Fabregas

[Will Absolute]

Right now everybody is absurd, you included. First time in my life I say this in public. feck off!!

Your post was a lot of fun.

Unfortunately some posters think it's the mark of a true fan to abuse anybody who questions the ability of players or the wisdom of management. If they had their way, the Café would be very dull.

The day he left the Oval Office for the last time, Ronald Reagan left a note on his desk for his successor. It read, "Don't let the assholes get you down."

 

[Adam-Utd]

Good God.

We have NOT just put in a frivolous bid for Fabregas for show, or for the press, or to appease the fans. If you think we have you're a fecking idiot.

Bidding £10m under a club's valuation for a player who doesn't want to leave does not show intent and does not appease anyone. We've bid because we want him.

If we were gonna do something for show we would have at least broken our transfer record.

Why would we bid for a player if we know he does not want to join us

He already stated just last month he was happy at Barca, so whats the point?.

 

[elmo]

Is there any chance Barcelona have their eye on another player and are willing to let Cesc go if it means they can get him? Someone like Gundogan maybe? The only way selling Cesc makes sense to me is if they're lining up a replacement.

There were some rumurs that they sold Vila on the cheap to get the first option on Oliver Torres if they were willing to sell him.

 

[Comsmit]

So we bid for a player....and it's strange?

Not ordinarily....although in this case yes it is slightly strange considering the cirrcumstances.

He asked why people are getting paranoid thinking that the club don't have a plan. Hence my response. But you know that anyway.

 

[moses]

Good God.

We have NOT just put in a frivolous bid for Fabregas for show, or for the press, or to appease the fans. If you think we have you're a fecking idiot.

Bidding £10m under a club's valuation for a player who doesn't want to leave does not show intent and does not appease anyone. We've bid because we want him.

If we were gonna do something for show we would have at least broken our transfer record.

Can you discuss these fictions without the insults? It's all just opinion at this point, so to insult one baseless theory while stating your own as fact is silly.

 

[Comsmit]

and we are rectifying by bidding for players.

Yep bidding is fine as long as the end result is worth the hassle. Otherwise it's just a waste of time and reputation.

Lets hope something bears fruit pronto.

 

[Vasey20|13]

Why would we bid for a player if we know he does not want to join us

He already stated just last month he was happy at Barca, so whats the point?.

Not going to argue my point any more.

If you think we're in the business of bidding for players that we don't actually want to either

A) Appease idiotic fans, the kind who are resigned to 6th place because we lost a pre season friendly.
B) Show 'intent' to the media, despite the fact that if it fails we're going to just look even weaker than we already do. Or,
C) Show that we have money to spend, despite the Glazers not giving one flying feck what anyone in this or any other country thinks about them.

Then refer to my previous post. I won't comment any more on this retarded theory.

 

[Comsmit]

Doesn't mean there isn't a plan. It just has 't come to fruition yet. When you're Chief Executive we won't need to worry about this. Can you give us an exclusive into how you'll prepare for the season when you're in charge?

So you are worried then?

 

[Gazza]

I'd believe it if the public pursuit of Fabregas is a tactic to allow United to get on with their real targets. That way even if this approach for Fabregas fails a new midfielder will be announced around the same time. No idea who though.

 

[ciderman9000000]

Why would we bid for a player if we know he does not want to join us?

He already stated just last month he was happy at Barca, so whats the point?.

Obviously United don't believe that Fabregas is being entirely genuine in his statement of intent to stay at Barcelona. Can't you understand that?

Ask yourself your own question...

If United knew that signing Fabregas was impossible then why would they bid for him? It achieves nothing. Obviously then United believe Fabregas as being attainable.

 

[FlawlessThaw]

What would United achieve by bidding for a player even if they knew they weren't going to sign him?

Rationally, nothing you would suppose.

 

[dev1l]

Obviously United don't believe that Fabregas is being entirely genuine in his statement of intent to stay at Barcelona. Can't you understand that?

Ask yourself your own question...

If United knew that signing Fabregas was impossible then why would they bid for him? It achieves nothing. Obviously then United believe Fabregas as being attainable.

And afaik Fabregas did not make that statement to the press, it s just Villanova quoting him.

 

[amolbhatia50k]

What would United achieve by bidding for a player even if they knew they weren't going to sign him?

Rationally, nothing you would suppose.

Of course were not bidding for him knowing we have no chance of getting him.

 

[Comsmit]

Obviously United don't believe that Fabregas is being entirely genuine in his statement of intent to stay at Barcelona. Can't you understand that?

