He was never that good to begin with, he's not an unknown quantity, his quality is well known, 10 years 2 Norwegian trophy.
How can Ole be this bad?
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Ole's reign with us has coincided with multiple injuries to our challengers, saying that the league is more competitive is bollocks. There's always the outstanding team which ends up and champions and us being healthy challenging for top 4 with injuries hit team. There's no doubt they'll finish higher than us this season if they don't get a repeat of multiple injuries to their starters.
And complaining about the dire showing in the Champions league during Jose's reign is a bit rich considering Ole's been pretty much doing the same in the fecking Europa league.
You could sign another RW, CB and CM and Ole will still feck it up. He's just not good enough and the excuses just need to stop.
This is a very sad but very accurate assessment
I should hope so seeing as Pep plays the exact same way against us at home every single time. We might win there again
Shocked that some of you are just now realizing that he is out of his depth. During his stint in Norway there was a few reasons for his success. His reputation, name and money. Due to his reputation and name in Norwegian football, he was able to swoop up the best talents we had. Combine that with buying the best players in the league and the only other team able to compete with Molde - Rosenborg - going through a huge transition, it meant that Solskjær had the perfect opportunity to win a few medals. He definitely wasn't this tactical genius that revolutionized Norwegian football. Far from it. When Rosenborg finally put together a decent team and got a decent coach, that's when Solskjær's flaws really came to light.
I don't necessarily think it's a good thing that we seem to only reserve our best performances for when the heat is really on the team, and our manager, after the latest of run of dismal results has sunk everybody's morale. I doubt anyone does. It's incredibly infuriating when we suddenly see the potential show up in a big game, and deliver a big result. The lack of consistency has been a huge issue ever since Sir Alex retired, and nobody since has really found a way to solve it.
If we beat Liverpool next week, and you get incredibly upset that fans might be celebrating, perhaps you could secure yourself a ticket so you can scream at them to shut the hell up and stop lowering the standards of our football club. I just hope the cameras are pointed towards your section of the stand when it happens.
It is not that he is bad, he just lacks personality. It is hugely important for managers of high profile players to have plenty of personality, charisma, authority, presence. The players must be able to look at the manager and think 'our boss is top class and is always 2 steps ahead of us in every aspect of the game', they should be thinking if I don't perform it makes ME look bad, not the manager. The boss should be able to motivate the players more than the opposition boss can motivate their players and I never think that is the case with any opposing team. Ole has lost it and it is painful to see the board waste time before making the inevitable change.
Well, my point was much more general and not Ole specific so it wasn't supposed to serve as a defence for the manager. The original poster makes it sound as if intelligence is optional for a top manager and perhaps that anyone could do it.
I'm not sure about your reading anyway, I didn't find anything remarkable about starting Harry Maguire, especially once Varane was injured. Lindelof + other (who also hasn't played and can't be match ready) doesn't look any better. If Bailly or whoever played and was disastrous with Maguire on the bench you would be saying the exact opposite and this isn't even a far fetched scenario given the opposition and the way the team performed.
He brought on McTominay for VdB, again I don't find anything special in that. Van de Beek isn't trusted, that is known. Are we going to be shocked and appalled every time he doesn't get on the pitch?
I think these are two examples of what I'm talking about, fairly ordinary decisions given far too much significance and then fans come in with their hindsight and play the experts. But actually the problem is the whole team played rubbish, we had no organisation in any aspect. Individual decisions pale in comparison to the scale of the problem. Which gets back to what I was saying - management at this level is tough, you have to be responsible for that and to know how to solve it and win every game under intense pressure.
Yeah he is top notch tactically, and only lacks the necessary personality to implement his vision over to the players.
He was never good enough to begin with, but it's obvious that he's out of his depth, cause he hasn't improved a bit as a manager in his 3 years here.
For comparison, look at Philippe Clement at Club Brugge, how he has grown as a manager, and how he's brought Club Brugge to challenge bigger sides in just one year.
For comparison, look at Philippe Clement at Club Brugge, how he has grown as a manager, and how he's brought Club Brugge to challenge bigger sides in just one year.
