep things ticking and cover for Sylvinho and Cafu when they move forward. An integral part of both Brazil's World Cup 2002 winning team and Arsenal's "invincibles".

Edu - Another important player of Arsenal's unbeaten side in 2004. 2 Premiership medals and 2 FA Cups was followed by a successful stint at Valencia where he won the Copa del Rey in 2008. Another World Champion as he was part of the Cornithians side to pick of the FIFA Club World Championship in 2000

Juninho Paulista - Adding flair and creativity to the midfield is "Little" Juninho. World Cup winner in 2002.

Juninho Pernambucano - Will be remembered for his deadly freekicks. Very tidy on the ball and will link the midfield and attacking play well. Integral part of the dominant Lyon side who won 7 consecutive French titles between 2002-2008. Picked up 40 international caps for Brazil

Edmundo - had a reputation for being a bit of a nutter. But there was no doubting his talent. Scorer of one of the best goals I've seen scored against United Mundial FIFA 2000: Vasco 3 X 1 Manchester - Golaço de Edmundo - YouTube .10 goals in 39 caps for Brazil - the prospect of a Edmundo - Ronaldo partnership is exciting

Ronaldo - the best striker of his generation. A stunning 247 goals in 343 starts at club level, paired with 62 in 98 for Brazil. 2 time Ballon D'or winner, guided Brazil to World Cup glory in 2002.

Sub - Denilson - another World Cup winner. Famous for his trickery and step overs. If a bit of magic is needed from the bench, he is capable.

I have gone for a strong core to the team. Julio Cesar, Lucio, Gilberto Silva, Ronaldo - all top players who, in their prime, were amongst the best around.

The width will be provided by Cafu, arguably the best right back of his generation, and on the other side Sylvinho. When either of these 2 go forward I have a well disciplined, World Cup winning defensive midfielder in Gilberto to cover for them.

Attacking-wise, the creativity of the two Juninhos and Edmundo will be able to create chances, and then I have the best striker of this generation to score the goals for me in Ronaldo.

Flair is clearly not going to be lacking in a Brazilian team but this group of players also have the steel to go with that.

7 World Cup medals between them, along with a couple of Wolrd Club Championships and Champions Leagues. They also boast league titles from Greece, Brazil, England, Spain, Italy, France and Germany.
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Team Brian GB

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Team Brian GB said:
Team Brian GB:

I am playing a 4-5-1 derivative that can change to a flat 4-4-2, a 4 diamond 2 04 a 3-5-2 if necessary.

The defensive is playing in an orthodox manner with Sorin and Reiziger playing as full backs who like to go forward, they will be supported in that role by Stankovic on the left and Belletti on the right who can move out from the centre of midfield as necessary.

In order to increase the protection of the midfield, Makelele and Seedorf will be sitting deep, they will have Belletti and Stankovic ahead of them playing a more offensive role and Gudjohnsen further still whose job will be to link play through the centre to Drogba. If necessary, he can play alongside Drogba.
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Does anybody else have eight players in their team who won the champions league?
 
Team Brian GB said:
Does anybody else have eight players in their team who won the champions league?
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The thing is that players dont win the CL, teams do.

Players win invidual honours like Ballon D'Or, POTY, golden boot etc
 
Jayvin said:
I do. :D
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Fair enough.


To matters at hand, Dan is trying to play a midfield diamond against a five man midfield that includes Seedorf, Stankovic and Makelele in it, which has two very strong and experienced defenders behind it.

His only width comes from his full backs and his defenders are not good enough to take on Drogba with Gudjohnsen in direct support with width coming from either Stankovic or Sorin, or Reiziger or Belletti.

If these two teams were ever to play each other, my team would have 60% of possession somewhat easily.
 
Rood said:
The thing is that players dont win the CL, teams do.

Players win invidual honours like Ballon D'Or, POTY, golden boot etc
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I beg to differ, it wasn't Ronaldinho or Deco or Et'oo that scored the goal that won Barcelona the Champions League in 2006, it was Juliano Belletti.
 
Team Brian GB said:
Does anybody else have eight players in their team who won the champions league?
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Being one of the best players in a CL team is generally more impressive than being one of the useful squad members of a CL-winning team, as far as I'm concerned.
 