Ask yourself your own question...

If United knew that signing Fabregas was impossible then why would they bid for him? It achieves nothing. Obviously then United believe Fabregas as being attainable.

Must be a RVP tip-off.

 

[ciderman9000000]

I'd believe it if the public pursuit of Fabregas is a tactic to allow United to get on with their real targets. That way even if this approach for Fabregas fails a new midfielder will be announced around the same time. No idea who though.

Do you think United find it difficult to pursue their 'real targets' in the absence of a fake target? What are you talking about?

 

[Sunny Jim]

Not going to argue my point any more.

If you think we're in the business of bidding for players that we don't actually want to either

A) Appease idiotic fans, the kind who are resigned to 6th place because we lost a pre season friendly.
B) Show 'intent' to the media, despite the fact that if it fails we're going to just look even weaker than we already do. Or,
C) Show that we have money to spend, despite the Glazers not giving one flying feck what anyone in this or any other country thinks about them.

Then refer to my previous post. I won't comment any more on this retarded theory.

I disagree with you mate. Explain this: most of our tranfers come out of the blue, we keep'em quiet. Why did leak this one??

Why did we bid well below the market value? Why did we bit after Barca lost Thiago??

 

[Vasey20|13]

Can you discuss these fictions without the insults? It's all just opinion at this point, so to insult one baseless theory while stating your own as fact is silly.

It's been debated over and over and over again.

My opinion isn't a baseless theory, it's common sense. Unless bidding for players that you actually want to buy, despite the fact that the opening bid might fail, is as whacky a theory as us putting in a bid we know 100% will fail just so Mundo Deportivo will make us look like we're trying.

A bid has been made, we're genuinely interested in the player.
A bid has been made, we know it'll fail and is pointless but it's on the back of The Sun so that's good.

^ if those two theories deserve equal weight then i don't know what to say.

 

[Sassy Colin]

The counter/increased offer hasn't materialised yet then?

I can't imagine they've just given up already, perhaps there are discussions going on on the basis of "How much do you want then?", or talking to Fabregas & his agent.

 

[Woodzy]

I can't believe people are opposed to the fact that a) We have a genuine interest in signing Cesc, and b) There's actually a possibility that one of either Barca/Cesc are open to the move happening.

Do I think we will sign him? No. But to suggest this bid made was made without the intent of actually signing the player, is madness.

 

[SteveJ]

No doubt people thought it 'madness' to sell Ince, Hughes & Kanchelskis in one summer; it's was 'bizarre' to expect Leeds idol Eric Cantona to be sold to United; these 'strange' things happened though...

 

[acnumber9]

So you are worried then?

No. What's your plan?

 

[Bape]

Obviously United don't believe that Fabregas is being entirely genuine in his statement of intent to stay at Barcelona. Can't you understand that?

Ask yourself your own question...

If United knew that signing Fabregas was impossible then why would they bid for him? It achieves nothing. Obviously then United believe Fabregas as being attainable.

Nail on the head. We aren't great in the transfer market but it's not like we're mugs either. We've launched a bid so we should assume there's at least some encouragement from their end.

 

[Shimo]

Yep bidding is fine as long as the end result is worth the hassle. Otherwise it's just a waste of time and reputation.

Lets hope something bears fruit pronto.

The only question of whether it's worth the hassle is from us supporters. If they've made the bid then, unless they are completely incompetent, they've put some thought through on why they are willing to make a bid and that would include evaluating if it is worth the hassle to the club.

Outwardly the way we are working does seem weird/bizarre/wonky - because we just don't have all the details. In the end either people believe the club hierarchy is not so inept that they just make bids to appease fans/media and do know what they are doing at somewhat high professional level; or they believe / don't trust the new leadership enough to give them that benefit of the doubt.

 

[acnumber9]

No doubt people thought it 'madness' to sell Ince, Hughes & Kanchelskis in one summer; it's was 'bizarre' to expect Leeds idol Eric Cantona to be sold to United; these 'strange' things happened though...

We only have to go back last summer to see a lot of know alls telling us what couldn't happen.

 

[Red Hand Devil]

Nah


Nah that aint happening RHD, the odds on us getting Ronnie, Bale, Fibreglass and Garrrrrrrrrrrrry are just tooooooooo far fetched. Have you not listened to the knowledgable folk on here? Moyes is panic bidding along with Woodward, we more likely to end up with Titus Bramble, Rory Delap, Paul McShane @(what a return that will be) and scotty too hotty parker

Its a fantasy team man & boys will be boys...

