70s Fantasy Draft - Brwned v Gio

[Brwned]

Brwned

Rustu

Excellent reflexes and very difficult to beat one-on-one, outrageous at times but undeniably a matchwinner on his day. In the all-star WC 2002 team, named the best keeper overall in Europe by Uefa later that year - it was certainly a spectacular peak.

Sagnol

With his dependability in attack and defence, endless energy and a fantastic whipped cross he made his name as one of the best fullbacks around for nearly a decade. A more attacking Gary Neville, essentially.

Hyypia

Part of the best defence in the league right at the beginning and end of his Liverpool career, a leader at the back and quietly dominant. Alongside Rio he forms the cleanest defensive partnership around, at one point going nearly 90 games without a single booking.

Ferdinand

Class. Outstanding in 2008 to the extent some would argue he was our best player.

Zambrotta

Like Sagnol he was nominated for the Ballon D'or in 2006 and there's a good shout that at this point they were the two best fullbacks around. Extremely versatile and well-rounded, a constant attacking threat but always willing and able to get back and more than capable of taking his opposing attacker out of the game completely.

Tacchinardi

Named as one of the Juventus 50 Legends, his influence on that utterly dominant Juve side can't be understated. Provides the energy and bite needed to make this midfield a cohesive unit just as he did for Juve.

Pirlo

An outstanding passer and the outstanding deep-lying playmaker of the draft. Widely considered the best midfielder around circa 07' after being named the third best player in the World Cup, had took Milan to successive CL finals and was voted 5th best player in the world in the Ballon D'or 07.

Valeron

Finished in the top 15 for the Ballon D'or 2002. A magician who would literally walk past player after player at times; with fantastic close control, wonderful imagination and devastatingly incisive passing. He'll of course be providing the ammunition for the two forwards.

Larrson

Nominated for the Ballon D'or 3 times in 4 years between 2000-04, finishing just outside the top 10 twice...it says it all for a player playing in the SPL. Brilliant goalscorer and showed his all-round attacking game and intelligence in his time at Barcelona and United.

Shearer

112 goals in 138 games for Blackburn, no-one needs to be told about this man.

Recoba

Pace, dribbling and a fantastic long range shot. Could play right across the front. Or, as Cling said:

Left. Footed. Thunderbolts.

See for yourself.

Sub: Tudor

Dominant at the back, a reliable part of Juventus' rock solid defence around the turn of the century and an ever-present for Croatia over the course of close to a decade.

Sub: Tudor

Gio

Tactics (4-2-3-1):

Approach:
Davids and Mendieta should win the midfield battle, allowing Veron to link up with fellow Argentines Aimar and Claudio Lopez. The centre-half pairing of Naybet and Gamarra possess the right attributes to match up well against Shearer and Larsson, but will be ably supported by the pacy German pair of Babbel and Ziege. The latter in particular will pose a threat moving forward with no nominal midfielder to pick him down the entirety of the left flank.

Gregory Coupet
Lyon legend who kept goal during seven consecutive title triumphs. With Coupet at the helm, Lyon's defensive record in 2004/05 was the second best in Ligue 1 history. Perhaps best known for this sensational double-save against Barcelona's Rivaldo.

Markus Babbel
Close to signing for Man Utd for £5m in 1996 which would have made him the most expensive defender in the country. Rock-solid right-back and superb man-marker, a lynchpin of the German side which won Euro 96.

Noureddine Naybet
Regarded by many as the greatest African defender of all-time, Naybet was the heart of Deportivo's defence for seven seasons which were the club's greatest years. Sir Alex Ferguson held him in similar regard, arranging a deal for the swashbuckling centre-back in 1999 which fell through due to ultimately unfounded fears over the Moroccan's knees. United's loss was Depor's gain as they went on to win La Liga the following season. John Toschak, former Real Madrid, Deportivo, Real Sociedad and Sporting manager, rates Naybet as the best defender under his management.

Carlos Gammara
Highly respected South American centre-half, Gamarra saved his best for Paraguay who he captained during three World Cups. Kept clean sheets against formidable Spanish and Bulgarian attacks before France squeezed past in extra time in the knockout stages. Physically imposing yet such a smooth operator that he didn't concede a single foul in the 1998 tournament.

