Covid Outbreak at Man Utd

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If fans arnt allowed to go to games if they arnt vaccinated then what about players that arnt vaccinated? Why do they get a pass?

Maybe this is why its all hush hush. 4 players positive but then x number are high risk because they are not vaccinated so they call off training asap and keep those players away until they are sure its all clear. Just a theory but its interesting how they treat unvaccinated players differently to general public.
 
UpWithRivers said:
If fans arnt allowed to go to games if they arnt vaccinated then what about players that arnt vaccinated? Why do they get a pass?
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I'd imagine because they should be limited on the amount of people they come into contact with.

Whereas a fan could potentially be exposed to thousands of people.
 
Any update on who the players are? So I can wish them a speedy recovery even if I'm not their biggest fan?
 
UpWithRivers said:
If fans arnt allowed to go to games if they arnt vaccinated then what about players that arnt vaccinated? Why do they get a pass?

Maybe this is why its all hush hush. 4 players positive but then x number are high risk because they are not vaccinated so they call off training asap and keep those players away until they are sure its all clear. Just a theory but its interesting how they treat unvaccinated players differently to general public.
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Because that’s not true? All you need is proof of a negative lateral flow test, of which the players do plenty.
 
The players who are not vaccinated at this stage really need to face severe monetary consequences.
 
I would bet we are one of the least vaccinated squads in the PL and hence most susceptible to problems.
 
Dr. StrangeHate said:
The players who are not vaccinated at this stage really need to face severe monetary consequences.
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Pro choice mate vaccinated or unvaccinated you can still catch covid. Trust me yea don't want to go down vaccine mandatory route.
 
Burkeovic said:
Pro choice mate vaccinated or unvaccinated you can still catch covid. Trust me yea don't want to go down vaccine mandatory route.
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Umbrella or no umbrella you still get wet.

One is a little splash on your shoes and the other leaves you soaked.
 
Vaccinations won't prevent infections, even before omicron.

The PL need to set their guidelines clearly because clubs will try to game the system.
 
Dr. StrangeHate said:
The players who are not vaccinated at this stage really need to face severe monetary consequences.
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Unfortunately being vaccinated doesn't preclude you from catching it and spreading it. People have a profound misunderstanding of vaccines. (not saying you do btw) They contain a small inactive part of the virus which triggers your bodies own immune system response to create B cell and T cell immune responses. This is no different from if you had been infected naturally and created the same response. The only difference is how hard you get hit by it, with a vaccine you personally suffer fewer symptoms than with a full blown infection.

Really at this point, with the majority of the country already having had covid getting a vaccine, or all 3 makes absolutely no difference between passing on the virus. The reason we're seeing more cases now, isn't because people aren't vaccinated against it it's because the latest variant has had to become more transmissible to survive. Because, even if players were vaccinated they would still catch it and pass it on and test positive (so we'd be in the same situation) the only difference would be their own personal symptoms. The rate of transmission doesn't change.

Again, I feel like how vaccines work is misunderstood. It's artificially jump starting your bodies own anit-bodies to create an immune response. No different from if you have caught the virus and created these anti-bodies yourself and it does not alter the rate of transmission or provide any protection against catching the virus. It's purely for your own protection.
 
kouroux said:
Talking about those side effects, we need to acknowledge them into our criticism of players if they do not play well (for instance Pogba kept getting destroyed last season after having returned from Covid). As a fanbase, we need to be more understanding
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This is true, but the decision makers that decide to play them in that condition are fair game.
 
iHicksy said:
Unfortunately being vaccinated doesn't preclude you from catching it and spreading it. People have a profound misunderstanding of vaccines. (not saying you do btw) They contain a small inactive part of the virus which triggers your bodies own immune system response to create B cell and T cell immune responses. This is no different from if you had been infected naturally and created the same response. The only difference is how hard you get hit by it, with a vaccine you personally suffer fewer symptoms than with a full blown infection.

Really at this point, with the majority of the country already having had covid getting a vaccine, or all 3 makes absolutely no difference between passing on the virus. The reason we're seeing more cases now, isn't because people aren't vaccinated against it it's because the latest variant has had to become more transmissible to survive. Because, even if players were vaccinated they would still catch it and pass it on and test positive (so we'd be in the same situation) the only difference would be their own personal symptoms. The rate of transmission doesn't change.

Again, I feel like how vaccines work is misunderstood. It's artificially jump starting your bodies own anit-bodies to create an immune response. No different from if you have caught the virus and created these anti-bodies yourself and it does not alter the rate of transmission or provide any protection against catching the virus. It's purely for your own protection.
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I'm sure the vaccine also lowers your chance of transmitting it as well.
 