I've been listening to the great knowledgeable folk on here alright Kanie - "dont believe everything you read" is pretty much the moral of the story, but that goes for Transfer Forum posts aswell

 

[moses]

It's been debated over and over and over again.

My opinion isn't a baseless theory, it's common sense. Unless bidding for players that you actually want to buy, despite the fact that the opening bid might fail, is as whacky a theory as us putting in a bid we know 100% will fail just so Mundo Deportivo will make us look like we're trying.

A bid has been made, we're genuinely interested in the player.
A bid has been made, we know it'll fail and is pointless but it's on the back of The Sun so that's good.

^ if those two theories deserve equal weight then i don't know what to say.

Maybe you'd know what to say if you didn't for some reason ignore the point of the post. I even opened the post with it so you wouldn't miss it. And with further reading it seems you were warned last week about insults too.

Most people would regard their opinion as the sensible one too, which is why they hold it. Now with that in mind, stop insulting people you disagree with.

 

[ciderman9000000]

I disagree with you mate. Explain this: most of our tranfers come out of the blue, we keep'em quiet. Why did leak this one??

Not many of our transfers come out of the blue. I don't know why people always say that.

Just from recent years you have RvP, Jones, Powell, Zaha, Valencia, DdG, Berbatov, Rooney, Carrick etc. who were all reported to be occurring long before they might be considered as being out of the blue.

Your argument is bollocks.

 

[devilish]

Good God.

We have NOT just put in a frivolous bid for Fabregas for show, or for the press, or to appease the fans. If you think we have you're a fecking idiot.

Bidding £10m under a club's valuation for a player who doesn't want to leave does not show intent and does not appease anyone. We've bid because we want him.

If we were gonna do something for show we would have at least broken our transfer record.

I dont know what the club had in mind, however by the looks of it, it does look like a retarded plan.

 

[Comsmit]

No. What's your plan?

Plan for what? The rest of the evening?

 

[jojojo]

I'm still looking for anything of significance in the spanish press - they're all much more interested in what Tito said about Guardiola.

The only real quote I've read, and the only one I've seen on TV
"Soy consciente de que Cesc ha recibido ofertas, pero él quiere quedarse porque quiere triunfar aquí", dijo Vilanova. "Su ilusión de siempre es triunfar aquí y estoy tranquilo".

"I know Cesc has received offers, but he wants to stay because he wants to triumph here. His hope has always been to triumph here and I'm content," about that.

That's not new, that's what Cesc said before the Confederations Cup. Publicly, neither Cesc nor Barca have done the, "leave us alone, we're not moving/selling," bit. I don't see that anything today makes it more off (or on) than yesterday.

MD just talks about Cesc's great reputation in England and is running a sell him or not poll
http://www.mundodeportivo.com/20130...ted-por-30-millones-de-euros_54377830447.html

Currently the sell at 30m figure stands at 39%
Ask United for more money figure is 17%
The no sell is at 44%
As votes of confidence go, it's pretty underwhelming.

As I said yesterday, I can't see why we didn't make this bid three weeks ago and I can't see them selling now and leaving themselves low on midfield cover. I do wonder why United left it so late. I hope it's because somebody said something incredibly tactless to Cesc - like "did you see last week's MD poll, they all want you sold and to keep Thiago." I doubt we'll ever get an explanation.

 

[acnumber9]

Plan for what? The rest of the evening?

The question was in the post you quoted previously. What's the plan?

 

[Gazza]

Do you think United find it difficult to pursue their 'real targets' in the absence of a fake target? What are you talking about?

No, I think leaking of a bid for Fabregas doesn't seem to fit with United's preference for secrecy when it comes to transfers. So it could be that they are working on other targets and the Fabregas story is a way of deflecting attention away.

 

[Comsmit]

The only question of whether it's worth the hassle is from us supporters. If they've made the bid then, unless they are completely incompetent, they've put some thought through on why they are willing to make a bid and that would include evaluating if it is worth the hassle to the club.

Outwardly the way we are working does seem weird/bizarre/wonky - because we just don't have all the details. In the end either people believe the club hierarchy is not so inept that they just make bids to appease fans/media and do know what they are doing at somewhat high professional level; or they believe / don't trust the new leadership enough to give them that benefit of the doubt.

Of course. We are what matters. Signings are for us. We pay the entrance fee.