Team Brian GB said:
Fair enough.


To matters at hand, Dan is trying to play a midfield diamond against a five man midfield that includes Seedorf, Stankovic and Makelele in it, which has two very strong and experienced defenders behind it.

His only width comes from his full backs and his defenders are not good enough to take on Drogba with Gudjohnsen in direct support with width coming from either Stankovic or Sorin, or Reiziger or Belletti.

If these two teams were ever to play each other, my team would have 60% of possession somewhat easily.
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Get out! I can remember Drogba coming up against Lucio twice in the 2010 Champions League and Lucio managed to keep him quiet.

Where else does your goal threat come from? Gudjohsen has never been a goal scorer and to be honest I would fancy Gilberto Silva up against him. I would say Seedorf but you have put him alongside Makelele...
 
Brwned said:
Being one of the best players in a CL team is generally more impressive than being one of the useful squad members of a CL-winning team, as far as I'm concerned.
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And were Seedorf, Stankovic, Makelele, Helguera and Samuel not key players in such teams?

Would Inter Milan have beaten Barcelona in the semi in 2010 if they didn't have Samuel or Stankovic? Absolutely not.
 
Team Brian GB said:
And were Seedorf, Stankovic, Makelele, Helguera and Samuel not key players in such teams?

Would Inter Milan have beaten Barcelona in the semi in 2010 if they didn't have Samuel or Stankovic? Absolutely not.
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I would argue Lucio and Julio Cesar were even bigger reasons they won the Champions League that season. Lucio was inspired in that campaign.
 
DanNistelrooy said:
Get out! I can remember Drogba coming up against Lucio twice in the 2010 Champions League and Lucio managed to keep him quiet.

Where else does your goal threat come from? Gudjohsen has never been a goal scorer and to be honest I would fancy Gilberto Silva up against him. I would say Seedorf but you have put him alongside Makelele...
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That Inter Milan side had Stankovic and Samuel in it who are in my team, plus it was a team managed by Jose Mourinho which was rubbish in the champions league before and since his reign.

My goal threat comes from Drogba, Gudjohnsen with either one of Belletti and Reiziger, and one of Sorin and Stankovic in support.


I could substitute Reiziger if you like, going to 433 with Makelele, Stankovic and Seedorf in midfield with Drogba and Hasselbaink slightly wide of Gudjohnsen, thus putting three strikers against your defence, pinning back your full backs thus starving your team of width leaving your midfield diamond to cope with three of the greatest midfielders you could assemble at the time.
 
Though as it stands you are dependent on Cafu getting the best of both Stankovic and Sorin, and Sylvinho getting the best of Belletti and Reiziger - which isn't likely to happen.
 
Rood said:
:smirk:
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I didn't pick him for that reason but it is a good reason to have him.

Playing very successfully for Barcelona and Chelsea up and down the right side is why I picked him - he also had a knack of scoring astonishingly good goals, the third is my favourite.

 
I actually think you would have been better off with him on the bench as I was always a fan of JFH
 
Dan's midfield wouldnt see the light of day... honest
 
Even I've got 8. Not the most unique of claims there Brian!
 
Nani Nana said:
Dan's midfield wouldnt see the light of day... honest
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I think you are underestimating my midfield massively here. Gilberto was never one to be phased, was so important for that arsenal side in the mid 2000s. Edu always seemed to step up in big games, he always did well against united. Juninho from Lyon has a load of champions league experience and was an important part of a very good Lyon side - also a huge threat from set pieces. Little juninho has a world cup to his name. So that's 2 world cups, 6 French league titles and 3 premiership titles in there.
 
DanNistelrooy said:
I think you are underestimating my midfield massively here. Gilberto was never one to be phased, was so important for that arsenal side in the mid 2000s. Edu always seemed to step up in big games, he always did well against united. Juninho from Lyon has a load of champions league experience and was an important part of a very good.Lyon side - also a Hughes threat from set pieces. Little juninho has a world cup to his name. So that's 2 world cups, 6 French league titles and 3 premiership titles in there.
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Gilberto, Edu and Juninho - that trio doesn't really compared to Makelele, Stankovic and Seedorf does it. Your three players have three titles from either England, Spain or Italy, mine have 13.
 
