2023 Sheep Draft SF - Gio vs. Enigma_87

Who will win the match?


  • Total voters
    9
  • Poll closed .

Michaelf7777777

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Gio:

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Enigma_87:

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Gio Tactics:


As much of a theme as you can ever hope for in a Sheep Draft, there is a South American vibe in play here, with each of the central partnerships evoking the best of the continent.

The defence has been strengthened. Backed up by GOAT goalkeeper Lev Yashin, in comes Daniel Passarella partnered to his right by the pacey Hector Chumpitaz who complements him well. And to his left is Nilton Santos who has plenty of quality on the ball in keeping with the overall approach and also can tuck into a more central role as he did in the back 3 systems earlier in his career. Elsewhere Eric Gerets is the all-round right-back offering defensive solidity (can also tuck in to form a 3), plus a box-to-box game to overlap Robben ahead.

Linking defence and attack is Fernando Redondo and Obdulio Varela. Arguably that is as strong and complementary a partnership as could be sourced from South America, where Varela grit and leadership, while Redondo takes responsibility for transitioning the ball into attacking zones. Varela could operate as a strong and physical box-to-box midfielder, springing forward to score from distance - twice alone in the World Cup against top opposition. But he was most renowned for his anchoring role, controlling the tempo and influencing team-mates and opposition alike. An outlet on his and Redondo's left is Dragan Dzajic who will start wide and use his mesmerising dribbiling to service Pele in the box. On the right is Arjen Robben, a clear goal threat in his own right, particularly bouncing off Pele, but also a creative presence who, like Dzajic, can stretch the play. Rivaldo is back from injury and takes up his customary no10 role. He can work, he can create and he can win matches on his own. Ideally replicating the devastating Rivaldo/Ronaldo dynamic, Pele is the centrepoint of the attack with the freedom to roam across the line and drop into the 10 space. Collectively a lot of pace and trickery in the attack which should present a range of routes to goal.

Enigma_87 Tactics:

Formation: 4-3-3
Style:
Team build around Platini, balanced, press in our half, counter attack and move the ball quickly as possible through the lines. Platini pulling the strings and exploiting Gullit/Stoichkov pace on the wings.

Defence:
On goal is Dino Zoff, Italy greatest keeper after Buffon and it's not like there isn't competition for that title. In front of him we have a classic sweeper/stopper combo with Scirea playing alongside Godin. Bergomi will be more of a balanced full back who can also provide vital cover in the defensive end with his physical frame considering the opposition will field a two striker system. On the left we have Breitner who will be in his left back, young incarnation. A true playmaker from the flank he is also renown with his powerful strike which provides us with an extra goalscoring option as well as the ability to both shore the midfield, help with the build up but also be a presence on the flank and double up on the opposition right flank. Scirea and Zoff come in a proven combo with what is probably an upgrade on the original Juve defence that set the world alight in the late 70's, early 80's. Bergomi comes in as the balanced tucked in RB, helping Scirea perform his natural role of a leader at the back. Scirea and Bergomi also formed a formidable partnership with Bergomi for the national team whilst Godin is the rugged stopper type which compliments Scirea natural elegance on the ball.

Midfield:
Shielding the defence is on of the best at the job - Desailly who will also mind the opposition best player in Baggio when occupying his zone. Tardelli forms a known partnership with Platini and doing most of the dirty work. Platini is in his natural role as main playmaker of the team and linking up midfield and attack, whilst also being a main goalscoring threat to the opposition line. The mechanics in midfield aren't any different but it's rather proven combo and personality change. The midfield remains the same with Desailly also providing a pivotal defensive role protecting the back 4. Something very few in history can better.

Attack:
A mouthwatering duo on the flanks in Gullit and Stoichkov will stretch the defence, whilst also being a threat cutting in and finishing chances themselves. Both are also great creativity outlets to each other as Stoichkov crossing would be a very viable route to goal with Spencer and Gullit in the box. Luis Suarez comes in for Spencer. His dogged style will provide us with the first line of defence, terrorizing the opposition defenders and forcing them into errors, whilst also having the eye for the goal and movement to capitalize off Platini passing ability whilst also drawing defenders off their natural position allowing Stoichkov and Gullit to storm in the box.