 

[acnumber9]

No, I think leaking of a bid for Fabregas doesn't seem to fit with United's preference for secrecy when it comes to transfers. So it could be that they are working on other targets and the Fabregas story is a way of deflecting attention away.

The only people's attentions it deflects are the fans. I'm sure football people talk amongst themselves. I'd say there few secrets around. What purpose does it serve?

 

[pocco]

Why are Barca fans so keen to see the back of him? Was he that bad? There's more chance of him being a success in Barcas midfield 3 as opposed to our midfield 2.

 

[Vasey20|13]

I disagree with you mate. Explain this: most of our tranfers come out of the blue, we keep'em quiet. Why did leak this one??

Why did we bid well below the market value? Why did we bit after Barca lost Thiago??

Ah yeh good point. That's what'll appease United fans. A week of the papers making out like we're seriously interested in a world class midfielder, who we can then get giddy about, who we then don't sign.

That does a few things - says we ballsed up the Thiago affair and are now clutching at short straws, everyone thinks nobody wants to sign for us, people/the press question Moyes' ability to attract. This then piles even more pressure on United, Moyes and the board to bring in quality, which we eventually probably won't sign anyway, marking this transfer window and Moyes/Woodward's first 2 months in charge a complete and utter failure.

Do you think our PR department and main men behind the scenes are fresh out of university and have been hired despite the fact they haven't got a single clue what they're doing?

It leaked however it leaked. To think that it was purposefully leaked despite guaranteed failure means that you think we're purposefully trying to destroy our reputation. That's why it's a stupid concept.

 

[Gazza]

The only people's attentions it deflects are the fans. I'm sure football people talk amongst themselves. I'd say there few secrets around. What purpose does it serve?

The media.

 

[Red-Man-Walking]

I'm still looking for anything of significance in the spanish press - they're all much more interested in what Tito said about Guardiola.

The only real quote I've read, and the only one I've seen on TV
"Soy consciente de que Cesc ha recibido ofertas, pero él quiere quedarse porque quiere triunfar aquí", dijo Vilanova. "Su ilusión de siempre es triunfar aquí y estoy tranquilo".

"I know Cesc has received offers, but he wants to stay because he wants to triumph here. His hope has always been to triumph here and I'm content," about that.

That's not new, that's what Cesc said before the Confederations Cup. Publicly, neither Cesc nor Barca have done the, "leave us alone, we're not moving/selling," bit. I don't see that anything today makes it more off (or on) than yesterday.

MD just talks about Cesc's great reputation in England and is running a sell him or not poll
http://www.mundodeportivo.com/20130...ted-por-30-millones-de-euros_54377830447.html

Currently the sell at 30m figure stands at 39%
Ask United for more money figure is 17%
The no sell is at 44%
As votes of confidence go, it's pretty underwhelming.

As I said yesterday, I can't see why we didn't make this bid three weeks ago and I can't see them selling now and leaving themselves low on midfield cover. I do wonder why United left it so late. I hope it's because somebody said something incredibly tactless to Cesc - like "did you see last week's MD poll, they all want you sold and to keep Thiago." I doubt we'll ever get an explanation.

Comments:
RedCafe "Nos vemos en Manchester"

Ok, who was it?

 

[redevil2]

Obviously United don't believe that Fabregas is being entirely genuine in his statement of intent to stay at Barcelona. Can't you understand that?

Ask yourself your own question...

If United knew that signing Fabregas was impossible then why would they bid for him? It achieves nothing. Obviously then United believe Fabregas as being attainable.

Sorry if it has been said before (haven't read the whole thread), but read somewhere that RvP and Fabregas share the same agent. The possibility of landing Fabregas rest with how much influence the agent has on the player, perhaps. So yeah, the belief is based on some expectation.

 

[peterstorey]

I'm still looking for anything of significance in the spanish press - they're all much more interested in what Tito said about Guardiola.

The only real quote I've read, and the only one I've seen on TV
"Soy consciente de que Cesc ha recibido ofertas, pero él quiere quedarse porque quiere triunfar aquí", dijo Vilanova. "Su ilusión de siempre es triunfar aquí y estoy tranquilo".

This looked pretty conclusive (and not a rehash of month-old stuff). 'With reference to interest from Manchester United for Fàbregas, Vilanove said that "it is good that other teams want our players. I'm aware that there are offers for Cesc, but I had a conversation with him and he made it clear he does not want to hear about going to other clubs. He knows the competition he has with Xavi, Iniesta and now Sergi Roberto, but he wants to stay. "