40s Draft R1 : Tuppet vs Gol123 | Tuppet wins 15-4!

[Moby]

Team Tuppet​

Tactics:
A flexible 4-2-3-1 / 4-3-3 formation.

Let me start by describing my brilliant multifaceted attack.
On the left I have the Balkan Miracle, Magic Dragan. Dragon Dzajic along with George Best is the best left winger in this draft and with his mesmerizing dribbling is capable of giving a torrid time to even the best fullbacks. As he did with legendary Jose Antonio Camacho, when his team Crevna Zvezda beat Real Madrid 2-0 -



While Dragan Provides trickery and directness from left side, on the right side I have hard graft and brilliant technique of Causio. One of the most talented right midfielder in Italian history, 'Il Baron' was voted as the all time best right side attacker of Juventus. He was also nominated for Ballon D’or 4 times.Causio was a great dribbler himself and had the stamina to dominate the right flank all by himself. His Stamina crossing and Technique would provide balance and variety in my wing attack.

As the central playmaker, I have probably the best in draft, the golden boy Gianni Rivera. Rivera’s creativity, passing and impeccable dribbling along with Dzajic and Causio would help creating multitude of chances for my striker. I shouldn’t really have to say much about Rivera . He is one of the greatest legend in both Italian and AC Milan’s history and he is the most creative player on the pitch.

To gobble up these chances I just happen to have one of the most prolific and complete striker in Lubanski. Lubanski is the all time highest goal scorer for Polish national team. He has proven that he is a prolific scorer not only in International games and Polish leagues, but in best European games as well. He was the talisman of a Gormik team, which reached final of CWC and quarter finals of Champions league. A truly complete forward Lubanski had every thing - pace, dribbling, heading, finishing. Malcolm Allison said that “he was in the same class of Eusebio” and when In the sixties, when Górnik Zabrze toured South America, Peruvian and Brazilian journalists wrote enthusiastically, "The White Pele arrives". Kazimierz Górski rated Lubański as the most complete footballer he had ever managed, even in consideration of Deyna.

This attack has everything - Vision, Creativity, absolutely mesmerizing dribbling ability along with work rate and physicallity and finishing. I don’t see gol123 defense stopping my attack at all.

This is then supported by 2 fantastic midfielders in Bo Larsson and Wilson Piazza. Bo larsson would be playing as a box to box player, while Piazza would look to keep the shape and be the most defensive midfielder.

Now Bo Larsson was a truly special talent, a complete player able to play almost anywhere in the field. In his youth he was a prolific forward, top scorer in his league 4 times, but later on settled in midfield, especially in national team. He played in 70, 74 and 78 world cup in a box to box midfield role and his team manager Georg Ericson used to say that "When picking a Swedish national squad you start by picking Bosse Larsson, then you start thinking about which other players to pick". He was equally creative and tenecious, and can take the playmaker role if Rivera is being marked. The only reason people don’t hear his name more, is because his wife was not able to settle in another country. When he moved to Stuttgart, he was again brilliant, and was awarded Athlete of the year by city of Stuttgart. But could not stay there for more than 3 seasons because of his homesick wife. In any case he was again brilliant in Sweden winning the golden ball twice and being the first person doing it. His presence in midfield would help the likes of Rivera and Piazza to exert control.

In defensive midfield role I have World cup winning Wilson Piazza, who played as a makeshift defender for Brazil in 1970, but was a defensive midfielder throughout his career. He was the captain and one of the most important players in the Cruzeiro team, leading it to their first Copa Libertadores in 1976. He used to square against some of the best offensive players of all time in Brazilian league including probably the best of all time Pele. One of the best moment in his career came when Cruzeiro played Santos in 1966 Brazilian championship final. Santos was the best team in the world at that time, with Pele its captain and talisman and were already up by 1-0. In one phase of the game, Pele dropped deep to receive the ball, he felt his marker piazza approaching him, turned his body to do his trademark dribble, one which has left many markers left for dead in his career. But such was the effectiveness of Piazza that he won the ball clean, almost without touching it and start a counterattack, the greatest player of all time stood still. That game ended in 6-2 score line for Cruzeiro and known as "The day Santos skin was placed on the wheel by a blue machine" . Piazza completely nullified Pele and made him so frustrated that he kicked him and got sent off. http://imortaisdofutebol.com/2013/03/19/jogos-eternos-cruzeiro-6x2-santos-1966/

In defense I have Albert Shesternyov, who is IMO the best defender on the field. A fantastic defender and a great leader he with his athleticism and tactical intelligence be a wall in front of my goal. As a defender he was selected in Ballon D’or rating 4 times, getting the best rating of 10th, he was also selected in Team of the tournament for Euro 1968 and led his beloved CSKA Moscow to their first title in 19 years. A great footballer who is also known as the most unluckiest man in Euro history -http://www.goaldentimes.org/vintage-vignettes-unluckiest-man-in-euro-history/ for he got out of the tournament just because he called the toss wrong.