Christian Ziege
Classy wing-back who was a dynamic and incisive weapon for Germany at Euro 96. Set-piece expert who was one of only four left-backs to be voted for the Ballon D'Or between 1991 and 2005 (the others being Maldini, Carlos and Lizarazu).

Edgar Davids
Tenacious central midfielder whose dominance of the centre of the park was the platform for the great Juventus and Holland sides of the late 1990s.

Juan Sebastian Veron
Technically immaculate playmaker whose height and muscular frame enabled him to showcase his exceptional vision from central midfield. Orchestrated domestic and European success for Parma and Lazio during his prime years. South American Player of the Year awards at 33 and 34 demonstrate his class despite the diminishing aspect of age.

Gaizka Mendieta
The hearbeat of the great Valencia team which reached consecutive Champions League finals. Mendieta won back-to-back UEFA Champions League Midfielder of the Year awards which was testament to his stature in an era of great midfielders. At home in an inside-right or a central role, Mendieta married aggressive pressing and commitment in the tackle with penetrating attacking play and considerable goal threat.
Pablo Aimar
"You can see that he will be a great, great player. He has everything, everything to be a player that can make the difference in Europe. A new star." Johan Cruyff's eulogy following Aimar's debut for Valencia against United reflected the excitement the Argentine's arrival generated. Aimar's time at the top would be curtailed due to injury and illness, but at his best he was a mazy dribbler, elusive and slippery, who linked midfield with attack effortlessly.

Claudio Lopez
Electric forward who spent a number of excellent seasons at Valencia. Equally at home on the left wing or in attack, his 30 goals in 1998/99 were perhaps the statistical highlight but it was his leading role in the regular demolitions of reigning European champions Real Madrid (see the 6-0 hammering) and Barcelona which really caught the imagination.

Roy Makaay
Gifted forward who was both a great goalscorer and a scorer of great goals. 108 goals in just three seasons while at Deportivo and Bayern testify to his onion-bag-rattling ability. Normally deployed as the lone frontman in Irureta's 4-2-3-1, Makaay was excellent at finishing from range with both feet, while a 6ft 2' frame made him a potent threat in the air.

Sub:

Robbie Fowler
Precocious goalscorer who took the Premiership by storm during his emergence in the mid-1990s. His range of finishing was largely driven by a multi-faceted left foot that helped him to over 30 goals in three consecutive seasons

 

[antohan]

Brwned's back four is superior, as is his firepower. But Gio's midfield trio is phenomenal. I can see him having the lion's share of possession and fancy Aimar and López to help fashion an opening for Makaay.

Make no mistake, if Brwned scored first he could sit back and tear Gio apart on the counter. However, he has too many somewhat luxury (aka: rather lazy) playmakers in Pirlo, Valerón and Recoba for a top level game.

It's a low score win for Gio or a goalfest from Brwned, but I'm inclined to go with Gio's decent tidy back four and an imperious midfield managing the game well.

 

[Brwned]

Can't argue with anyone voting for Gio in pretty much any game in this tournament with that midfield, but I think that's very harsh on Pirlo. Not one to put himself about by any means but at the same time not a luxury player either. Certainly not to the degree of the other two any way. In the same bracket as someone like Fabregas in my view - as a comparison this season Pirlo's made 1.6 tackles per game and 2.2 interceptions per game, Fabregas 1.3 and 1. The other more defensive option I have is to stick Tudor in for Recoba/Larsson and go for a 532 but really none of Hyypia, Tudor or Ferdinand are going to relish stepping into midfield constantly and 3 centre backs on one striker - especially one who can be as anonymous throughout the game as Makaay can - just seems a bit pointless.

 

[Snow]

I rate Pirlo higher than Veron or Mendieta. He's more consistent and he can do all they can do. But Gio's trio is better of course. That's pretty much his whole team though. Every other are on the pitch he won't have a better player than any other team.

 

[antohan]

I think that's very harsh on Pirlo. Not one to put himself about by any means but at the same time not a luxury player either. Certainly not to the degree of the other two any way.

Agree, I did feel I was being a bit harsh on Pirlo grouping him with the other two, but he clearly does not get stuck in (or intercept) to the level Gio's midfielders would.

