Valencia certainly wasn't very good yesterday.
Luis Nani | 2012/13 Performances
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Valencia certainly wasn't very good yesterday.
He said he was terrible in the first half though, which is madness. Valencia was very very good in the first 45 mins, I said it yesterday and I was further convinced by watching the game for the second time. It's the second half that blinds people.
valencia was good in the first half, pretty toss in the 2nd though. Absolute sitter from the RVP cross that he missed.
Because he nutmegged Santos a couple of times? Santos is a woeful defender and we failed to capitalize on it, fair enough he set off Rafael which led to the goal but he wasted far too many chances to do something useful against a bad defender.
Watched the game again last night, nobody was awful in the first half for us. Especially not Valencia. We were 1-0 up at a canter. He was still beating people and busting a gut 2nd half, he just couldn't use the ball. Same with Carrick.
Just to check the situation, does anyone else bar myself believe it's a certainty that Nani won't be with us next season? Apologies if I make myself sound like a twat by that - but you don't need a magnifying glass to see that Nani is in that bit of Fergie's hypothetical books where not many return from.
Valencia was good at making ground, he had the beating of a very poor defender all afternoon. His end product was very poor though: he made 0 successful crosses and missed an absolute sitter, he failed to track back on a few occasions too. It was refreshing to see Nani come on and actually put a good cross into the box.
I know what I've seen, he was very good, almost vintage Valencia. Great link up play, terrific workrate, control and trickery. Equally poor in the second half.
Valencia had an average game and his delivery was off. I as well was happy to see Nani on and within 5-10mins he delivered a dangerous cross which had been missing from Valencia all game.
Valencia wasn't bad he just wasn't great.
Valencia wasn't bad he just wasn't great.
If that was vintage valencia in the first half then I wonder what Tomus will be like when Valencia actually hits some good form.
it clearly wasn't vintage Valencia. but then again he wasn't anywhere near as poor as some seem to be trying to make out.
He did a lot of good things yesterday, tainted somewhat by him not producing the quality of final ball we have come to expect from him.
He didn't track Santos back on a couple of occasions, which is unusual for him, but tellingly not that unusual for the vast majority of wingers. I say it's more a testament to how much he usually provides, that he is being criticised at all for only one below average performance.
He was woeful because his crossing was woeful or non existent, everytime we were counter attacking and he got the ball he ended up choosing not to cross and holding the ball up, and then our chance was gone - or he did cross and the cross was dreadful. You could also see him not tracking back on occasions. Everything that Nani gets absolutely hammered on by everyone, Tony V was doing in abundance yesterday.
Tony wasn't woeful yesterday, far from it. My bet is you're watching the game hoping the wingers fail so you can validate the 'Nani should start' campaign.
I get that feeling aswel, at the moment Nani dosnt deserve a starting place, but its a long season and he will get a chance to regain his place
If it wasn't for the bloody contract hoo-ha, there wouldn't be such anxiety about Nani's form. He's had periods of poor form before and always come out of them within a month or so as the world-beater which he's capable of being. Patience is what's needed with him. It certainly helps to have Valencia available, who can do a job even when he's not on best form either, and a load of very in-form central midfielders who are making it a real possibility that we don't use out and out wingers anyway. But the contract situation doesn't.
Or he's saying it like it is, instead of jumping on the Valencia hype train where he is consistently good. He's been poor this season, nowhere near as effective as he was last year and I don't see why people like yourself can't admit it. Nani has also been poor, and I don't see where people are trying to say otherwise but it's completely double standards with Valencia on here.
Not quite sure how people can say Nani shouldn't start when you look at the fact that Ashley Young is starting matches in his place...
He is literally just back from injury give him a chance! the lad is quality. great crosser, great workrate and has a good football brain. id have in team every day of the week ahead of nani
Said exactly the same last season when he was fully fit. He's a decent crosser, but no better than Nani can be. For all his supposed work-rate he never wins the ball back or actually does anything useful when he is defending. No idea how his "football brain" is any better than Nani's?! He's an ok squad player, never anything more even when on form - whereas an in form Nani can win you a game.
What has Ashley Young done wrong? Nothing, I'd say his performances have been better than Nani's and this is backed up by the fact that SAF picks him above Nani on most occasions.
an ''in form'' nani is a rare thing.
Just want to make a point that despite what I said before I don't dislike Nani (I said it to wind-up the Nani fanboys) I'd love him to be the next Ronaldo...he's just not delivering the goods.
The stats disagree. He's the most productive winger at the club over the last few seasons....
Yeah, not bad for someone who is not producing the goods. Obviously the off pitch troubles are affecting his form this year, and are probably the reason he isn't playing so much. When he has played, even though he has been poor he's still provided goals and assists. Last weeks goal against Chelsea was the best we've scored this season.
stats are like mini-skirts they give you good ideas but hide the most important thing. At the moment in my opinion Nani should not be starting and Sir Alex seems to agree with me!