Supporting him on the right is a fellow Euro 68 Team of tournament member in Mirsad Fazlagic. A strong resolute right back, who is the finest Bosnian footballer of all time. He is another of great leaders in my team, leading Yugoslavia to finals of Euro 1968 as its Captain. He would be less adventurous of my full backs, which works well with Causio ahead of him, playing the whole wing up and down by himself.

My second center back is Julio Melendez, who along with Chumpitaz the finest Peruvian defender of all time. A Copa America winner, he is also named as a defender in Boca all time XI squad. His elegant style on the ball caused Boca fans to Sing With fervor: " I see it now, I see it now ... it is a Peruvian and His ballet “. His Elegance and Shesternyov's physicality makes them a great complimentary pair.

On left side I have Lovchev, who as an LB won Soviet player of the year 1972. An extremely fast defender with great dribbling abilities, he has the physicality to dominate the flank and keep with any winger. His great overlapping runs would make my left side combination of Dzjic and Lovchev very potent.

Finally in goalkeeper Emerson Leao I have one of the most underrated, yet one of the finest goalkeeper of all time. He was famous for his superb reflexive saves. In a documentary video produced by FIFA “FIFA Fever” he was rated as the third most impressive defensive player of all time.

Why would I win:
1. My attack is absolutely brilliant and Gol123’s defense can not live with it.

2. So many great leaders and players who dragged their teams to unlikely rewards - Dzajic, Lubanski, Shesternyov, Fazlagic, Melendez, Piazza.

3. A physical and powerful midfield, which would help in countering the brilliant midfield of gol123 and esp Van Hanageme.

4. Best players in key positions - I have best striker on the pitch, best winger and best playmaker.

I have done detailed posts on some of my players here -
Lubanski
Dzajic
Causio
Rivera
Bo Larsson
Piazza
Shesternyov
Julio Melendez
Fazlagic
Lovchev

TEAM TUPPET

vs


TEAM GOL123

 

[Moby]

Team Gol123​

Introduction

I am a big fan of possession football. I believe that having possession of the ball not only reduces the chances of your opponent having goal scoring opportunities but it also increases the chances of your own team creating goal scoring opportunities. I know a lot of people will not be a fan of it due to watching Louis Van Gaals style of football, something that has created a negative image in the eyes of most on this forum about what possession football means. Possession football is essentially what it is in the name:


The goal of dominating the amount of time you have on the ball to increase your chances of winning a game.


This isn’t the same as what is being played at United. United are playing a “type” of possession football, as are many teams in the top leagues who will have the majority of the ball in games. Man City also play possession football. Bayern, Dortmund (This season), Barcelona, Real Madrid, Porto, Chelsea, Arsenal and even Tottenham play possession football. The stats prove this as each of these teams are consistently keeping the ball for more than their opponents. However, this doesn’t mean they all play the same way. Not in the slightest do any of these teams play the same way as each other.

Bayern play with a high press, pegging back the opposition with their pressing and forcing their opponent into their own box where they use the movement of wingers such as Costa and Robben to stretch the opposition whilst their other attackers thread ball into the strikers. Manchester United play with a lower pressing game. They are much more passive with their football, preferring to keep it within their own half more than pressing high up the pitch. They circulate the ball around in their own half, drawing the opponent out and making sure they don’t lose the ball in dangerous situations. When the opponent comes out of position they attack and try to fashion a chance from the space left from the opponent’s rashness.


See here, two types of possession football yet two very different styles. One is aggressive and proactive, the other is passive and more reactive. Each has their merits and de merits and whilst a lot of United fans will prefer the former, the latter can also be implemented effectively. Possession football is a very diverse and broad term for a playing style which in one person’s hands can become negative and in another person’s hands can become reckless.



My team will be taking inspiration from two types of tactics, the Dutch Total football and the German Gegen Pressing. First off, what is Total football and Gegenpressing?

Total Football

When asked what total football is about, Johann Cruyff, one of the strategy’s most famous proponents, simply said: “attackers could play as defenders and defenders as attackers. Everyone could play everywhere.”

Total football is an attack-oriented strategy where players have no definite position. With the exception of the goalkeeper, everybody is allowed to play anywhere on the field. Coordination, spacing, and player movement are the key elements of total soccer.

Total soccer strategy is most closely associated with Netherlands, where it has been first played. In the 1974 World Cup, the Dutch national team brought it to world prominence under coach Rinus Michels.

In total football, players switch to different positions to confuse the opponent’s defense. For this strategy to work, there must be a midfielder who can coordinate both offense and defense.

In the case of the Dutch soccer team of the 1970s, that man was Johan Cruyff. He played as forward but he often moved to different roles as his team needed it. But more importantly, he could tell his teammates where to go and what position they should occupy.

Total football’s main strategy is to possess the ball as much as possible. Players position themselves far from each other and pass the ball around. While the ball is being distributed, some players move around to get into good scoring position.

There are THREE main objectives in a total football defense: keep the ball away from the goal, intercept passes, and mark deadly strikers. Total footballers work as a unit in defense. They narrow down passing lanes and work together aggressively retrieve the ball as soon as possible.