Upgrades:
Luis Suarez is a common name in the last 20 years and one of the finest strikers ever played. He's a cnut of the highest order but his will to win is unmatched. Only two players in history had better G+A in a single season (Messi and Cristiano). His peak was really outstanding:
4. Luis Suarez (Barcelona) – 83 goals and assists (2015-16)
The Uruguayan forward moved to Barcelona in the summer of 2014 but was forced to watch from the sidelines for two months as he was suspended for an incident during the 2014 FIFA World Cup. El Pistolero, arguably one of the most talented players of the decade behind the Argentine and Portuguese, will also go down in the history books. Suarez’s second season at Barcelona was the greatest season a striker has ever had, even greater than his own 2013-14 (Liverpool) campaign.

Luis Suarez finished his career with Barcelona as the recipient of the Pichichi Award, the trophy for LaLiga’s top scorer. The Uruguay international finished with 40 goals, beating Real Madrid’s Cristiano Ronaldo and Barcelona teammate Lionel Messi to the top spot. It marked the first time since 2009 that someone other than Ronaldo or Messi had won the award, helping them clinch the Spanish title in the 2015-16 season.


Liverpool's No 7 grabbed a remarkable 31 goals (zero from penalties) and 12 assists, despite being suspended for the first five league games of the season. He even hit the woodwork nine times and set up countless more chances.
His goals per game rate of 0.94 puts him above the best single-season ratio of fellow Golden Boot winners such as Alan Shearer, Cristiano Ronaldo, Mohamad Salah and Thierry Henry. Plus the quality of Suarez's strikes was amazing, as he tore defences apart.
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Gaetano Scirea
A fantastic leader at the back he boosts our defence and takes his honorable place as the leader of the heart of the defence:


  • 7 domestic titles
  • 1 Champions League title (European Cup)
  • 1 World Cup
Winner of every UEFA club and domestic competition while at Juventus, Gaetano Scirea was the center-back for Italy on their way to their World Cup victory at Espana in 1982. And the defender, who sadly died at the tender age of 36, inspired future generations. "When I broke the record for most appearances at Juve, it was only important for me because it was attached to Gaetano," said Alessandro Del Piero
 
Thanks for setting it up @Michaelf7777777 !

all the best @Gio!

To kick it off obviously Gio has a great team but I have few concerns - mainly the defence where we have an upper hand imo in both being a well oiled one - Scirea/Zoff/Bergomi and I feel in quality too.

To me Chumpitaz / Passarella is a bit off as both are very similar in their game and probably not compliment each other well. Both short af, with great leap of course but adventurous ball playing center backs who loved to go forward.

The other concern is with Varela as I purely don’t rate pre footage players and there is simply no evidence of his game. His frame and from the limited 2-3 mins I’ve seen he seems as a typical destroyer of his era but with suspect athletic capabilities and he’s up against one of the greatest #10 in the game. There isn’t simply enough evidence of his game which is why I usually stay well clear of that era.

On that front I think our midfield aided also by Breitner who can put an additional body in midfield can box and close down quickly Gios front six, force them into an error and launch a quick counter.

Rivaldo and Dzajic are not that likely to contribute that much on the defensive end so I think we have an advantage there.
 
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All the best @Enigma_87.

As much as I respect your defence and the thematics around it, I reckon the quality is fairly similar. Yashin edges Zoff, Nilton edges Breitner - particularly defensively, Passarella beats Godin, Scirea takes Chumpitaz, and Bergomi edges Gerets defensively. If anything we might edge it comparing the back 5s. Throw in Varela/Desailly and it’s similar quality again.