Well ask yourself what would happen if we were let’s say dancers or singers and from one moment instead of competing against some C-tier artists that have much less financial support you start playing in the top flight with the greatest talents around. You’d struggle against the better guys. He was not prepared for this job, he’s shown nothing before joining the Premier League to suggest this league is his level, he did nothing to prove this while in PL and he’ll not find another Premier League job after the sack.
I don't necessarily think it's a good thing that we seem to only reserve our best performances for when the heat is really on the team, and our manager, after the latest of run of dismal results has sunk everybody's morale. I doubt anyone does. It's incredibly infuriating when we suddenly see the potential show up in a big game, and deliver a big result. The lack of consistency has been a huge issue ever since Sir Alex retired, and nobody since has really found a way to solve it.
If we beat Liverpool next week, and you get incredibly upset that fans might be celebrating, perhaps you could secure yourself a ticket so you can scream at them to shut the hell up and stop lowering the standards of our football club. I just hope the cameras are pointed towards your section of the stand when it happens.
Come on mate, you know this is drivel. I want us to beat Atalanta and Liverpool, so does everyone on here. Ideally we win every remaining game this season!
The issue was you phrasing it as beating Liverpool will make everything OK. There are clearly a lot of issues in the team and good performances this year have been the exception rather than the rule. Let’s hope that Liverpool will be one of those exceptions and we beat them.
The problem is Ole didn't earn the job. He was stop-gap to keep the fans onside because he was popular as a player, and playing under Fergie you could spin the narrative he learned from the best and knew the kind of football United fans want.
His level is managing relegation candidates and hoping to pull off a miracle like Cardiff. If was sacked him and he got another PL job it would be at a club like that again. He has been given a huge budget and all the resources in the world to prove he has what it takes. At the same point Klopp took Liverpool to the CL Final and then won the league the next season, I do not expect Ole to match Klopp from here, there are not even signs we're improving or on the verge of the next step.
His level is managing relegation candidates and hoping to pull off a miracle like Cardiff. If was sacked him and he got another PL job it would be at a club like that again. He has been given a huge budget and all the resources in the world to prove he has what it takes. At the same point Klopp took Liverpool to the CL Final and then won the league the next season, I do not expect Ole to match Klopp from here, there are not even signs we're improving or on the verge of the next step.
I'm just answering the question in the OP.
Q How can Ole be this bad?
A Because he is not very good
Q How can Ole be this bad?
A Because he is not very good
Is Ronaldo a problem in the dressing room? We have got much worse since he joined.
Maybe it's Varane. Maybe it's the fact that our manager doesn't know what he's doing.
If demanding to win, and not accepting the shite that we are serving up, then I would say that's a positive.
I actually think the signing of Ronaldo will lead to the dismissal of Ole.
This!
Are Portugal worse off with him in the team?
We ended last season terribly and the Europa League Final was one of the worst big games I've ever seen from a United team. There were problems way before Ronaldo, he just highlights how ineffective our attack is because he's feeding on scraps when he needs to be getting 5-6 chances a game.
Unbelievable
Because the people who hired him don't know how to judge how bad he is.
Being a talented coach and tactician at an elite level is a skill, Ole has done better than many (including me) thought he could, but he has very little of that natural skill at this level.
Think of it this way…
Imagine if a financially elite club needed a star striker and instead of signing a proven elite striker, they signed a striker from league 2 who was doing pretty well there - they gave him an elite contract, they paid him more than the other actual elite strikers were paid, they lengthened his contract when he was underperforming…
It wouldn’t turn him into an elite striker.
That’s what Utd have done with Ole.
It’s as though they’re so unbelievably, ridiculously stupid that they thought, ‘if we ACT like he’s an elite level coach, he’ll become one’.
He isn’t. He’s done well to at least still be around the top of the PL and if he stepped away now, it’d help his managerial career in the future as he wouldn’t be remembered for anything worse than what we’ve already seen.
No, we were awful against Southampton and Wolves. Before Ronaldo even pulled on the shirt. This has been a problem for 2 seasons. Leicester did the same to us last season, knocking us out of the FA cup.
Still can’t get my head around him resting players going into an international break and 2 weeks off
If he was fired he’d never work in the PL again and that shows his level.