When seeing total football for the first time, people may ask why players have to switch positions. To understand this, let us have a little historical background on football in the 1960s.

During that decade, Europe was dominated by Italy with its hyper-defensive football strategy called “catenaccio.” In catenaccio calcio, players man-mark their opponents closely to deny them the chance to score.

Such tight man-marking became a problem for many clubs. Coach Rinus Michels of Ajax defeated it by making his players move to different positions. This soccer strategy created a dilemma for the man-markers.

If they chased their man, they would find themselves in the wrong position when it is their team’s turn to attack. If they let their man go, they are risking the chance of leaving an attacker open.

Rinus trained his players so they can easily adapt to any position. Opponents who were not as well-adapted as the Dutch total football players found it difficult to keep up.

Total football is most closely linked to Rinus Michels and Johan Cruyff but its invention precedes the Dutch. It was English coach Jimmy Hogan who laid the foundations in 1910 of what would later be called as total soccer.

Hogan introduced the two basic concepts of total soccer as coach of Dutch football club Dordecht: player stamina and ball passing. 15 years later, the strategy that Jimmy Hogan brought to Netherlands was refined by fellow English coach Jack Reynolds.

Reynolds managed Ajax Amsterdam intermittently from 1915 to 1947. He is the one who brought the aspect of spacing into Hogan’s strategy. He did this by introducing the winger, a soccer position where a player widens the offense by running the ball on the flanks.

One of the most brilliant players in Reynold’s Ajax squad was Dutchman Rinus Michels. He had the mindset of a strategy maker which qualified him to become Ajax’s manager in 1965 and Netherlands’ coach in 1974.

Michels trained his Ajax players to be versatile anywhere on the field. He also taught his team to work well with each other. It is in Michels’ time that “totaalvoetbal” (total football) acquired its name.

The total soccer of Ajax in the 1960s and 1970s became so popular mainly because of the great players who executed it. Soccer legends Johan Cruyff and Johan Neskeens are two of the players who worked this strategy to success on the pitch.

Using the total football system, Ajax won three consecutive European Football Cups (1971, 1972, & 1973), the most prestigious club competition in Europe. These impressive victories proved to the world the effectiveness of the concept of total football.

In the 1974 World Cup, Cruyff and the Dutch football team executed total football to perfection that they became known as “Clockwork Orange.” This nickname denotes the team’s execution of total soccer, which is unfailing as the working of a clock.

The Dutch team’s execution of total football brought them to the final of the 1974 World Cup. Using the same strategy, they reached the 1978 World Cup final only to see the championship elude them once more.

After retiring from playing, Johan Cruyff pursued the career of a football manager. It is during his tenure in Barcelona when he utilized the principles of total football to create a style called “tiki-taka.”

Tiki-taka is characterized by consistent ball passing and player movement. It centers on a midfielder who controls the team’s offense. Today, tiki-taka has also become a significant strategy of the Spanish football team. Spaniards used it to win the European Football Championships in 2008 and the FIFA World Cup in 2010.

Total football no longer exists in its purest form because of its huge demand on player versatility and stamina. Yet its principles of passing, wide spacing, and player movement are evident in the attack-oriented football strategies of the present.


To summarise total football:

· Aggressive and tactical pressing to close down channels of passing

· Fluidity with and without the ball

· Players making attacking contributions from anywhere within the pitch to confuse and disorganise defending teams

· Players covering other players and filling in their position to keep their own organisation

 

[Moby]

Gegenpressing

Gegenpressing has been a buzzword in football tactics for the last five years and has garnered more and more attention in the media recently. Because of the success of FC Barcelona and Borussia Dortmund, gegen- or counterpressing has been brought up as one of the main reasons for their titles. BVB, in particular, is defined by their style. However, the media often shows a lack of understanding as to what counterpressing really is.

Gegenpressing means to press the opposition right after losing possession, i.e. to press as an organized unit the moment you transition to defense. The entire team hunts the ball and, in the ideal case, immediately WINS it back from the opponent. The aim is twofold; to prevent the opponent’s counterattack and to win the ball. The English, and even the Spanish and Italians, call it counterpressing and not “Gegenpressing”; in the end the opponent’s counterattack is pressured. In 2008, Jürgen Klinsmann spoke of “immediate ball RECOVERY” and struck at the heart of the matter very well.

There are several prerequisites for successful counterpressing. The decisive factor is the overall positioning of the team and their playing style right before attempting to counterpress. The players must play as close to one another as possible so that they can press together as a unit right after the ball is lost – which is a given in short passing football. At the same time, they should not stick so close to one another that they neglect to cover enough space. Usually, a good layout in possession and a good shape behind the lost ball go hand in hand.

Some trainers use the basic rule of thumb to “occupy the fewest possible zones with individual players, but the greatest possible distance between the players within those zones so that they don’t occupy the same space” to make the positioning simple to understand; although, with a rule of thumb like this, some aspects are lost in terms of complexity.