Two main differences though:
  1. The defensive half of our team has a lot more quality on the ball. Each of the 4 at the back excelled in playing in more ball-dominating set-ups. And we clearly have an advantage in transitioning the ball into midfield through Redondo in particular, in comparison to the more basic passing ability of Tardelli and Desailly
  2. Most importantly what matters most is what they’re up against. Robben’s extreme pace and surging dribbling ability against Breitner is a big concern. And Pele is clearly going to cause major problems. Notwithstanding the defensive acumen of Godin and Scirea, there isn’t much pace and agility there: qualities that Pele maxed like few before or since. Both were always paired with a more athletic stopper which maxed out the partnerships they held with the likes of Giminez, Miranda, Collovati etc.
I reckon ultimately the advantages we have in build-up and approach will provide plenty of service to Robben and Pele in particular, but Dzajic and Rivaldo too, and they will find ways through.
 
Rivaldo and Dzajic are not that likely to contribute that much on the defensive end so I think we have an advantage there.
Always wondered about that image of his, as I read it quite often in here. I haven't rewatched too many of Rivaldo's games, but in those 90s Brazil ones & old clasicos he definitely defended, and wasn't shy to get physical. Can others chip in how they see him?
 
Always wondered about that image of his, as I read it quite often in here. I haven't rewatched too many of Rivaldo's games, but in those 90s Brazil ones & old clasicos he definitely defended, and wasn't shy to get physical. Can others chip in how they see him?
From what I’ve seen of him he definitely switched off in some games and didn’t put in too much effort especially when the ball passed him.

All the best @Enigma_87.

As much as I respect your defence and the thematics around it, I reckon the quality is fairly similar. Yashin edges Zoff, Nilton edges Breitner - particularly defensively, Passarella beats Godin, Scirea takes Chumpitaz, and Bergomi edges Gerets defensively. If anything we might edge it comparing the back 5s. Throw in Varela/Desailly and it’s similar quality again.

Two main differences though:
  1. The defensive half of our team has a lot more quality on the ball. Each of the 4 at the back excelled in playing in more ball-dominating set-ups. And we clearly have an advantage in transitioning the ball into midfield through Redondo in particular, in comparison to the more basic passing ability of Tardelli and Desailly
  2. Most importantly what matters most is what they’re up against. Robben’s extreme pace and surging dribbling ability against Breitner is a big concern. And Pele is clearly going to cause major problems. Notwithstanding the defensive acumen of Godin and Scirea, there isn’t much pace and agility there: qualities that Pele maxed like few before or since. Both were always paired with a more athletic stopper which maxed out the partnerships they held with the likes of Giminez, Miranda, Collovati etc.
I reckon ultimately the advantages we have in build-up and approach will provide plenty of service to Robben and Pele in particular, but Dzajic and Rivaldo too, and they will find ways through.
I guess it depends how you compare them, but Scirea shades Passarella and also Godin’s longevity and playing at the highest level IMO edges Chumpitaz, as he was the pillar of both Uruguay and Atletico and both individually and on national team he bettered him.

Bergomi is the better defender out of the two and compliments better Scirea in comparison to Gerets who is also more adventurous full back to Chumpitaz and Passarella.

As for Nilton and Breitner it’s hard to compare probably Nilton shades or due to the defence but Breitner credentials as left back are top notch and he’s definitely the better attacking full back out of the two.

in comparison Passarella also had a more rugged and defensive stopper next to him as Chumpitaz and also Nilton had the more defensive Djalma on the right flank to balance it out.

Currently in your side you have two attacking minded full backs and two attacking minded center backs which imo makes it a bit off in balance.

Also on Varela I just can’t rate him at the same level as Desailly who is part of one of the most influential and successful national and club sides playing against the very elite opponents.

I do rate Redondo ability on the ball but again Varela makes it a bit off as I’d prefer a more box to box next to him.

in our side Scirea was also deceptively fast and both him and Godin read the game really really well to cut the chances before the ball gets to Pele or Rivaldo.
 
