Enough with players from the farmer's league. A shitty league, were tactics and defensive duties are non existent.
Italy is the place where we need to look for midfielders.
Italy is the place where we need to look for midfielders.
The type of players we’re badly missing….
- Thread starter Rajma
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Haha good luck with that bro ;-)
Leaders.
Besides Cristiano, McTominay and Bruno all the other players don't seem to have leadership skills. That healthy agressiveness, to inspire the squad.
It's been repeated over and over but all the winning teams had at least 4-5 players with that type of character. We are soft as feck.
Besides Cristiano, McTominay and Bruno all the other players don't seem to have leadership skills. That healthy agressiveness, to inspire the squad.
It's been repeated over and over but all the winning teams had at least 4-5 players with that type of character. We are soft as feck.
A defensive midfielder who can make basic passes and stop attacks, and a deep lying playmaker who can dictate the game. Bruno, Pogba and Van de Beek are all fine for a more advanced playmaker, Mct and Fred works fine as box to box midfielders in games where you can't afford to play a more advanced midfielder and need a higher workrate. However the archetype player every team needs are players we do not have.
We have plenty of specialists for that single midfield slot that tend to change on a game by game basis, but we lack the midfield spine that enable us to control games and keep tight. It has been an issue for years, but despite numerous signings we are no closer to fixing the issue. We would also do well to have backup to this spine should we face injuries.
Out: Pogba, Van de Beek, Matic, Mata, Pereira, etc
In: Neves type, recall garner, Ndidi type, and backup ndidi type.
Leaves us with a nice stable midfield:
The 10:
Workrate:
IMO we need three new midfielders before we have a functional midfield combination.
I don't think our defence is as terrible as it is made out to be, and our front three has tons of potential and ability. However, midfield is just a gaping hole at this point.
We have plenty of specialists for that single midfield slot that tend to change on a game by game basis, but we lack the midfield spine that enable us to control games and keep tight. It has been an issue for years, but despite numerous signings we are no closer to fixing the issue. We would also do well to have backup to this spine should we face injuries.
Out: Pogba, Van de Beek, Matic, Mata, Pereira, etc
In: Neves type, recall garner, Ndidi type, and backup ndidi type.
Leaves us with a nice stable midfield:
The 10:
Bruno/Mejbri
Neves type/Garner Ndidi type/backup
Neves type/Garner Ndidi type/backup
Workrate:
Neves type/Garner Fred/McT
Ndidi type/backup
Ndidi type/backup
IMO we need three new midfielders before we have a functional midfield combination.
I don't think our defence is as terrible as it is made out to be, and our front three has tons of potential and ability. However, midfield is just a gaping hole at this point.
Carricks ability to dictate a game is what allowed those things to be done. If we had Carrick play alongside any of mcfred we would look miles better than we do now.
If we could get one player to dictate things in our midfield this window, we could still manage to get that 4th position. We could kick on from this in summer.
Only thing is, I don't expect us to bring in anyone this window and this club will keep pulling the wool over our eyes as they do every year.
New top manager coming in the summer.
Loads of money to spend.
Top midfielders on way.
CF and new RB and CB will arrive
Just sick listening to all the shit coming out every transfer window.
Only thing is, I don't expect us to bring in anyone this window and this club will keep pulling the wool over our eyes as they do every year.
New top manager coming in the summer.
Loads of money to spend.
Top midfielders on way.
CF and new RB and CB will arrive
Just sick listening to all the shit coming out every transfer window.
A Luka Modric, Verrati, Scholes etc is what we need.
Proper weird attitude.
The problem isn't that our players can't move with the ball in midfield, the problem is that the shape and movement of our players makes it almost impossible for them to do it. Watch us play and you will see that opposition players just have far more time and space on the ball than we do. They know where their next pass is going to be and where teammates will be so that they have an option. When we get the ball our player is immediately under pressure, is trying to protect the ball and figure out where his teammates are. This has been a fundamental flaw for years now. Where Liverpool and City players are deciding which of the 3 options they will pick or whether they should dribble to make more space, our players are looking around trying to work out who is available and where the passes are.