Many teams also have PROBLEMS deciding when to stop pressing, i.e. when do you stop pressing if you can’t win the ball back? When should you retreat? How long should you press and with how many players? This is particularly problematic because the position of the ball is always changing. Therefore, there is a commonly used theory – the five second rule. Immediately after losing the ball the team should press at top speed and with maximum intensity for five seconds.

If the team hasn’t recovered the ball within five seconds and there is no chance of immediately winning it, they should fall back into their defensive formation. Depending on the team, the number of seconds may VARY. It is recommended that the strategic basics of Gegenpressing be coached in order to develop a flexible, situation-specific length of time for counterpressing.

It is also important that the team respond very quickly and with anticipation. When possession changes, the players should already be running; next, it is important for the motor response and cognitive reaction to accurately match the manner of the opponent winning the ball and the situation and the anticipation of the possession change. The player must always expect that possession could come, but at the same time assign to the situation a certain percentage and behave accordingly. The observation of the situation and the shape is important.

There are a few aspects which should be implemented for an accurate Gegenpressing. Blocking the center of the field is important for a successful implementation. In the middle of the field, the opponent has more options when it comes to rotation, field of vision, and passing. Even if a player arcs their run to block one side of the field, the opponent will have the other entire half of the field to work with. Ideally, the opponent who recovers the ball will be forced in the DIRECTION of the touchline or back towards his own goal and away from the center of the field. There, he will have no opportunity to rotate and his choices will be limited, which will also rob him of the most effective and quickest path towards goal, as any counterattack will take longer.

Ideally, the opponent will be surrounded from the center out, forcing him to play backwards or square passes and thus isolating him from his teammates. This naturally raises the question of who ultimately won the ball. Some teams only try to cut off the opponent on the ball and attack him passively. Which is good, as one will not be outplayed and the nearest presser has a chance to recover the ball. But, at the same time, the opponents can move freely, slow the game down, and GENERATE more options for themselves.

Another option is to run DIRECTLY at the ball carrier; the opponent is simply pressed aggressively as possible, one does not slow down first or establish the ominous “basketball distance” when challenging for the ball. As a result, the opponent has less time, the pace is quicker, and you can attack more aggressively. At the same time, you will lose the challenge more often, be outplayed or commit fouls.

A final method is to deliberately run past the opponent. The opponent will not be slowed down, but the first counterpressing player has no intention of winning the ball. He should merely hand off the opponent and retain his own original position in the cover shadow. As a result, the tempo here is extremely quick and the opponent will be forced into a specific action to which the pressing team can more easily react. The next player attacks and can then win the ball easier. An interesting side note: after the ball is RECOVERED, you can immediately play a clear pass to the player who has run past the opponent. “Clear” here means that the distance is suitable, space is gained, and the teammate knows from the previous situation that he is in front of an opponent.

There are a few different ways to achieve Gegenpressing, either by cutting off the passing lanes or by relentlessly attacking the opposition’s defenders. A mix of both would be suitable for my tactic.


· Aggressive pressing of the ball, aiming to double up and man press the player on the ball

· Winning the ball back 5 seconds after losing it, making sure the pressing happens when play is restricted

· Taking advantage of the opposition’s lack of organisation to press and win the ball, exploiting gaps in their defence to attack with speed.


How I will implement this within my team

Now that we have an idea as to what I want to achieve with my team;

. Aggressive pressing, aiming to win the ball as high up the pitch as possible and take advantage of the seconds where a team is transitioning from defence to attack

. Implementing both a man pressing and a lane pressing system to cut off attacking options and force the opposition into mistakes

. Ball retention of the highest order, keeping the ball and manipulating the opposition to move around and wear themselves out or draw them out of their defensive positions.

. Take advantage of their transition from attack to defence to exploit the space in front of my team. Using a fluid and creative style to confuse the opposition’s players with attacking contributions from all over the park

. Direct running from my attacking players to add penetration to my attack and to confuse the opposition defence

. Covering players making forward runs to keep my own organisation at the back

. Condensing the play and then stretching it to pull the opposition defence from left to right and create gaps forward runs.


This is an outline of how my tactics will work.

The problem with Pep Guardiola’s style and “Tiki Taka” is that it was too extreme. The style was too aggressive and forced opposition teams to regress and sit back. This meant that under no circumstance did the opposition try and come out and make themselves vulnerable to a forward run from a player and it resulted in games where Barca/Bayern sat/sit outside the opposition’s box waiting for a chance to move, with little chance of it happening. They also lacked any sort of direct play within their team, Messi being one of the only world class players to really offer forward runs into the box. This meant that their attack was channelled through one route (Messi) and made it easier for teams to triple up and mark him (Not that marking him was ever easy mind).

The problem with Gegenpressing on its own is that it has no real way to assert control on a game. It wasn’t a possession based tactic, rather a high tempo counter attacking based one used by many possession teams. You lacked any sort of control on a game and that left you much more vulnerable to opposition scoring goals. It also meant that you would be playing at a high tempo all game, which would result in fatigue for almost every single team around.