And no, I wouldn't bring Tudor on either! At least you know that with Pirlo and Valeron behind those three you could do some very serious damage.

 

[Brwned]

He out-battles me in the midfield with Mendieta-Davids up against just Tacchinardi absolutely, but I hope you're not suggesting Veron gets stuck in more than Pirlo?! Davids on his own out-battles most midfield duos and even some trios in this draft though.

I think he'd have a hard time scoring.

 

[Gio]

I rate Pirlo higher than Veron or Mendieta. He's more consistent and he can do all they can do.

He's not got anywhere near the same level of tenacity as Mendieta. Otherwise though, he's a superb player alongside two of my favourite maverick talents of the previous decade in Recoba and Valeron.

 

[antohan]

I rate Pirlo higher than Veron or Mendieta. He's more consistent and he can do all they can do. But Gio's trio is better of course.

Indeed, overall I would merge those two trios into Davids, Mendieta, Pirlo

That's why I say whoever comes out of this group will be incredibly strong. Every team is very good but every one of their rival teams has at least two players who would significantly improve them.

Imagine how much Shearer alone would do for Gio! And Brwned could go for the trio I mentioned before

That's pretty much his whole team though. Every other are on the pitch he won't have a better player than any other team.

The rest of the team is solid enough, Claudio López was very good on his day and Aimar superb. That said, after Davids and Mendieta I would have picked either Aimar or Veron and prioritised a right winger or a better striker myself. There was a bit of midfield focus overkill there.

 

[Snow]

It's solid enough, true, but it feels like the tactics are there to suit the players rather than vice versa. But then again it's like that for both teams. Lopez and Recoba are similar players in terms of how they play. Larsson and Aimar are put in the same position but will certainly play differently. Shearer can fend for himself better than Makaay can but he's a goalscorer after all.

Brwned clearly has the superior striker and back 4 and both teams have similar keepers. It's a very tough call indeed.

 

[Gio]

Imagine how much Shearer alone would do for Gio! And Brwned could go for the trio I mentioned before

The rest of the team is solid enough, Claudio López was very good on his day and Aimar superb. That said, after Davids and Mendieta I would have picked either Aimar or Veron and prioritised a right winger or a better striker myself. There was a bit of midfield focus overkill there.

In retrospect I should have picked up Vieri when he was available around round 4/5 and although I'd personally rank Makaay at his peak in the same bracket as Shearer, he won't garner as many votes.

 

[antohan]

In retrospect I should have picked up Vieri when he was available around round 4/5

Good thing you didn't

I thought I was safe waiting one round as most line leaders were still up for grabs. Suddenly Ruud, Shearer, Drogba, Schevchenko, Crespo were all gone and I was bricking it...

I had you down as the most likely Vieri picker and would have gone apeshit if you did

 

[Jayvin]

This is close. Despite Shearer being the best of the forwards on show, I rate Lopez-Makaay-Aimar as a slightly better front three than Recoba-Shearer-Larsson.

I also reckon the intensity of Davids and Mendieta would make it difficult for Pirlo and Valeron, so i'm leaning towards Gio in respect to winning the midfield battle. Having said that, Brwned has a superb defence and a great all round balance to his team.

I can't decide.

 

[Polaroid]

This is close. Despite Shearer being the best of the forwards on show, I rate Lopez-Makaay-Aimar as a slightly better front three than Recoba-Shearer-Larsson.

I also reckon the intensity of Davids and Mendieta would make it difficult for Pirlo and Valeron, so i'm leaning towards Gio in respect to winning the midfield battle. Having said that, Brwned has a superb defence and a great all round balance to his team.

I can't decide.

Concur with Jayvin's analysis

Who is Brwned's sub? I rate Fowler at his peak in the mid 90s, magical goalscorer

 

[antohan]

This is close. Despite Shearer being the best of the forwards on show, I rate Lopez-Makaay-Aimar as a slightly better front three than Recoba-Shearer-Larsson.

It's more fluid, and Verón-Aimar-López are bound to link up very well, which is what I meant by fancying them to fashion openings for Makaay.

Gio's CB pair should be fine defending deep, it is chasing a game that their lack of pace would be badly exposed but I do fancy him to control the game and not need to get exposed there.

 

[Stobzilla]

Brwnd wins it, just. On top at the back and upfront as well. Midfield battle won by Gio but I don't think it would be enough.