If he was fired he’d never work in the PL again and that shows his level.
No its Sancho. Come on man, enough with the bloody excuses. Its Ole ffs.
Because he was never good enough. He came in after a horrible end to Joses reign, and everyone was happy. Hes a club legend, so the feel good was off the charts. We played well at the start, often taking advantage of our speedsters and hitting teams hard on the counter. Then the cracks started to show. The media started calling him a one trick pony, and for whatever reason he bite and started trying to make us play differently. After than night in Paris, we went on to win just two more game that season in all comps. We drew two, and we lost eight. In including a two nil defeat to relegated Cardiff.
The new season promised a change in form, with wins in all of our pre season games. And then a big four nil win over Chelsea in opening game of the season. It wouldnt be until the end of October that we would start to register concurrent wins again. In the end, from the time he was made permanent manger until the end of the October he registered just SIX wins in TWENTY FOUR games. One of those wins being Rochdale, and needed to go to pens.
Oles history isnt a good one. He started off in Molde with a lose to a newly promoted side. But he would go on to win their league for two seasons in a row. The problem here is that the Norwegian league is of such poor quality that current rules wouldnt allow Ole to have taken over at Utd had those rules been in place in 2018. Villa came calling in 2012 after sacking Mcleish. He refused, as he didnt want to disrupt his family who were now settled in Noway. In 2013, he starts the season badly with only seven points out of the first eleven games. He manages to finish the season in sixth place. His final act as manager that year would be to win the Norwegian cup final.
In 2014 he was announced as manager of Cardiff half way through the season. He only managed five wins in twenty one games, and ended the season dead last with only 30 points for the season. The following year in the Championship Ole was sacked after seven games. He had won just two games in the Championship. Back to Molde and he started of well with a win against Celtic in the Europa league, and even managed to finish first in the group that also included Ajax and Fenerbahce. In the Norwegian league, they would finish sixth. In his first full season back in charge he would go on to finish in fifth place after a season filled with the ups and downs most united fans have now witnessed. Including a run of six games in which he won just one, losing all five of the others. In 2017, a season that was once again mixed, he recorded just one win in seven, but then recorded just one lose in nine. Six of which were wins. This season would see them finish second, seven points behind the winners, Rosenborg. In 2018, it was much the same story. Varying runs of form saw just three wins in eight, but then five wins in a row. Once again, he would finish in second place. On Dec 3rd Molde announced that he had extended his contract until 2021...he left them to be caretaker of us a little over two weeks later.
As you can see, Ole has never been a top manager. Hes been a middle of road manager everywhere hes gone with ups and downs. Mostly downs outside of Molde, but with some big wins in the Europa league, including a one nil victory over eventual winners in 2016. Just a shame they lost the first leg three nil. When he took over at United, we were all of us, miserable. Jose had sucked all the joy out of the club. No matter what you think of him as a manger, he had made this place miserable. His sacking had to happen really, is for no other reason then the mental health of all in involved. Ole rode that feel good time hard and got a solid group of wins as caretaker. The problem is, thats all we saw of him. The guy at the top with all the misery packed away in Joses suitcase. So all we really knew about him, was that he could win when things were going well. The Glazers at first said they would consider his role at the end of the season. This would have been sensible. Because, like I said, we had only seen Ole in charge when everyone was happy. We hadnt seen Ole in charge when everyone was miserable. And that is a far more important skill set for a manager to have. Anyone can get a good performance when players are happy, but it takes a good manager to get a tune out of players who are miserable. And Ole showed us all, that he didnt have what it takes early on. The only problem was the Glazers gave him the job full time before we would see just how bad he was at getting players charged up when they werent winning games.
In his three years here, Ole has done fine. Not any better than who come before him. Lets look at the Champions league stats. After eleven champions league games, Ole actually has the most goals out of Jose, LVG and Moyes. But he also has the most goals against. 21 for, and 20 against. Recording just one clean sheet. Hes won five and lost seven. Jose won eight, drew two, lost four. Goals: Twenty for, nine against with seven clean sheets. LVG won two, drew two, lost two. Goals: Seven for, Seven against with two clean sheets. Moyes won five, drew three, lost two. Goals: seventeen for, nine against with five clean sheets. Despite Ole only being in charge for 4.8% of our matches in the CL, he accounts of 13% of total loses as of the 14th of September.