The problem with Total football is it wasn’t extreme enough. Sure, for its time it was a pretty radical tactic but when compared to the tactics today, it will obviously not have the same level of devotion ingrained into it. The pressing wasn’t as high, the passing wasn’t as crisp and the possession wasn’t as dominant. It was still a great tactic and the best base to build a possession based team out of.

 

[Moby]

Team’s tactical system

The best way to explain how my team will be set up to go about playing football, is to split them up into three key phases of play. Of course, a game will have many more phases within them and this is the most basic way to explain what I want my team to do:


Phase 1 – Winning the ball:

This is the phase straight after I lose the ball or the opponent regains possession. Within this phase, there is a 5 second period (That is the believed period of when the team in possession is most vulnerable for most teams implementing a similar pressing system) where my team will press the other team both aggressively and tactically. The tenacity of all of my players (Lead by Van Hanegem and Overath) across the line-up, allows me to press hard and hunt down the opposition by cutting off passing lanes and putting pressure on the man with the ball, either forcing them to lose it or pass back to the keeper and hoof it out. They also have the tactical know how to know when to cover players who are pushing up to press the opposition so that we don’t lose our shape when implementing this pressing. Once the five seconds are over and if by some chance my team hasn’t got the ball, my team will fall back into a similar starting line-up and formation to what they started with and will press less aggressively, going for a more space orientated press whereby they put pressure on a team to force them down channels where they will ultimately lose the ball (Similar to the Dutch total football style of pressing). They will do this, cutting off any passing lanes until they have won the ball.


Phase 2 – Retention of the ball:

Once possession is won, my team will need to retain the ball. This phase is dependent on where the ball is won, how tired my players are, the position of the opposing defence and the position of my attackers. If there is space ahead for my team to attack then this phase is skipped and go straight to phase 3. If my attackers are too dispersed or their defence is too organised or my players are too tired, then this phase will be used. Retention is essentially keeping it. The ball, when won, will go straight to either Van Hanegem or Overath (My two best passers). As both of these together are two of the best passers in the draft, along with Ruben Marcos who is no slouch himself, they are more than capable of keeping and controlling the ball and keeping the ball from the opposing team. This will allow my team to organise and set up the attack and if needed, as a rest period whilst the team plays it around at a slower tempo and a little bit deeper than normal. This stage will also be probing, playing left to right and involving a few dummy runs from defenders to try and disorganise the opposing defence, the goal to create space to attack in. Once the space is there, I will attack.

Phase 3 – Attacking:

This is when I have finished probing, or there is space for my organised attackers to attack. First off, my team’s tempo will increase to a similar tempo as our pressing game. The attackers will also start to make more runs, direct runs into the box, run’s from deep from Van Hanegem and Overath and Ruben Marcos. Defenders pushing forwards to confuse the dfenders. There will be a lot more penetration within this phase of possession and a lot more risk taking from my midfielders with their passing. The play will also be condensed. I will make play small and intricate, forcing the game to be played to my left attacking side. This is done by overloading it with players. Overath will be drifting towards the left hand side of the box, Skoblar will cut in and switch with Overath. Pavoni will offer some width going forwards when needed to and Van Hanegem will offer another body with his powerful driving runs from deep. I will force the opposition to commit more and more players to the left of my attack, or else risk getting overloaded. When that happens, I will stretch their defence. A quick ball back to the holding player (Either Van Hanegem or Overath, depending on who is covering who) and they will ping a forty yard pass to Johnstone. From there, Johnstone will find himself in a one on one with his fullback, a defence scrambling to get back and Ruben Marcos pushing up in support (As my left sided players drop back and my left inside forward gets into the box) and once he beats his man he will find Kindvall in the box.


Key Points:

· Tuppets team won’t be able to handle the pressing game of my players, with a foreign tactic being applied to them, they are much more likely to lose the ball then I am.

· I will dominate the ball, with Van Hanegem and Overath as my linchpins, controlling the tempo between them and covering for each other in all phases of the game.

· Tuppets strikers will be starved of the ball as I target his defensive players, stopping them from building attacks from the back.

· Tuppet will be forced to commit men to the left, leaving Johnstone one vs one with a fullback

· High tempo attacking with lots of direct running to confuse and disorganise his defence.

· Having both Overath and Van Hanegem on one side, utilising their best attributes when attacking and giving them freedom to attack when they want to.

· Players covering for each other so that I don’t lose my defensive shape when I am attacking or pressing.

 

[Moby]

@Tuppet
@Gol123

Good luck gentlemen.

 

[sajeev]

I would love to able to vote on this match but, for one I don't know the players and @Gol123's tactics have put me off reading the whole thing. I got through @Tuppet's but didn't have the will-power to go through the next 3 posts

I am betting on a maximum of 10 votes

 

[harms]

Most of the Tuppet's write up is basically a player profiles, which we, imo, should post in the main thread and Gol's write up looks more like a book about the basics of football. 3 posts, ffs I'll try and look at them later. So far Tuppet looks better

 

[Edgar Allan Pillow]

Yeah, finding the actual tactics in that writeup is difficult.