Infections are just one part of the problem.

Isn't it the case that isolation rules for non vaccinated are different so we could lose players who haven't even tested positive for 10 days because of their contacts (eg. their partner at home)?
 
Solius said:
I'm sure the vaccine also lowers your chance of transmitting it as well.
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Correct - if that person has never had the virus. Not true for the majority of the populous.

The issue is the media have been using the term unvaccinated, when really what they should be saying is uninfected and unvaccinated. Transmissibility between vaccinated and someone who has had covid is the same between those two groups. It jumps to 65% when compared with those groups vs unvaxed, uninfected. (E.g someone with no antibodies). Again, all a vaccine does is trigger your own natural antibodies, the same as if you had been infected. There's no magical component making you less transmissible, because it's just your own antibodies being created against the inactive part of the virus. It doesn't give you some artificially applied internal shield against transmission, because such a thing doesn't exist within the human body. The vaccine can only trigger your own immune response. Again, no different to if you had caught it and recovered. (except for your own symptoms)

It's arguable that you actually have better immunity from catching covid because your immune response is more complete rather than targeted. We have vaccines to get ahead of the curve for the vulnerable. E.g The potentially previously uninfected in nursing homes or people with an underlying health condition which covid could exasperate.
 
RedDevilRoshi said:
As there are going to be fans travelling from around the globe for this game, I hope they don’t leave it too late and make an announcement asap if this game is going ahead or not.
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That's one of the last things they will worry about, quite rightly. There's a global pandemic. The chance the game is called off late due to COVID should be priced in to your decision making.
 
iHicksy said:
Unfortunately being vaccinated doesn't preclude you from catching it and spreading it. People have a profound misunderstanding of vaccines. (not saying you do btw) They contain a small inactive part of the virus which triggers your bodies own immune system response to create B cell and T cell immune responses. This is no different from if you had been infected naturally and created the same response. The only difference is how hard you get hit by it, with a vaccine you personally suffer fewer symptoms than with a full blown infection.

Really at this point, with the majority of the country already having had covid getting a vaccine, or all 3 makes absolutely no difference between passing on the virus. The reason we're seeing more cases now, isn't because people aren't vaccinated against it it's because the latest variant has had to become more transmissible to survive. Because, even if players were vaccinated they would still catch it and pass it on and test positive (so we'd be in the same situation) the only difference would be their own personal symptoms. The rate of transmission doesn't change.

Again, I feel like how vaccines work is misunderstood. It's artificially jump starting your bodies own anit-bodies to create an immune response. No different from if you have caught the virus and created these anti-bodies yourself and it does not alter the rate of transmission or provide any protection against catching the virus. It's purely for your own protection.
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I am coming from the side of isolation rules being different for vaccinated Vs not vaccinated. They are different for public so should be different for players as well.

If we are having to isolate and cancel matches due to non vaccinated players isolation rules then the PL should make us play the reserves because it is the club's fault. But we don't know the full details.
 
Would they have deep cleaned Carrington or the part the first team and coaches use so that is why they couldn't go in anyway?
 
DomesticTadpole said:
Would they have deep cleaned Carrington or the part the first team and coaches use so that is why they couldn't go in anyway?
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Yeah I heard they had to tent over Phil on the treatment table, like the scene from E.T. when the FBI come to Elliot's house, and they've done a deep clean around him. Poor bugger.
 
So many misunderstand the vaccines. I always see dumb analogies on my social media with things like "If someone gave you scissors that didnt cut anything, would you advise others to buy them? NO!"

A more fitting analogy would be along the lines of having someone stand in front of you, smack them hard over the head with a steel bat. Their skull could be cracked, they have a brain bleed and die. Stick a helmet on the next person and hit them hard over the head with a steel bat. They have a sore head sure, but not a cracked skull and survive. They still suffer a bit because of the hit to head. Would they tell everyone not to wear a helmet cos they still got hit and it hurt?"
 
Burkeovic said:
Pro choice mate vaccinated or unvaccinated you can still catch covid. Trust me yea don't want to go down vaccine mandatory route.
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I love how anti-vax is now called pro-choice.

I've yet to encounter an intelligent person who is 'pro-choice'... sadly even some of my (distant) relatives are of this persuasion. The common theme? They are not very bright. At all.
 
Chris-Red said:
So many misunderstand the vaccines. I always see dumb analogies on my social media with things like "If someone gave you scissors that didnt cut anything, would you advise others to buy them? NO!"