Team Brian GB said:
Gilberto, Edu and Juninho - that trio doesn't really compared to Makelele, Stankovic and Seedorf does it. Your three players have three titles from either England, Spain or Italy, mine have 13.
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I would rank Gilberto quite easily over Stankovic who's reputation is built on a rocket shot, he's never really impressed me with his all round play.

Playing Beletti out of position is also a strange one there, he struggled enough to play at right back when I ever watched him. So I don't think there's much in the midfields
 
DanNistelrooy said:
I would rank Gilberto quite easily over Stankovic who's reputation is built on a rocket shot, he's never really impressed me with his all round play.

Playing Beletti out of position is also a strange one there, he struggled enough to play at right back when I ever watched him. So I don't think there's much in the midfields
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Gilberto over Stankovic? Right then...

Belletti often played as a right midfielder, right winger and defensive midfielder so he isn't out of position at all.
 
DanNistelrooy said:
I would rank Gilberto quite easily over Stankovic who's reputation is built on a rocket shot, he's never really impressed me with his all round play.
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what complete bollocks. if you think stankovic waited until last year to have a reputation in Italy you are poking yourself in the eye

he's one of the most complete midfielders in recent years
 
DanNistelrooy said:
I think you are underestimating my midfield massively here. Gilberto was never one to be phased, was so important for that arsenal side in the mid 2000s. Edu always seemed to step up in big games, he always did well against united. Juninho from Lyon has a load of champions league experience and was an important part of a very good.Lyon side - also a Hughes threat from set pieces. Little juninho has a world cup to his name. So that's 2 world cups, 6 French league titles and 3 premiership titles in there.
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what on earth is a Hughes threat from set pieces ? the danger of seeing sparky bombing forward from the touchline when his team gets a corner?
 
Team Brian GB said:
And were Seedorf, Stankovic, Makelele, Helguera and Samuel not key players in such teams?

Would Inter Milan have beaten Barcelona in the semi in 2010 if they didn't have Samuel or Stankovic? Absolutely not.
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I don't think Stankovic was that key - the keys to them winning were a very good defence, a hardworking midfield, an excellent playmaker and an effective forward line. It was a great team performance. I think Stankovic would be quite far down the list in terms of importance to that team in terms of individuals.

No doubt it's impressive that 1/3 of your team were key players in a CL-winning team though. I don't the same can be said for more than 3 or 4 others in the draft.
 
Nani Nana said:
what complete bollocks. if you think stankovic waited until last year to have a reputation in Italy you are poking yourself in the eye

he's one of the most complete midfielders in recent years
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Agree with that. Many underrate Stankovic.

Dan's midfield is definitely weaker man for man, but I think the fact that they're all Brazilians has helped with the voting. I guess I can see how people think they would all play much more like a team. Fair play too, not easy to do what he did.

I voted Brian though due to his stronger midfield. I would have liked to see Seedorf given a more advanced role though. He's wasted sitting alongside Makalele, who can easily handle the defensive duties on his own.
 
kps88 said:
I voted Brian though due to his stronger midfield. I would have liked to see Seedorf given a more advanced role though. He's wasted sitting alongside Makalele, who can easily handle the defensive duties on his own.
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When I saw that Dan had Ronaldo and little width I decided to concentrate my efforts on a midfield that can snuff Ronaldo out and blunt his full backs from getting up the pitch.
 
Team Brian GB said:
When I saw that Dan had Ronaldo and little width I decided to concentrate my efforts on a midfield that can snuff Ronaldo out and blunt his full backs from getting up the pitch.
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You have got to fancy Edmundo and Ronaldo to get the better of your 2 centre backs though.

I think you have a good midfield but I just don't see a goal threat. Drogba is there yes, but as I have said Lucio is more than capable of containing him as he proved in both legs of the 2010 Champions league quarters
 
DanNistelrooy said:
You have got to fancy Edmundo and Ronaldo to get the better of your 2 centre backs though.