So we know that hes no better than Moyes, LVG or Jose. We know that he has a long history of ups and downs. And we know that watching us has been just as shit over the past year, maybe even longer, as it was under any of the other three. So I ask with all sincerity, how can anyone be surprised that he is this bad?
The new season promised a change in form, with wins in all of our pre season games. And then a big four nil win over Chelsea in opening game of the season. It wouldnt be until the end of October that we would start to register concurrent wins again. In the end, from the time he was made permanent manger until the end of the October he registered just SIX wins in TWENTY FOUR games. One of those wins being Rochdale, and needed to go to pens.
Oles history isnt a good one. He started off in Molde with a lose to a newly promoted side. But he would go on to win their league for two seasons in a row. The problem here is that the Norwegian league is of such poor quality that current rules wouldnt allow Ole to have taken over at Utd had those rules been in place in 2018. Villa came calling in 2012 after sacking Mcleish. He refused, as he didnt want to disrupt his family who were now settled in Noway. In 2013, he starts the season badly with only seven points out of the first eleven games. He manages to finish the season in sixth place. His final act as manager that year would be to win the Norwegian cup final.
In 2014 he was announced as manager of Cardiff half way through the season. He only managed five wins in twenty one games, and ended the season dead last with only 30 points for the season. The following year in the Championship Ole was sacked after seven games. He had won just two games in the Championship. Back to Molde and he started of well with a win against Celtic in the Europa league, and even managed to finish first in the group that also included Ajax and Fenerbahce. In the Norwegian league, they would finish sixth. In his first full season back in charge he would go on to finish in fifth place after a season filled with the ups and downs most united fans have now witnessed. Including a run of six games in which he won just one, losing all five of the others. In 2017, a season that was once again mixed, he recorded just one win in seven, but then recorded just one lose in nine. Six of which were wins. This season would see them finish second, seven points behind the winners, Rosenborg. In 2018, it was much the same story. Varying runs of form saw just three wins in eight, but then five wins in a row. Once again, he would finish in second place. On Dec 3rd Molde announced that he had extended his contract until 2021...he left them to be caretaker of us a little over two weeks later.
As you can see, Ole has never been a top manager. Hes been a middle of road manager everywhere hes gone with ups and downs. Mostly downs outside of Molde, but with some big wins in the Europa league, including a one nil victory over eventual winners in 2016. Just a shame they lost the first leg three nil. When he took over at United, we were all of us, miserable. Jose had sucked all the joy out of the club. No matter what you think of him as a manger, he had made this place miserable. His sacking had to happen really, is for no other reason then the mental health of all in involved. Ole rode that feel good time hard and got a solid group of wins as caretaker. The problem is, thats all we saw of him. The guy at the top with all the misery packed away in Joses suitcase. So all we really knew about him, was that he could win when things were going well. The Glazers at first said they would consider his role at the end of the season. This would have been sensible. Because, like I said, we had only seen Ole in charge when everyone was happy. We hadnt seen Ole in charge when everyone was miserable. And that is a far more important skill set for a manager to have. Anyone can get a good performance when players are happy, but it takes a good manager to get a tune out of players who are miserable. And Ole showed us all, that he didnt have what it takes early on. The only problem was the Glazers gave him the job full time before we would see just how bad he was at getting players charged up when they werent winning games.
In his three years here, Ole has done fine. Not any better than who come before him. Lets look at the Champions league stats. After eleven champions league games, Ole actually has the most goals out of Jose, LVG and Moyes. But he also has the most goals against. 21 for, and 20 against. Recording just one clean sheet. Hes won five and lost seven. Jose won eight, drew two, lost four. Goals: Twenty for, nine against with seven clean sheets. LVG won two, drew two, lost two. Goals: Seven for, Seven against with two clean sheets. Moyes won five, drew three, lost two. Goals: seventeen for, nine against with five clean sheets. Despite Ole only being in charge for 4.8% of our matches in the CL, he accounts of 13% of total loses as of the 14th of September.