A more fitting analogy would be along the lines of having someone stand in front of you, smack them hard over the head with a steel bat. Their skull could be cracked, they have a brain bleed and die. Stick a helmet on the next person and hit them hard over the head with a steel bat. They have a sore head sure, but not a cracked skull and survive. They still suffer a bit because of the hit to head. Would they tell everyone not to wear a helmet cos they still got hit and it hurt?"
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People need to understand that there aren't many 100% guarantees in life (for instance death is one of them) so this need to have a 100% success rate before getting the shot makes no sense
 
iHicksy said:
Unfortunately being vaccinated doesn't preclude you from catching it and spreading it. People have a profound misunderstanding of vaccines. (not saying you do btw) They contain a small inactive part of the virus which triggers your bodies own immune system response to create B cell and T cell immune responses. This is no different from if you had been infected naturally and created the same response. The only difference is how hard you get hit by it, with a vaccine you personally suffer fewer symptoms than with a full blown infection.

Really at this point, with the majority of the country already having had covid getting a vaccine, or all 3 makes absolutely no difference between passing on the virus. The reason we're seeing more cases now, isn't because people aren't vaccinated against it it's because the latest variant has had to become more transmissible to survive. Because, even if players were vaccinated they would still catch it and pass it on and test positive (so we'd be in the same situation) the only difference would be their own personal symptoms. The rate of transmission doesn't change.

Again, I feel like how vaccines work is misunderstood. It's artificially jump starting your bodies own anit-bodies to create an immune response. No different from if you have caught the virus and created these anti-bodies yourself and it does not alter the rate of transmission or provide any protection against catching the virus. It's purely for your own protection.
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The COVID vaccines are mRNA Vaccines. They do not contain COVID. They contain the proteins to fight COVID.

Researchers and scientists around the world are working to develop a potential COVID-19 vaccine. Given the urgency of the pandemic, strong partnership across the research and healthcare community is vital, using our scientific knowledge, people and resources to tackle the COVID-19 outbreak.

Pfizer is collaborating with German biotech company BioNTech to focus on a technology called an mRNA vaccine.3 Unlike conventional vaccines, which are produced using weakened forms of the virus,4 RNA vaccines can be constructed quickly using only the pathogen’s genetic code.5

Many standard vaccines work by injecting a dead or weakened form of the pathogen into the body in preparations that are designed not to make you sick but rather to build immunity. The key to building this immunity is that the portion of the pathogen called the antigen trains the immune system to recognise and respond to the infectious agent.5

RNA vaccines work by introducing into the body a messenger RNA (mRNA) sequence that contains the genetic instructions for the vaccinated person’s own cells to produce the vaccine antigens and generate an immune response.

https://www.pfizer.co.uk/news-and-featured-stories/behind-science-what-is-an-mrna-vaccine
 
M4YON said:
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So last nights game is off but we can resume full training the day after? I'd be making an enquiry if i was Brentford just to make sure there wasn't anything silly going on over the postponement
 
Solius said:
Umbrella or no umbrella you still get wet.

One is a little splash on your shoes and the other leaves you soaked.
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Thank you for saying this, I don't know how this is a difficult concept to grasp.
 
arnie_ni said:
So last nights game is off but we can resume full training the day after? I'd be making an enquiry if i was Brentford just to make sure there wasn't anything silly going on over the postponement
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The cancellation was due to the fact the training ground was shut all Monday so we had no time to prepare for the game.
 
Burkeovic said:
Pro choice mate vaccinated or unvaccinated you can still catch covid. Trust me yea don't want to go down vaccine mandatory route.
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Kimmich at Bayern was one of a number of players who had their wages cut because they had to isolate as the result of a contact, while deciding not to get vaccinated. Kimmich has more recently tested positive and is struggling to return to fitness - and intends to get vaccinated.
 
I think the problem is that the unvaccinated players need to self isolate for 10 days. Right? The vaccinated players can carry on. So it depends how many are unvaccinated. if its 50 percent of first team then thats going to impact our results massively. If we play at Brighton the players missing wont necessarily have Covid. They will be in isolation.
 
UnitedSofa said:
RNA vaccines work by introducing into the body a messenger RNA (mRNA) sequence that contains the genetic instructions for the vaccinated person’s own cells to produce the vaccine antigens and generate an immune response.
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Regardless, the result is the same - to generate an immune response.
 
arnie_ni said:
So last nights game is off but we can resume full training the day after? I'd be making an enquiry if i was Brentford just to make sure there wasn't anything silly going on over the postponement
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I don’t think that’s grounds to enquire. We had to wait for all the tests to come back - and I wouldn’t be surprised if some people were PCR’ed a second time yesterday in case there were any doubt when they interacted with someone who was positive from Sunday/Monday.

We postponed the game on Monday. PCRs in progress. Probably had results for everyone or so yesterday. Training can resume today for those with negative tests.
 
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