 

[vuc]

Brwned's team is ridiculous.

 

[antohan]

Interesting...

It has to be Makaay, no? Or is it López being underrated?

Maybe Gio should try a 4-3-1-2 bringing on Fowler for one of those two?

Not the most popular of subs unfortunately.

 

[Stobzilla]

Interesting...

It has to be Makaay, no? Or is it López being underrated?

Maybe Gio should try a 4-3-1-2 bringing on Fowler for one of those two?

Not the most popular of subs unfortunately.

Would you rate Lopez as better than larsson ?

 

[peterstorey]

Interesting...

It has to be Makaay, no? Or is it López being underrated?

Maybe Gio should try a 4-3-1-2 bringing on Fowler for one of those two?

Not the most popular of subs unfortunately.

Shearer and Larsson being overrated by a lot of people.

 

[antohan]

Would you rate Lopez as better than larsson ?

Not as a goalscorer no, but in the sense he does give Gio a degree of wide play that Brwned doesn't possess. Mind you, he is facing Sagnol and Ferdinand when cutting inside...

Oooops!, I hadn't registered it wasn't Zambrotta's flank, it means Zambrotta is freely working the other flank, which has to be a major concern.

Mmmm, maybe Gio's original lop-sided tactics with Mendieta on the right would be better here. Would require a lot more from Davids but he has spare capacity right now anyway.

Still, Gio is really short of someone better/more impressive than Makaay or Fowler to throw up shit in the box. Ferdinand and Hyppia are looking very comfortable.

 

[Gio]

As much as I rate Brwned's defence as probably the best in the competition, I don't think there's much of a difference between it and mine. Ziege and Babbel are on a similar level to Zambrotta and Sagnol, and having played together offer chemistry so crucial to defensive relationships. In the centre Ferdinand against Gamarra is the difference, but Naybet as the best La Liga defender alongside Ayala and I'd rate him as marginally better than Hyppia.

The main issue for me though would be Brwned's 4-5 players who'd contribute very little defensively and not afford his talented defence much in the way of protection. Whereas my attacking midfielders in Aimar and Lopez are capable of grafting back, Aimar often shining in a midfield two for Valencia and Lopez a reliable worker down the left.

 

[Stobzilla]

Shearer and Larsson being overrated by a lot of people.

Yeah, we must be thinking of that other Alan Shearer, the one who didn't score 379 club career goals at better than one every other game.

 

[antohan]

Shearer and Larsson being overrated by a lot of people.

Not sure about that, but I don't find that trident as compelling as others seem to, that much is clear.

 

[Gio]

Yeah, we must be thinking of that other Alan Shearer, the one who didn't score 379 club career goals at better than one every other game.

Interestingly Makaay (526 league games, 256 goals) and Shearer's goal-per-games ratio (559 games, 283 goals) is almost exactly the same.

It's more fluid, and Verón-Aimar-López are bound to link up very well, which is what I meant by fancying them to fashion openings for Makaay.

Gio's CB pair should be fine defending deep, it is chasing a game that their lack of pace would be badly exposed but I do fancy him to control the game and not need to get exposed there.

The pace of the centre-half duo was a fair point when up against Henry. But none of Brwned's front five were notably quick - especially when compared against Lopez and Makaay (was Hyppia ever that pacy?).

Not as a goalscorer no, but in the sense he does give Gio a degree of wide play that Brwned doesn't possess. Mind you, he is facing Sagnol and Ferdinand when cutting inside...

Oooops!, I hadn't registered it wasn't Zambrotta's flank, it means Zambrotta is freely working the other flank, which has to be a major concern.

In fairness at least I've got nominal midfielders working back to pick up foraging full-backs. And it's surely Ziege who boasts the best attacking product of any of the full-backs and who'd get the most joy?

 

[Stobzilla]

Interestingly Makaay (526 league games, 256 goals) and Shearer's goal-per-games ratio (559 games, 283 goals) is almost exactly the same.



The pace of the centre-half duo was a fair point when up against Henry. But none of Brwned's front five were notably quick - especially when compared against Lopez and Makaay (was Hyppia ever that pacy?).