Where other teams players sprint to make a few metres of space for pass, ours just trot around with a defender right on their back the whole time.
Our players aren't as technically deficient and poor as some like to think. They are just working in a structureless system that makes their lives 10x harder. At the top level of sport, 2-3% differences are massive and our players are facing highly disciplined opposition with a high work rate. You watch any good team and the movement of the players and ball is effortless and smooth. There is no stuttering, players don't walk forward slowly with the ball for 3-4 seconds all the time wondering what on earth to do with it.
Most of our issues are coaching issues that will take a while to sort out. Lets be honest, I'm not sure that some of our players are even bothered enough to try and sort it out.
Where other teams players sprint to make a few metres of space for pass, ours just trot around with a defender right on their back the whole time.
Our players aren't as technically deficient and poor as some like to think. They are just working in a structureless system that makes their lives 10x harder. At the top level of sport, 2-3% differences are massive and our players are facing highly disciplined opposition with a high work rate. You watch any good team and the movement of the players and ball is effortless and smooth. There is no stuttering, players don't walk forward slowly with the ball for 3-4 seconds all the time wondering what on earth to do with it.
Most of our issues are coaching issues that will take a while to sort out. Lets be honest, I'm not sure that some of our players are even bothered enough to try and sort it out.
A Modric-type in the midfield two to see options ahead, alongside a destroyer in the Vieira / Keane / Essien template, combined with a Bruce / Vidic CB who's more than ready to get his nose broken if it means keeping a clean sheet. Imagine having:
----------------DDG--------------
RB---Varane---Vidic---LB
---------Modric-Vieira--------
Sancho-Bruno-Rashford
-------------Ronaldo------------
----------------DDG--------------
RB---Varane---Vidic---LB
---------Modric-Vieira--------
Sancho-Bruno-Rashford
-------------Ronaldo------------
I thought so for a while as well, the thing that makes me skeptical is that we had 5 managers by now and the team still has no structure, even under van Gaal, who is pretty famous for the structure of his teams and how well drilled they are, didn't manage to get that into our team and instead they would revert to zombie passing.
In my view the real Problem is our recruitment policy. We have too many attacking players who want to get straight towards goal, if we like up with Rashford, Bruno, Ronaldo and Greenwood we essentially play 4 players with a strikers mindest who don't have the instinct to come deep and offer passing options. Now compare that to City, they don't even play a striker anymore, everyone is getting somewhat involved in midfield and has the natural instinct to do so.
On top of that we have recruited loads of players who can't carry the ball from deeper position. Tifo had this lately in one of their podcasts that Maguire had the most progressive carries from our team this year and I don't think last season looked too different.
So what do we need then? Attacking players who want to get involved in the build up, bar 1 or 2 players everyone of our players needs to be able and willing to get involved in build up play. On top of that we need midfielders who don't buckle under pressure and can dribble past a pressing trap or pick a pass in very tight spaces.
Another thing we need to work on is the overhyping of our players, it seems like barely a player at our club will have more than a good season before they think they are the hottest thing since Messi and Ronaldo.
If you ask me we need to go with a new approach to recruiting players as well. We seem to buy names and social media fame rather than fitting pieces to a puzzle that will result in a comprehensive and well balanced team. Maybe our scouting is also stuck in the early 2000s and haven't caught up to modern, data driven way of finding the fitting players?
We mock what we don't understand.
Fact! And you can see the difference between City and us!
This is very true. It is this way because the previous manager played direct with emphasis on getting the ball to runners in the final third. We don't even have any playmaking or support forward. Because of how much time and money we sink into these managers when we finally find out they aren't good enough they've already remodeled the squad dramatically. We should look into squad building consistency that can survive even several managers but for that to happen we need directors who aren't worse at their jobs than failing managers.