First Teamsheet impression is at Gol123 for playing van Hanegem in that role! Don't exactly see him, Overath and Skoblar getting the best out of each other.

Flip side I expected Rivera to have a monster game.

Tied even for me now. Need more discussion...

 

[Tuppet]

Best of luck @Gol123 . @harms I get your complaint man, I also do not like to do player profiles in write ups, and thats why I did detailed profiles in main thread. Still I can not count everyone to go there and read them, and most of my players are unknown to most of the voters, so I mentioned briefly about them in write up here.

As for tactical system its fairly standard 4-2-3-1 with a focus on attacking from wings and staying solid in middle. We are not aiming to hit high possession stats (we might, but thats not the aim), neither are we purely counter attacking side with back to the walls defending. We are looking to move the ball quickly and vertically and the players at my disposal suits perfectly for this.

As for gol123's tactic, Possession football is all very good and nice but I don't think Hanegem playing as the deepest midfielder and being directly against Rivera is going to help it. Also I am not sure players like Overath ( who IMO played more like technical box to box Player) suits this particular tactic.

 

[Tuppet]

While we wait for Gol123, check out this spectacular goal by Franco Causio vs Argentina -

Such Flair and Brilliant technique.

 

[Marty1968]

Like how Tuppet has set up here and a couple of players (Shesternyov, Causio and Lubanski) that I wanted in my team. Tuppets attack is far superior to Gol’s in my opinion. Will keep an eye on the debate before voting though…

 

[Gol123]

I'm not going to lie, this is a terrible time for me. I have college all day and have just had an aerosol can sprayed in my ear which has fecked me up big time.

 

[Gol123]

Best of luck @Gol123 . @harms I get your complaint man, I also do not like to do player profiles in write ups, and thats why I did detailed profiles in main thread. Still I can not count everyone to go there and read them, and most of my players are unknown to most of the voters, so I mentioned briefly about them in write up here.

As for tactical system its fairly standard 4-2-3-1 with a focus on attacking from wings and staying solid in middle. We are not aiming to hit high possession stats (we might, but thats not the aim), neither are we purely counter attacking side with back to the walls defending. We are looking to move the ball quickly and vertically and the players at my disposal suits perfectly for this.

As for gol123's tactic, Possession football is all very good and nice but I don't think Hanegem playing as the deepest midfielder and being directly against Rivera is going to help it. Also I am not sure players like Overath ( who IMO played more like technical box to box Player) suits this particular tactic.

I would argue that guys like Van Hanegem and Overath, both coming from deep to attack your left hand side, suits both of those perfectly. I would also argue, with having more possession of the ball, the onus would be on you to stop more of my attacks then they would be for me to particularly have to stop Rivera all of the time. I'm also not having Van Hanagem mark Rivera directly but more have him and Overath pressing higher up and starving Rivera of the ball by cutting off the supply at the source.

I feel the bigger question here is how are Fazlagic and Shesternyev going to handle all three of Skoblar, Overath and Van Hanegem driving forwards and attacking between them.

 

[Tuppet]

I'm not going to lie, this is a terrible time for me. I have college all day and have just had an aerosol can sprayed in my ear which has fecked me up big time.

That sucks man, sorry to hear that. Hope everything is fine. I'll basically just keep debate to answering your questions.

 

[Gol123]

Another thing. How will Lovchev deal with facing Jimmy Johnstone 1 vs 1, considering Johnstone gave Facchetti problems even whilst being doubled up on?

 

[Gol123]

Look at how he did against Facchetti along with two other Inter defenders constantly marking him.

 

[Gol123]

@Tuppet I don't mind you raising your own points either man. As long as things are civil and not hyperbolic you can go as crazy as you want.

 

[Gol123]

Yeah, finding the actual tactics in that writeup is difficult.

First Teamsheet impression is at Gol123 for playing van Hanegem in that role! Don't exactly see him, Overath and Skoblar getting the best out of each other.

Flip side I expected Rivera to have a monster game.

Tied even for me now. Need more discussion...

I can see all three bouncing off of each other perfectly. Van Hanegem, Overath and Skoblar all excelled in one touch passing football. Both Hanegem and Overath are great at driving the ball from deeper, with Overath coming from a more advanced position to the left and Hanegem from the centre with a tendency to the left. Skoblar was renowned for off the ball runs and direct attacking movements, which will be fed through by Van Hanegem or Overath and the latter two also have the tactical awareness to cover for each other when they get forwards.


Here are the key points of my tactic as my write up seems to have put people off:
Key Points:

· Tuppets team won’t be able to handle the pressing game of my players, with a foreign tactic being applied to them, they are much more likely to lose the ball then I am.

· I will dominate the ball, with Van Hanegem and Overath as my linchpins, controlling the tempo between them and covering for each other in all phases of the game.

· Tuppets strikers will be starved of the ball as I target his defensive players, stopping them from building attacks from the back.

· Tuppet will be forced to commit men to the left, leaving Johnstone one vs one with a fullback

· High tempo attacking with lots of direct running to confuse and disorganise his defence.