Even an off form Nani provides so much more going forward than Young - there is genuinely next to no advantage to be gained in playing Young over him in the vast majority of games. I can perhaps understand the use in a more defensive minded player on the left if we're up against a top team with quality on the wings given Evra's propensity to attack but, as a serious question, how many top quality right wingers are even out there at the moment? We certainly didn't need a player like that against Aaron Ramsey and Sagna.
Another thing, look at that game in the Champions League against Galatasary - some on here were moaning about his performance, but he forged genuinely about 5 clear goal scoring opportunities with some fantastic vision/play. This whole situation is so annoying - if ever there was a player destined to elsewhere and be amazing, it's him. The reality is that Nani is never going to be consistent if he doesn't get played...consistently. Players like Nani need to know that they can express themselves without the fear of being dropped, otherwise the spontaneity and confidence goes out the window. If there are other reasons (contract issues, Nani being an idiot behind the scenes, etc) then fair enough, but I refuse to believe that Young is actually a better player for our team than Nani. The difference in ability, creativity and composure on the ball is actually vast.
Another thing, look at that game in the Champions League against Galatasary - some on here were moaning about his performance, but he forged genuinely about 5 clear goal scoring opportunities with some fantastic vision/play. This whole situation is so annoying - if ever there was a player destined to elsewhere and be amazing, it's him. The reality is that Nani is never going to be consistent if he doesn't get played...consistently. Players like Nani need to know that they can express themselves without the fear of being dropped, otherwise the spontaneity and confidence goes out the window. If there are other reasons (contract issues, Nani being an idiot behind the scenes, etc) then fair enough, but I refuse to believe that Young is actually a better player for our team than Nani. The difference in ability, creativity and composure on the ball is actually vast.
Assists and goals are not the most important thing? No, they're pretty much why a winger is on the pitch, to either score or create.
I like the mini skirt analogy though!
he was woeful! you obviously haven't seen what Valencia can do when he plays well!
Whys that? I've watched him live most games...whats so obvious I have missed?
I would have thought this one was obvious? There's very few people in our team with a football brain worse than Nani's, which is frustrating considering there's very few with natural talent like Nani has. He just does the wrong thing far too often, and that will cost us against good teams.
As opposed to Young and Valencia who try to do the correct thing almost all of the time. Which is why they is starting while Nani is not, even though neither Young nor Valencia are on great form.
I would have thought that much was fairly straight forward.
Lately he's been feckin' up too many easy passes for my liking. He's good on the wings, but I want him no where near the centre.
Just keep it simple nanner's beat your more and cross like you once did.
Just keep it simple nanner's beat your more and cross like you once did.
You're obviously confusing terms here. Valencia and Young are more percentage players so really they're taking less risks. Nani's football brain is actually pretty good but he does make some odd basic mistakes when he's not on form. You don't have the productivity he has had and have a poor football brain. It simply doesn't add up. As someone mentioned before, he benefits from a run of games.
It is obvious, to most.
I agree Nani's got mesmerising talent and a poor football brain. There's few players of his talent I'd bet higher on to choose the wrong option in a 3-on-2 situation (though Tony's been giving him a run for his money of late).
But I don't think that explains his current status. It has to be contract issues.
Pretty sure he's a goner in the summer.
But I don't think that explains his current status. It has to be contract issues.
Pretty sure he's a goner in the summer.
Agree with him leaving, but in a 3 on 2 type situation, or a 1 on 1, there aren't many others at this club that I would rather have on the ball. Probably Van Persie being the only one for a one on one, Nani is great at those most of the time. Its when he has too much time on the ball he tends to dribble it too much and feck up an easy pass, or try something too fancy, or with his crossing.
I'm not sure Nani's got a consistently poor footballing brain. it's just that it's not consistently good either. He's been involved in many of our best counter-attacks whilst he's been at the club. Look at some of the ones he and Rooney have pulled off against Arsenal. You can see him waiting for the perfect moment and delivering the right pass to the right player. A lightning counter-attack is one of the most difficult tests of a player's decision-making.
I think the problem is that his decision-making so easily goes out the window if he's flustered or not playing well. He starts to try too hard, and gets it all wrong.
I think the problem is that his decision-making so easily goes out the window if he's flustered or not playing well. He starts to try too hard, and gets it all wrong.
Nani, and Valencia, to a lesser extent, play within themselves, sadly. Both have tremendous pace but all-too often they practically stop - when faced by an opponent - and seem to ponder on what to do next. Both have little need of trickery, their sheer speed is enough to get past their man & cross/shoot/whatever...yet still they pause for thought when little thought is necessary. Frustrating, as both could be more effective than they are.
I'm not sure if I'm confusing terms, I think it's more likely that we're seeing the same thing but interpreting it differently.
I'd wager that what you're describing as "odd basic mistakes" I'd call evidence of a lack of a footballing brain. I think his mistakes are more down to poor decision making than just making a mistake. Poor decision making on a continuous basis is, to me, a lack of a footballing brain.
I don't disagree with any of your post, we just interpret things differently.
Well they are literally 1 and 2 in the league so I think they are doing ok.
I also believe this to be the case.
Some of Nani's through balls and finishes are superb, I don't think a player with a bad footballing brain is capable of stuff like that.
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