A lot of our players are not comfortable being pressed. The only two players I trust are Shaw and Greenwood to get pressed and come out of it with the ball. I would have said Matic a couple years ago as well, but not any more. I expect everybody else to make a mistake. Either by panicking and playing a poor pass that gets intercepted or they straight up get dispossessed. Our midfield gets blamed a lot, but we have many players that don't do well when they're under pressure.
Off the ball movement from a lot of our players leaves a lot to be desired, too. We look like such a static team. It gives our players being pressed little to no options. They're already uncomfortable and having little to no passing options makes the problem even worse.
Off the ball movement from a lot of our players leaves a lot to be desired, too. We look like such a static team. It gives our players being pressed little to no options. They're already uncomfortable and having little to no passing options makes the problem even worse.
Players with skill and determination/winning mentality, that will give you 110% every game.
Why would any self respecting human want to understand the ridiculous glory hunting mentality that led to you make this comment:
“I stopped watching this team at the end of 2021 and will spend my time doing other things. I'll check back in Summer, and watch next season until it's apparent they suck again, when I'll stop. Probably around October.”
You may as well have added “I’m going to watch City instead” on the end of it. Absolutely pathetic.
Character. Severely lacking character in this side.
Before we dip our toes in the transfer market we must first decide what type of philosophy we're going to adopt. Are we going to be a cynical, defensive team with a deep line defence who rely on quick counter football and moments of brilliance? Are we going to go for gegenpressing were players need to have good stamina and be able to pass the ball quickly? Once we decide that philosophy then we have to stick to it irrespective whether the manager is successful or not. Managers can change but the club's philosophy shouldn't change.
Once that decision is taken then we can build the team around that philosophy. That means bringing people both on and off the pitch.
Once that decision is taken then we can build the team around that philosophy. That means bringing people both on and off the pitch.
Is that you, Brendan?
And then there is you, a person who tolerates mediocrity because you think there is honor in doing so, while judging others who don't. What makes us different is that I gravitate towards enjoyment without tether, while you sit cross-legged in the mire on the pretense that the suffering you endure is the only manner in which success can truly be celebrated. Someday you'll wake up and realize you're running out of time to be happy.
We need a 6.Matic is the only one we have,trying to shoe horn McFred in there these past few seasons has really cost us,they're both forward thinking/passing players not defensive minded at all.
GET A # 6 ALREADY
GET A # 6 ALREADY
There are two midfielders in the Premier League we should he going after, Rice and McGinn.
People keep mentioning leadership and character.
We need players with ability and technique.
We need new fullbacks (on both wings). We need 2 CMs a CF and a CB to replace Maguire.
And I hope all those players have ability and technique. I don't want McGinn for example, just because he shows character and shouts at the ref. But a silent, quiet Modric will run rings around him every minute for 90 mins.
We're the only club that wants to sign players based on character. They have to be bloody good enough first. Our problem is our players aren't good enough to challenge. It's simple. It's not cos they lack character.
We need players with ability and technique.
We need new fullbacks (on both wings). We need 2 CMs a CF and a CB to replace Maguire.
And I hope all those players have ability and technique. I don't want McGinn for example, just because he shows character and shouts at the ref. But a silent, quiet Modric will run rings around him every minute for 90 mins.
We're the only club that wants to sign players based on character. They have to be bloody good enough first. Our problem is our players aren't good enough to challenge. It's simple. It's not cos they lack character.
Maybe good at taking a pass but when he has retained the ball he gives it away constantly
McGinn, yes, the type of player we are missing. Would be a great partner for McT and the team.
Rice not so sure. McT is just as good.
McGinn is bang average.
People in this thread want a midfield of Mctominay and McGinn.
Feck me we've gone from Manchester United to Scotland when Gilmour is injured.
Imagine us in the UCL going up against Modric, Casemiro and Kroos with Mctominay and McGinn.
People in this thread want a midfield of Mctominay and McGinn.