So we know that hes no better than Moyes, LVG or Jose. We know that he has a long history of ups and downs. And we know that watching us has been just as shit over the past year, maybe even longer, as it was under any of the other three. So I ask with all sincerity, how can anyone be surprised that he is this bad?
He doesn't have the experience or know how to manage at this level. Anyone who has played football from a young age remembers how positioning and tactics just got more and more detailed as you moved up through the different age groups, I would bet anything that the level of management required in the Norwegian First division is way lower than that of the PL.
Ole is giving all he has to the club, I don't doubt that but his current level as manager is below the level we're playing at, people have to start admitting this.
Don't think so. In August we did beat Leeds convincingly, but that happen last season too, their style of play away from home suits us. Then we played Southampton, probably had enough chances to win but overall it was not good enough performance. Woeful against Wolves, our unbeaten away record could've ended there easily. Think it's just really case of Ole and staff not being able to get the most out of this team.
He's not a good coach. He never has been. We have a great squad though - a new coach is essential or we're just pissing money away.
And when he is, how on earth did senior figures at the club allow it to continue this long? Even extending his contract this summer? Extendig with his staff? Did this come as a surprise to them? Did they really feel we were on to something?
Because he's willing, but he isn't able.
Plenty of us could want to manage United as we care about the club, and WANT us to do well. Only a select few would actually be ABLE to manage us successful.
He should never have been appointed after his caretaker stint, at best he shouldn't have been renewed last year, when the signs were already there he was out of his depth. He'd laid some decent foundations and worked on the culture, but keeping him around risks undoing all that and going right back to square one. It should have been time to thank him for what he's done, and move on to the next stage of the "project."
Half his trouble, is he's kept his coaching line up, who I have misgivings about as I have no idea what any of them actually DO. At the very least he should have realised he didn't have the skills and appointed a world class assistant (not sure who). This makes me suggest he knows full well he's safe no matter what happens, or he'd have tried to save himself by doing something like that.
Plenty of us could want to manage United as we care about the club, and WANT us to do well. Only a select few would actually be ABLE to manage us successful.
He should never have been appointed after his caretaker stint, at best he shouldn't have been renewed last year, when the signs were already there he was out of his depth. He'd laid some decent foundations and worked on the culture, but keeping him around risks undoing all that and going right back to square one. It should have been time to thank him for what he's done, and move on to the next stage of the "project."
Half his trouble, is he's kept his coaching line up, who I have misgivings about as I have no idea what any of them actually DO. At the very least he should have realised he didn't have the skills and appointed a world class assistant (not sure who). This makes me suggest he knows full well he's safe no matter what happens, or he'd have tried to save himself by doing something like that.
I respectfully but completely disagree. Maguire directly caused three of our four goals. Even if we played the same, you take out Maguire gifting the goals and we don't lose. It is not just me saying it, Rogers played two forwards to specifically target and expose Maguire. He confirmed it in the post match
Even if Ole had the right to gamble with him, Maguire should have been taken off after the first blunder. Saying thay Bailly would have also been horrible has no factual reasoning behind it. He is fit, as opposed to Maguire, and any sub has lack of match fitness but they usually still get the job done. Ole is favoritist. He doesn't sub Maguire or Ronaldo because he thinks they cannot be touched. If it were somebody else playing that badly (say Lindelof) he would have taken him
off and we all know it
Come on Mods this is getting ridiculous, currently 7 threads on the main forums that are all related to Ole out. Can we get them combined?
This truthful take of Ole is as brutal as our football under him.
At some point Ole has to acknowledge the limit of his abilities. Funny how 'imposter syndrome' is often never felt by those who the concept applies to.
You meant "who may be impostors in reality" because Impostor Syndrome doesn't apply to Ole, that syndrome is when you are actually good but are just lacking confidence. He is not good. Not sure it he has confidence, he may just want the job too much even when he realizes he isn't good and is going for "fake it till you make it", except that shit doesn't work in professional sports - things are way too competitive
Good post.
He has always been a poor appointment to begin with who just happened to have a lot of supporters among the fanbase despite not being qualified to begin with. It always surprised people actually rate him but I don't think any top team is going to hire him once he gets sacked from Manchester United.