In fairness at least I've got nominal midfielders working back to pick up foraging full-backs. And it's surely Ziege who boasts the best attacking product of any of the full-backs and who'd get the most joy?

You can prove anything with facts.

 

[Annihilate Now!]

My only problem with Brwned's team is Rustu, who was a bit too eccentric for my liking and could just as easily cost your team a goal as he could win you a game (IMO). Other then that, his team is strong in all areas, his defence is solid as can be (a Hyypia + Ferdinand tandem would be good enough for any team, anyhere) and his front 3 will score goals... that much is almost a guarentee. His midfield does pale in comparison to the other two units, yet it still contains one of the finest passers of the ball in the modern game, and Juan Carlos Valeron, who was a creative force at his peak.

Gio's team for me is solid (very solid in fact) but fairly unspectacular. Whilst his defence is good, I can see Larsson and Shearer causing them a lot of problems... particularly Shearer's prowess in the air. His midfield are more combatant, but Brwned's midfield are extremely accomplished on the ball, and so won't be intimidated into conceding possession easily. Up front, Roy Maakay is probably one of the most underrated strikers of modern times for me, he was a quality player... BUT I think he would find the going tough against Rio and Hyppia. Aimar's dribbling and creativity would probably cause them more problems, but Sagnol's not a bad player to be marking him. Finally, I don't think I rate Lopez as highly as others seemingly do....

In short, Brwned's to take it... as his solid defensive unit coupled with his creativity, skill, power and finishing going forward would win it.

 

[Brwned]

Interestingly Makaay (526 league games, 256 goals) and Shearer's goal-per-games ratio (559 games, 283 goals) is almost exactly the same.

At their peaks it's 74 in 103 for Makaay (last year at Depor, first two at Bayern) and 112 in 138 for Shearer at Blackburn - 0.73 for Makaay and 0.81 for Shearer. Not a huge difference but worth noting all the same, although it's 104 in 144 for Makaay in all competitions compared to 130 in 171 for Shearer - 0.73 for Makaay compared to 0.76 for Shearer, Makaay was very good in Europe during that time.

I just don't think Makaay's that popular a player. Shearer's a PL legend. Same for Larsson over Lopez, Hyypia over Gamarra (and maybe even Naybet?) and probably my two fullbacks over yours. Just one of those things really, people are happier voting for those they're more familiar with.

 

[antohan]

In fairness at least I've got nominal midfielders working back to pick up foraging full-backs. And it's surely Ziege who boasts the best attacking product of any of the full-backs and who'd get the most joy?

I'm just wondering whether your original tactic was better for this game. It was criticised as having less width than Cling's but here Brwned has none, other than Zambrotta moving up that flank, which Mendieta in the original role you gave him would shut out. It would mean Davids-Veron vs. Tacch-Pirlo, which makes it look more even, although by Brwned's own admission Davids could deal with two midfielders single handedly. Aimar would still contribute a lot more in pressing than Valerón as well.

As Brwned says, you do have an issue with players being underrated. Makaay was a goal machine in European games but his teams never won much so people probably place him alongside those occasionally prolific European goalscorers who weren't that good anyway (e.g. Prso, I know, it is criminal that I even suggest it).

With Ziege you are probably having Liverpool's Ziege compared to World Cup winnig/CL-finalist Zambrotta. A tad unfair as well. Fact is Ziege and López would tear Sagnol apart.

I find it really bizarre that in every other game the most popular justifications for votes are 1. wins the midfield battle and 2. has more width. You win those two yet are getting slaughtered here.

It really must be a case of familiarity and aura.

 

[Cutch]

Went for Gio simply because Lopez, Aimar, Veron are 3 of my favourite players of the last 15 years. Davids and Mendieta make it a very impressive front 6 though Brwned definately has the better centre backs.

 

[Brwned]

Gio's making a comeback in the last 3rd here and I don't like it.

 

[TheReligion]

I am going for Gio due to that midfield of his. I think it has to be the best in the competition. In Veron, Davids and Mendieta you have steal, grit, creativity and ball retention.

I also think Hyypia is being quite overrated and Recoba was hit and miss. With Shearer in the side you need to go 4-4-2 as a Shearer Larsson partnership would be phenomenal with good service out wide.

Close game though.

 

[Brwned]

1 hour left, time to get the votes in.