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Always wondered about that image of his, as I read it quite often in here. I haven't rewatched too many of Rivaldo's games, but in those 90s Brazil ones & old clasicos he definitely defended, and wasn't shy to get physical. Can others chip in how they see him?
Likewise. Biggest risk in building an attacking South American side is ending up too top-heavy. The choice of Rivaldo and Robben was, as much as they’ve obviously got bucketloads of technical quality, it was about their solid work rate off the ball. I remember Las Palmas’ Vinnie Samways talk about how Rivaldo was unlike many stereotypical fancy-dan no10s as he had a wiry strength and was a really difficult opponent in a cluttered midfield battle. Where I’d agree with Enigma is latter in his career, post 2001 or so into his 30s, he didn’t have the same off-the-ball hunger as earlier in his career. Robben obviously a key part of Heynckes all-conquering 4231 Bayern machine.
 
@Enigma_87 I reckon you’re mischaracterising Passarella somewhat. He didn’t need a stopper next to him because he had all the classic stopper qualities himself. Power, aggression, dynamism, extreme aerial ability. He’s an outlier because his ability on the ball was so unlike any stopper we’ve seen.

In terms of the fit across the defence, there’s a healthy balance there. Nilton Santos can push forward - as we saw in the 1958 World Cup - but equally boasted a great physique and was in the 1954 World Cup team of the tournament as the left-sided centre-half in a back 3. Gerets has shown the same versatility between tucking in as part of an 3 and pushing forward. There’s a flexibility where any of the back 4 could overload into midfield and that flexibility makes us difficult to play against as it keeps the opposition guessing. France had a similar tactical advantage in 1998 when Blanc, Desailly and the full-backs would take turns to step forward.
 
@Enigma_87 I reckon you’re mischaracterising Passarella somewhat. He didn’t need a stopper next to him because he had all the classic stopper qualities himself. Power, aggression, dynamism, extreme aerial ability. He’s an outlier because his ability on the ball was so unlike any stopper we’ve seen.

In terms of the fit across the defence, there’s a healthy balance there. Nilton Santos can push forward - as we saw in the 1958 World Cup - but equally boasted a great physique and was in the 1954 World Cup team of the tournament as the left-sided centre-half in a back 3. Gerets has shown the same versatility between tucking in as part of an 3 and pushing forward. There’s a flexibility where any of the back 4 could overload into midfield and that flexibility makes us difficult to play against as it keeps the opposition guessing. France had a similar tactical advantage in 1998 when Blanc, Desailly and the full-backs would take turns to step forward.
Yeah I’m not doubting their physical traits and ability to make it work. No doubt all are excellent players. My point is their natural inclination to influence the play. This is why they also made a name for themself - both Passarella and Chumpitaz surged forward and both were threat going forward and out outnumbering the midfield. Same as Breitner at the other end. The setup allows him to play his natural game and why he was so unique as a full back. Obviously he will be minding Robben and he will have some help from either Desailly/Tardelli when needed but his ball carrying capabilities and joining the midfield is also appreciated.

We of course see it differently as I think you are a bit top heavy in your approach and one of Chumpitaz / Passarella will play with a handbreak on. :)

As for Rivaldo I get it from the write up you are mimicking the Rivaldo / Fenomeno setup where he was a bit older and different to say Depor Rivaldo? He always had a bit of maverick in him and we know the bust up with Van Gaal when he benched him when he wanted to play behind the striker, so whilst he was a bit different player in his depor days I was never that convinced in him busting a gut when he was at his peak 98 and on.
 
Yeah I’m not doubting their physical traits and ability to make it work. No doubt all are excellent players. My point is their natural inclination to influence the play. This is why they also made a name for themself - both Passarella and Chumpitaz surged forward and both were threat going forward and out outnumbering the midfield. Same as Breitner at the other end. The setup allows him to play his natural game and why he was so unique as a full back. Obviously he will be minding Robben and he will have some help from either Desailly/Tardelli when needed but his ball carrying capabilities and joining the midfield is also appreciated.