· Having both Overath and Van Hanegem on one side, utilising their best attributes when attacking and giving them freedom to attack when they want to.

· Players covering for each other so that I don’t lose my defensive shape when I am attacking or pressing.

 

[Tuppet]

Another thing. How will Lovchev deal with facing Jimmy Johnstone 1 vs 1, considering Johnstone gave Facchetti problems even whilst being doubled up on?

Here's the thing, I can pretty much reverse this and ask the same question about how Ubinas going to do against Dzajic, who is the standout winger on the pitch. We both have (almost everyone in this draft) have more attacking players than defensive, and I can see both teams scoring. I however have a defensive midfielder (Piazza) who is better defensively than anyone you have, and my defense is also slightly better. But the difference maker is my attack, which is definitely better than yours.

As for this specific question, Yes I see Johnstone troubling Lovchev sometimes, as he would to most fullbacks. Lovchev for his part is extremely fast and can surely keep up with Johnstone, he would have Larsson to help him out of a sticky situation as well.

 

[Gol123]

Here's the thing, I can pretty much reverse this and ask the same question about how Ubinas going to do against Dzajic, who is the standout winger on the pitch. We both have (almost everyone in this draft) have more attacking players than defensive, and I can see both teams scoring. I however have a defensive midfielder (Piazza) who is better defensively than anyone you have, and my defense is also slightly better. But the difference maker is my attack, which is definitely better than yours.

As for this specific question, Yes I see Johnstone troubling Lovchev sometimes, as he would to most fullbacks. Lovchev for his part is extremely fast and can surely keep up with Johnstone, he would have Larsson to help him out of a sticky situation as well.

If Larsson is helping out Lovchev then your left hand side is overrun and Skoblar and Kindvall will get in on goal. I would also say that Kindvall is as good as Lubanski, considering his goal per game ratio is superior playing in a tougher league.

Possession football, the way I am playing it (with aggressive pressing) does a great job of hiding a teams defensive vulnerability. In that sense, I feel my team is set up to dull your teams attack more then yours is mine, as your attackers are starved of possession of the ball.

 

[Tuppet]

I would argue that guys like Van Hanegem and Overath, both coming from deep to attack your left hand side, suits both of those perfectly. I would also argue, with having more possession of the ball, the onus would be on you to stop more of my attacks then they would be for me to particularly have to stop Rivera all of the time. I'm also not having Van Hanagem mark Rivera directly but more have him and Overath pressing higher up and starving Rivera of the ball by cutting off the supply at the source.

I feel the bigger question here is how are Fazlagic and Shesternyev going to handle all three of Skoblar, Overath and Van Hanegem driving forwards and attacking between them.

Well I disagree here, Hanegem is never the kind of player your tactic seem to make him. He was a box to box playmaking kind of player who would take the ball and run forward. Overath is also very similar, once my defense won the ball in my half, there is pretty much no one to stop Rivera or Larsson from bypassing your whole midfield.

 

[Tuppet]

If Larsson is helping out Lovchev then your left hand side is overrun and Skoblar and Kindvall will get in on goal. I would also say that Kindvall is as good as Lubanski, considering his goal per game ratio is superior playing in a tougher league.

Possession football, the way I am playing it (with aggressive pressing) does a great job of hiding a teams defensive vulnerability. In that sense, I feel my team is set up to dull your teams attack more then yours is mine, as your attackers are starved of possession of the ball.

How are you playing possession football again? Its more foreign to your players than mine. Also I do have 2 central defenders to deal with Kindvall. Larsson is helping out Lovchev sometime when Johnstone attacks him and the ball is in the right side of the field.

And how are you handling Dzajic, Causio, Rivera and Lubanski again ? Saying "yeah well I am playing possession football so all your attack is now useless" is not the answer.

 

[Gol123]

@Tuppet

As @Balu has said, none of my players are slouches defensively. Van Henegem was the holding midfielder for Netherlands, Overaths defensive contributions for his team were a huge reason for their success and Ruben Marcos was equally great defensively as he was offensively. There is no worry for them being overrun and being caught up field either as all three have the tactical awareness to cover for each other (Which all three did repeatedly for their national teams).

About them not being suited to possession football; that's ridiculous IMO. Van Hanegem and Overath played for the two biggest possession based teams (In fact, the Dutch total football was the inspiration for Peps Barca team) at the time. Also, both were considered the best passers in their teams, Van Hanegem for his outside of the boot pass and Overath for his 40 yard raking passes. There is no doubt that my team will dominate possession whilst your players (Although your attackers prefer attacking football) won't dominate it as your CM can't hold up to mine in possession.

Also, my team is playing a pressing game which your CM's don't have the technical abilities to get around to play to Rivera and co.

 

[Tuppet]

@Tuppet

As @Balu has said, none of my players are slouches defensively. Van Henegem was the holding midfielder for Netherlands, Overaths defensive contributions for his team were a huge reason for their success and Ruben Marcos was equally great defensively as he was offensively. There is no worry for them being overrun and being caught up field either as all three have the tactical awareness to cover for each other (Which all three did repeatedly for their national teams).