I think you have a good midfield but I just don't see a goal threat. Drogba is there yes, but as I have said Lucio is more than capable of containing him as he proved in both legs of the 2010 Champions league quarters
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The reason I built my defence and midfield as I did was to isolate your strikers, prevent your full backs from being adventurous and to get one over your midfield.

Samuel and Helguera were two very strong midfielders on a European-wide level, playing for great sides in Inter Milan and Real Madrid respectively, having Makelele and Seedorf sitting in front of them makes such a defensive unit near impenetrable. Belletti and Stankovic have three roles in getting forward, doubling up on the opposing fullbacks with their own fullbacks and assisting Makelele and Seedorf in the middle, and Gudjohnsen in a more advanced position.

I find it interesting how you have referred to Lucio vs. Drogba on a number of occasions when my team is set up not too dissimilarly from Inter Milan that season whilst you have gone for a Chelsea-akin lineup from the same timeframe. Chelsea didn't lose because of Drogba not overcoming Lucio, Chelsea lost because they had a lack of width and found it impossible to overcome a strong midfield when theirs was narrow.
 
Team Brian GB said:
The reason I built my defence and midfield as I did was to isolate your strikers, prevent your full backs from being adventurous and to get one over your midfield.

Samuel and Helguera were two very strong midfielders on a European-wide level, playing for great sides in Inter Milan and Real Madrid respectively, having Makelele and Seedorf sitting in front of them makes such a defensive unit near impenetrable. Belletti and Stankovic have three roles in getting forward, doubling up on the opposing fullbacks with their own fullbacks and assisting Makelele and Seedorf in the middle, and Gudjohnsen in a more advanced position.

I find it interesting how you have referred to Lucio vs. Drogba on a number of occasions when my team is set up not too dissimilarly from Inter Milan that season whilst you have gone for a Chelsea-akin lineup from the same timeframe. Chelsea didn't lose because of Drogba not overcoming Lucio, Chelsea lost because they had a lack of width and found it impossible to overcome a strong midfield when theirs was narrow.
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Fair enough, its not just as easy as "isolating" players like Ronaldo and hoping that's okay though. He will have support from Edmundo.

Ronaldo was a one off, capable of pretty much everything. On his day the best striker or even player of this generation bar Zidane... and "isolating" him won't stop him, especially when he has the supporting cast of Edmundo/Junihnos
 
Substitution - Reiziger off, Hasselbaink on.

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Going for it big time with a substitution, Reiziger coming off with Hasselbaink coming on.​

The defence is to operate in the same way as before with Belletti moving to right back to assume the duties of Reiziger, thus combatting the opposing full backs and providing width further afield.​

The midfield will move to a flat three with Reiziger on the right of the trio, Stankovic on the left and Makelele in the middle, the job of whom will be to assist the defence where necessary but primarily to dominate the opposing midfield and maintain possession.​

The main change comes up front, Gudjohnsen will play through the middle with Hasselbaink inclined to the right of him and Drogba inclined to the left. All three strikers down the years have shown their ability and versatility to operate across the top line whether as centre forwards, goal hangers, wide strikers or hugging the touchline. Gudjohnsen is especially valuable in this regard as he had a strong relationship with both players.​


Just to prove the point of all three working together...​

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Ronaldo's eyes have lit up having realised he is no longer isolated...

Can you explain your Drogba out wide decision?
 
DanNistelrooy said:
Ronaldo's eyes have lit up having realised he is no longer isolated...

Can you explain your Drogba out wide decision?
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Drogba isn't 'out wide' I said he is 'inclined to the left' as the graphic shows, in the same way Henry at Arsenal would drift in and out.

And Ronaldo is still isolated as your midfield is still a diamond and is still not equipped to take on a midfield with less responsibility to go outside, thus meaning you now have the full attention of not two midfielders but three. At the same time your full backs would now be pinned back competely as they have three strikers to contend with, and Cafu isn't exactly capable of taking on the likes of Drogba.
 
Team Brian GB said:
Drogba isn't 'out wide' I said he is 'inclined to the left' as the graphic shows, in the same way Henry at Arsenal would drift in and out.
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Fair enough, I misread your formation there then. I still think Drogba is at his best as the focal point, right up top however I can see you're just trying to get him out of Lucio's pocket .... ;)

Best of luck!
 
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