Feck me we've gone from Manchester United to Scotland when Gilmour is injured.
Imagine us in the UCL going up against Modric, Casemiro and Kroos with Mctominay and McGinn.
Harder working and more aggressive pressing forwards. Then all we need is legs in the middle to keep recycling the ball and we can press with the best teams. this is why we keep getting no value in the market. We are buying players without aggression whose heads drop too easily when their skills don’t come off. Fred McT Bruno and Elanga saved our bacon there tonight. Why? Because they were all direct and worked damn hard.
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Looks like another rawk infiltration
Many things have been said that I would agree to. Most importantly for me certainly is a more hardworking mindset across the team but apart from that, I think, we could do with a reliable dribbler. Somebody with some sort of an x-factor, able to ask questions of defenders, making them feel the need to double up, shaking up defensive organisations. Somebody like Mahrez for City or Vinicius for Real. Or Nani back then for us. Most important reason why I thought, City and United got the wrong midfielder - Grealish would have been great for us, while Donny probably would have flourished in sky blue.
not one of them players at the other mid table clubs would play good if they were at united on £200k a week.
Players who can switch the play. Look at Liverpool with Matip, VVD, Fabinho, TAA, Robertson, Henderson, all players who constantly look to change the direction of attack. It is so important to be able to do that in any system, but even more so for the type of football RR wants us to play.
Barella would be nice. Verratti of few years back.
Ronaldo is not a leader. He’s a petulant child.
His dedication to his career, work ethic and training regime is a true beacon and sets a high bar.
But he’s toxic on the pitch most of the time. Every now and again he gets his shit together, but that sulky teenager shit doesn’t help anyone.
McGinn is bang average.
People in this thread want a midfield of Mctominay and McGinn.
Feck me we've gone from Manchester United to Scotland when Gilmour is injured.
Imagine us in the UCL going up against Modric, Casemiro and Kroos with Mctominay and McGinn.
City Have set a high bar. They have (at least) two players for every position. They are never not at full strength. Bringing in McGinn to provide competition for McTominay would be great. They’re both good footballers that should be able to play 25-30 matches each, entering every one of those games at peak fitness. That’s where City have taken things. Every player that starts must be 100%.
McGinn is bang average.
People in this thread want a midfield of Mctominay and McGinn.
Feck me we've gone from Manchester United to Scotland when Gilmour is injured.
Imagine us in the UCL going up against Modric, Casemiro and Kroos with Mctominay and McGinn.
To be honest I think this is part of our problem. The club keeps going for big names from foreign leagues, and once they start playing in a more physical and faster league they get found out. Personally I think we need to start buying some players from the Premier League again, who know the pace of the league. Under Fergie we always had a workman like midfield and even with the likes of Park, Fletcher and Cleverly we won leagues. I’m not suggesting McGinn is the answer to our problems but we should be looking at Premier League options as well.
Team players
Your problem is that you are making happiness the basic purpose of supporting a football team. That is fundamentally divorced from reality. In fact, there are few activities you could choose that has less upside and a more predictable and inescapable downside in that regard. The base state of football supporters, even of good clubs, is disappointment - a state that is generally only suspended briefly and intermittently. If you go on Blue Moon you're not going to see thread after thread of joyous celebrations either, though they have more to be happy about than supporters of nearly all clubs get in a lifetime. So in short, if your priority is being happy, that's fine. It's wise, even. But suffering isn't a choice, it is an unavoidable consequence of caring deeply about a team. The only way to escape it is by not caring deeply about a team. And if you don't care deeply about your team, you're not a supporter.
We can get that workman like midfield. But I'll be honest with you without Fergie as manager that would be a mid table midfield in todays EPL. There's only so much running, passion and character can do in the modern game. If you don't have the ability forget about it. You can have all the character in the world but if you don't have the ability you're going to play against City/Liverpool and chase after shadows for 90 mins. With a McGinn and Mctominay midfield that's what we'd be doing. Chasing shadows the whole game.