About them not being suited to possession football; that's ridiculous IMO. Van Hanegem and Overath played for the two biggest possession based teams (In fact, the Dutch total football was the inspiration for Peps Barca team) at the time. Also, both were considered the best passers in their teams, Van Hanegem for his outside of the boot pass and Overath for his 40 yard raking passes. There is no doubt that my team will dominate possession whilst your players (Although your attackers prefer attacking football) won't dominate it as your CM can't hold up to mine in possession.

Also, my team is playing a pressing game which your CM's don't have the technical abilities to get around to play to Rivera and co.

Umm unless I am missing something Van Hanagem was not the holding midfielder for netherlands. He was more of a box to box player who moves in left side of the pitch, using his dribbling abilities, that actually sounds exactly like overath. I am not saying they can not play in possession football, I am saying the way you are playing them is not ideal.

As for Rivera and co not being able to handle total football (which I still maintain your team won't be able to play) -

 

[Gol123]

Umm unless I am missing something Van Hanagem was not the holding midfielder for netherlands. He was more of a box to box player who moves in left side of the pitch, using his dribbling abilities, that actually sounds exactly like overath. I am not saying they can not play in possession football, I am saying the way you are playing them is not ideal.

As for Rivera and co not being able to handle total football (which I still maintain your team won't be able to play) -

He always played a more holding role for the Netherlands. He would get the ball from deep and drive forwards with it just as he is in this team. Whenever he drives forwards, Overath or Ruben Marcos would cover for him. He could also, which he did on many occasions, sit and play the ball out like a deep lying playmaker which he will be doing a bit of in this game too. Like I said in my write up, when we have the ball, he will be the tempo setter, playing balls around with the other midfielders and drawing your team from left to right. When we are attacking he is then going to drive forwards, pushing towards the left and offering another body in the overload (Choosing his moment correctly) whilst Overath drops back and covers him. If I had to compare him to a modern day player, it would be Julien Weigl at Dortmund (Although Van Hanegem is 1000x better then him) and that is the role he will be playing for me. In fact, my whole team is inspired in great parts by Tuchels dortmund side. They mixed together the conservativeness and controlling dominance of possession football and added the frantic pressing and chaos of Gegenpressing and Dutch total football. This is what I was saying in my write up.

Also, Saying my team isn't suited for total football is odd, considering they played in similar systems but also were well known in their careers for their versatility and hard work.

Also, Rivera vs Ajax still doesn't show him against Van Hanegem

 

[Balu]

As @Balu has said, none of my players are slouches defensively.

Well, yeah kinda. I'd still call your team a bit adventurous, didn't expect that set-up after your first 3-4 picks .

 

[Donaldo]

at Gols tactics

 

[Gol123]

at Gols tactics

Yeah, I'm not going to lie, I got way too into this.

 

[harms]

Yeah, I'm not going to lie, I got way too into this.

It cost you, imo. You should've made it shorter - I'm sure the score would've been different (don't think the result would've been though). 13:1 is harsh.

 

[Gol123]

It cost you, imo. You should've made it shorter - I'm sure the score would've been different (don't think the result would've been though). 13:1 is harsh.

Yeah. Oh well, you win some and you lose some.

 

[Annahnomoss]

Happy to see Bosse picked here. Such a versatile player that he was the top scorer three times in the Swedish league while he is probably most known internationally for being a great central midfielder. One of those players who just had everything in his locker, great work rate, tackling and defensive abilities as well as being a great goal scorer and playmaker offensively. Just around a Swedish All-Time XI if you were to make one.

As far as versatility goes he had the skill set and tactical nous to play almost any role and position in a team and did so as well. A bit German in his style when he played as a midfielder, powerful yet intelligent and a good passer too. I would have loved to have him in the team for future upgrades with his versatility.

Ove Kindvall is being pretty invisible here but he's far more than someone who needs to be served a chance to score. He had that Romario turn on him and could easily earn himself enough space to get a shot off even if he is in a 1 vs 1 situation with a good defender. Primarily a great goalscorer with a nous to make difficult runs behind the defense. It was a strong era for the Dutch league too with a Dutch team being in the European Cup final 5 times in a row and Kindvall scored the winning goal for Feyenoord in the final that brought the first European Cup to Holland.

Ajax made it four Dutch wins in a row after that while Feyenoord won a Uefa cup(Without Kindvall) in 73-74 as well.

 

[Skizzo]

@Gol123 while I agree that your OP was way too long for most people to even attempt to look through, it was an interesting read. I think posting that in the main thread and linking to it may have been better, as that way people can choose to delve more into it if they choose, rather than being smacked in the face with it straight away

Whether it would have changed anything or not, well that's tough to say. For what it's worth, when I did get a chance to read it, I did enjoy it

 

[green_smiley]

I am probably one of minority who thinks Gol's writeup is interesting to read

Love his idea on how to bring the best out of 2 football concepts and complement one another. I like some of the players from Tuppet's team, but I always go for managers who strategizes as a team rather than heavily dependent on individual brilliance