We of course see it differently as I think you are a bit top heavy in your approach and one of Chumpitaz / Passarella will play with a handbreak on. :)

As for Rivaldo I get it from the write up you are mimicking the Rivaldo / Fenomeno setup where he was a bit older and different to say Depor Rivaldo? He always had a bit of maverick in him and we know the bust up with Van Gaal when he benched him when he wanted to play behind the striker, so whilst he was a bit different player in his depor days I was never that convinced in him busting a gut when he was at his peak 98 and on.
We are not operating with an olden-days tactic where the spare libero was the man assigned with doing all the creative work from deep, while two stoppers kept it simple. The defence is more balanced and reflects a typical modern-day zonal set-up where each of the defenders share the man-marking and on-the-ball duties. The advantage of this is clear - makes us much harder to press and keeps the oppo guessing. Any modern back four will see the central defenders play proactively, pass players on and use the ball quickly and effectively.

Here is a compilation of Chumpitaz against Colombia.



It's mostly first-time football, releasing midfielders quickly with his excellent technique, or spraying Van-Dijk-esque diagonals such as at 1.17, 1.45, 1.52 and 3.00. Most interesting here is he actually has the opportunity and space to move into midfield, but typically chooses to open the play up quickly with a longer pass. This trait is very much part of modern football where we know the ball moves faster than the man and that this is one of the best ways to stretch out an organised defence.
 
We are not operating with an olden-days tactic where the spare libero was the man assigned with doing all the creative work from deep, while two stoppers kept it simple. The defence is more balanced and reflects a typical modern-day zonal set-up where each of the defenders share the man-marking and on-the-ball duties. The advantage of this is clear - makes us much harder to press and keeps the oppo guessing. Any modern back four will see the central defenders play proactively, pass players on and use the ball quickly and effectively.

Here is a compilation of Chumpitaz against Colombia.



It's mostly first-time football, releasing midfielders quickly with his excellent technique, or spraying Van-Dijk-esque diagonals such as at 1.17, 1.45, 1.52 and 3.00. Most interesting here is he actually has the opportunity and space to move into midfield, but typically chooses to open the play up quickly with a longer pass. This trait is very much part of modern football where we know the ball moves faster than the man and that this is one of the best ways to stretch out an organised defence.

Thanks for the video but it’s really tough to see his movement in that because it cuts after his touch.
What I saw in that game as well is that in the beginning 0:17 I think he was quite up the pitch to spray it on the wing. 2:30 he tried to move forward with a one two and got dispossessed resulting in a corner.

you can also see him moving forward when he makes the pass and generally from the video there is a good 2 men behind him when he attacks the long ball inside his own half.

a longer highlights video of that game would probably paint a better picture.
 
Didn't think Gio could be beaten in this draft but Enigma's team certainly has the better chemistry while matching up to star power.
 
Good and tight game @Gio !
Commiserations ! Excellent team as usual with me nitpicking by here and there.. liked especially the use of Rivaldo - first time I think used as a center piece
 
Good and tight game @Gio !
Commiserations ! Excellent team as usual with me nitpicking by here and there.. liked especially the use of Rivaldo - first time I think used as a center piece
We matched up pretty well in the end but I wasn't surprised to lose out to your juggernaut - you covered the injury risk well with Gullit, Desailly and Breitner's versatility. To be honest I didn't expect to even be competitive after a comedy start in the draft.
 
loved the use of rivaldo @Gio , pretty much the best possible qualities around him
 
We matched up pretty well in the end but I wasn't surprised to lose out to your juggernaut - you covered the injury risk well with Gullit, Desailly and Breitner's versatility. To be honest I didn't expect to even be competitive after a comedy start in the draft.
Yeah, I wanted to cover all positions and I think even managed it after the first reinforcement round as with sheep free squad I had pretty versatile players in Bergomi and Briegel also that can play anywhere.

You caught up brilliantly, which of course isn't surprising and manager to put a team that had no weaknesses in personnel or visible weak points.